14 Amazing Photos Of 1980s New York City

The amazing Steven Siegel has been documenting New York City's five boroughs (and beyond) for three decades now. Click through for a small sampling of his photos from the 1980s, where you'll see abandoned cars overlooking the Brooklyn Bridge, a very desolate Bushwick, and even a massive hole in the Manhattan Bridge pedestrian walkway. He recently told 12 oz. Prophet:

I’ve been photographing the streets and subways of New York for the past 30 years. When young people today look at my shots from the 1980’s, they are aghast. To them, New York of the 1980’s is almost unrecognizable. And they are right.

Some older people are nostalgic for “the good old days.” For example, they remember the Times Square of the 80’s… And what they remember is not so much the danger but the grittiness and (for lack of a better word) the authenticity. Yes, there was sleaze, but there were also video arcades, cheap movies, restaurants, and weird places. These same people resent the “Disney-ification” of Times Square and the gentrification of virtually all of Manhattan and many areas of the boroughs, and the loss of cheap housing and local stores everywhere.

Of course, others’ reactions to these same photos could not be more different. If they’re over a certain age, they remember the high crime, the twin crises of AIDS and crack, the racial tension, the lurid tabloid headlines about the latest street crime. They say: It was a nightmare, and thank God it’s over. And for people in their twenties who have a negative reaction to these old photos, their reaction is often expressed as: How (or why) would people live here (assuming they had a choice)?

Of course, both views are right.

We hope to share some more photos from Siegel's massive collection soon, so stay tuned, nostalgia freaks.

Contact the author of this article or email tips@gothamist.com with further questions, comments or tips.

By Jen Carlson in Arts & Entertainment on January 18, 2012 2:50 PM

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WesternQueensLand

Amazing times pass/
Memories give meaning/
To the woe that left/
#haiku

stafford gregoire

Amazing times pass/
Memories give meaning/
To the woe that left/
#haiku @wqueens7:twitter

chlyn

Wow, last photo is of D'Annunzio! "Can you make a shoe smell?"

WordAndReason

The photos are great. They spark a lot of memories for me. For others they seem to become a point of departure to hate everything about it in this period. Most of the comments taken as a whole are what really illustrate the New York City ethos. The folks who like to pretend all of the horrors were constant and everywhere really need to check that myth at the door. It was bad but It was also amazing. Like always. The 'Taxi Driver' comparison is right in places, but hardly what the whole city was like. Don't trust movies or brochures. NYC ain't that neat and simple, and definitely not small enough to know in two hours, despite what any tourist or shill for a travel office blog writes about it.

Damien1983

Seems to me all the people missed the "grit" are all middle class white tourists, that could go home whenever things got too intense. Anyone that actually was stuck living here at the time with no options welcomes the changes.

Robin Ramistella

I used to tell people that if you wanted to know how bad things were getting in NYC (now it's how bad things were in NYC), go see TAXI DRIVER.

dd7

Taxi driver takes place and was made in the 1970s, not the 1980s.

uberzete

New York circa the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory fire was so authentic; those were the good old days. If you don't know what I'm talking about you're probably a Middle America Transplant Hipster Fuck. And if you do know what I'm talking about you're still probably a Middle America Transplant Hipster Fuck.

BRING BACK 1911 NEW YORK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

stefan_pokorny

NYC in the 70-80's was beautiful and full of creativity....yeah you had to be tough to hang out in Central Park or Washington square park or the Band Shell...you had to have "street smarts" you had to know when to back off and when to square up and fight...but people were "real" the City was "real" and it was full of possibilities, rents were cheap, so artists and musicians could migrate to the city, and out of that came great music and art, the City was full of wonderful and interesting happenings, things that are legendary now even mythical...I grew up in Manhattan...now Manhattan is like a big office, an outdoor Mall...gone are the little Mom and Pop shops, the beautiful weird people, the nuttiness...but they will always remain in our memories, and they are some of the most beautiful memories, some sad, some heartbreaking, but that is Life in a world when it is real, a gritty world, like the wild west that it was in parts, carnival in others, not a sanitized pre-packaged one

stefan_pokorny

NYC in the 70-80's was beautiful and full of creativity....yeah you had to be tough to hang out in Central Park or Washington square park or the Band Shell...you had to have "street smarts" you had to know when to back off and when to square up and fight...but people were "real" the City was "real" and it was full of possibilities, rents were cheap, so artists and musicians could migrate to the city, and out of that came great music and art, the City was full of wonderful and interesting happenings, things that are legendary now even mythical...I grew up in Manhattan...now Manhattan is like a big office, an outdoor Mall...gone are the little Mom and Pop shops, the beautiful weird people, the nuttiness...but they will always remain in our memories, and they are some of the most beautiful memories, some sad, some heartbreaking, but that is Life in a world when it is real, a gritty world, like the wild west that it was in parts, carnival in others, not a sanitized pre-packaged one

stefan_pokorny

NYC in the 70-80's was beautiful and full of creativity....yeah you had to be tough to hang out in Central Park or Washington square park or the Band Shell...you had to have "street smarts" you had to know when to back off and when to square up and fight...but people were "real" the City was "real" and it was full of possibilities, rents were cheap, so artists and musicians could migrate to the city, and out of that came great music and art, the City was full of wonderful and interesting house parties, gallery shows, clubs, happenings, things that are legendary now even mythical...I grew up in Manhattan...now Manhattan is like a big office, an outdoor Mall...gone are the little Mom and Pop shops, the beautiful weird people, the nuttiness...but they will always remain in our memories, and they are some of the most beautiful memories, some sad, some heartbreaking, but that is Life in a world when it is real, a gritty world, like the wild west that it was insome parts, carnival land in others, not a sanitized pre-packaged one that is has become...

stefan_pokorny

eNYC in the 70-80's was beautiful and full of creativity....yeah you had to be tough to hang out in Central Park or Washington square park or the Band Shell...you had to have "street smarts" you had to know when to back off and when to square up and fight...but people were "real" the City was "real" and it was full of possibilities, rents were cheap, so artists and musicians could migrate to the city, and out of that came great music and art, the City was full of wonderful and interesting happenings, things that are legendary now even mythical...I grew up in Manhattan...now Manhattan is like a big office, an outdoor Mall...gone are the little Mom and Pop shops, the beautiful weird people, the nuttiness...but they will always remain in our memories, and they are some of the most beautiful memories, some sad, some heartbreaking, but that is Life in a world when it is real, a gritty world, like the wild west that it was in parts, carnival in others, not a sanitized pre-packaged one...

Boomer15

Eh, I feel like we're over-romanticizing these photos. New York was a sh*thole. Maybe it was cheaper, but it was also more dangerous and unsanitary. When my Mother was my age, she was the sole witness to a homicide/suicide, was held up at gunpoint, and got tuberculosis. I'm okay with the gentrification.

therealdeal80

dupreesparadise.........states this about South Bronx ......

"Furthermore, with likely over 90% of the residents of this neighborhood in section 8, "

That says it all ..........GET OFF YOU ASS AND GET MY TAXES YOU LAZY FUCKS !!!

DM

Wow! People here have no idea what the hell urban slums, ghettoes, and gentrification really even mean. Amazing.

Kitty Kowalski

I think the longing for "The Old New York" is mainly a reaction to the artists and counter-culture that made it vibrant being driven out by corporate chains and "Sex and The City" wannabes. I was born and raised here, and remember driving through the South Bronx in the 70s with the doors lock and the alarm INSIDE the car. No one wants that, but wouldn't the middle and creative classes in New York still be nice? Times Square was dangerous and exciting at the same time. You can have both and have it not be awful. When I loved on my own there in the early 80s, with squeegee men, the advent of crack, and all the things I don't want back, there were graffiti artists, breakdancers, musicians, and poets all over downtown doing their thing on the streets. Now it's a nuiscance, or you need a permit. I could do without the muggings, but somewhere in between, where should be affordable neighborhoods somewhere on the island of Manhattan below 136th street.

@TuraLura - I agree - I liked the Darwinian aspect of "The Old New York". It really was survival of the fittest, not survival of the richest.

StedyRuckus

Serioulsy, though, NYC in the 1910's. Shit was mad gritty then, and mad real. When the LES was really the LES. Dem was the days.
Everyone talking about how awesome the 80's were are just nostalgic for their youth.

DrSysz

I think you're missing the point. NYC in the 80s SUCKED....but we loved it, because it was NYC. The city now is sort of like the real NYC after a lobotomy, a lot of plastic surgery, and a trick suit - you could run it as a Republican presidential candidate but it doesn't resemble the city I was born in or my great grandparents immigrated to..... NYC in the 70s SUCKED - but it was still NYC - a place not only immeasurably more exciting and free then than today, but far far more unique.

(btw - the 70s and the 80s sucked in general and everyone thought so at the time....they just sucked SO much less than now.....)

NYC was a place in which seething factions of working/poor people from wildly opposing ethnic groups fought it out for 150 years - cutting a series of deals with each other and with the WASP elite but maintaining NY as a city of the streets. Sometime in the 1990s the money people took over completely and began to transform the entire city into the theme park you see today. NYC still has the unique ethnic diversity, but it was a fundamentally different place then - much more wild and unruly and fun. In the end the the suits won.....feh.....

Douche_McGee

I watched Taxi Driver the other day (I was 1 when it came out) and remebered a lot of that NYC g5tittiness. It's crazy how much the city has changed.

Scott

There were some really cool things about the 80s in New York... Blondie at CBGB's... Soft White Underbellies (Blue Oyster Cult) at L'amour... getting into the bleachers at Shea for a buck... buying fake ID in the Village, and all the bars taking it even though they knew where I got it (Butterfly)... getting a bagel with a schmear and black coffee for a buck, or a buttered roll for a quarter at the Chock Full o'Nuts... never paying for the subway because everyone learned to jump the turnstiles as soon as they were tall enough... and the aforementioned nudie booths with no glass, complete with the small handwritten sign which read, "no pussy touching."

Then there were the dead bodies in the subway... the rapists in Central Park... getting shot in the head if you stopped for a red light in Arverne... being chased by groups of kids with knives chanting "Howard Beach"... the city putting decals of windows on burned out buildings to make them look nicer... and the gangs that wandered around with guns in their belts because they knew the cops were too afraid of them to do anything...

Yeah, New York in the 80s had character, but I'll take today, thanks.

Marian63

As a reporter for a shoestring news operation in the late 70s/early 80s, I traveled around the city via subway, and I feel I've seen most of these scenes, or ones like them. It was horrible - I don't think I realized exactly how horrible.There were many times I was scared, and I'm a native NYCer who doesn't scare easily.

I wish we could have found a middle ground between this era and the current era of what I think of as suburbanization - Hollister (or Abercrombie? not sure) on lower Broadway, Nike on East 57th Street -- and kept NYC's unique character while making neighborhoods better and safer for those who lived there.

Thanos

Awwww the good ol' days. Porn shops at every corner, Crack was a citywide epidemic, and the art community expressed themselves in any way they saw fit. Now back to the current. The fare is $2.25, every corner has a duane reade, and more and more the ghettos of the 5 boroughs are feeding into consumerism as the neighborhood converts to a yuppie store front on 5th avenue. Yes, Yes the American Dream, every body lives it, but they're to blind to see.

Eddie Brannan

This is the north side of Houston between Crosby (visible in background) and Lafayette.

Terry Tolkin

The guy in the wheelchair called himself "WarEd". He was a fixture at that F train station which was right around the corner from where I lived at the time on Bond St. I bought him sandwichs from nearby Stevens Deli for years before he suddenly disappeared about 1985. Ed Koch, we hardly knew ye...

Cassady_Nippleson

Damn....Terry Tolkin...don't be a stranger....

Terry Tolkin

...lol!...I'm still a stranger to myself Cass...what have you been up to for the last 30 years or so?

Cassady_Nippleson

Spent some time with WarEd and the other refugees licking our wounds and sticking voodoo pins in Ed Koch dolls....had a few drinks.....the more recent years will have to wait until the statute of limitations have passed though....

Seriously we never met to my memory (not that that means much really...) but I hope you'll continue to post here and help fill in some of the brain ellipses from years gone by......peace....

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You don't miss the gritty old New York you see in these pictures, you miss the glory days of your youth that took place there - They're two different things. Anybody living in New York now is having just as much fun, enjoying just as much culture and having just as valid experiences, just 30 years later. And in another 30 years from now they'll miss the "Old New York" that they knew.

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bobloblawslawblog

By the way, there are a lot of awesome "gritty" cities in the US that have tons of space to develop your "art". I have friends in Detroit, Cincinnati, and Pittsburgh. They all talk about how much space they have, how "gritty" the city is, and how there are opportunities abounding for smart people willing to work hard.

I've also visited all of my friends in those cities, and there is often more energy in pockets there than in NYC these days, partly because people apart from the rich are able to devote time to working on exciting projects and not just dead-end jobs.

Don't get me wrong - those cities will never be New York, but if you want something "Real" and "Gritty" (and affordable), you should look elsewhere.

bobloblawslawblog

I grew up in NYC and remember the 1980s quite well (and many of these photos bring back the memories). I can't think of a single one of my "real" New Yorker friends who actually miss the 1980s NYC; we all talk about what a shithole the city was back then.

cetriche

Americans/New Yorkers have also become more materialistic. I suppose there was a time when all you needed was a pen/paintbrush and a clean change of underwear. Now you need a laptop, smartphone, internet, you need to take off work to buy tickets to see your favorite band because they're going to sell out if you don't dedicate your entire morning to logging in to ticketmaster....

There are still those magical moments, but finding yourself in the right place at the right time is nearly impossible given we all have to work 14 hours a day to pay our rent...but in all fairness, who here in this discussion would leave the city to live somewhere else?

Steven Drescher

Alright, I'm not sure if anyone else has realized but just about every city in America has gone through the same changes that NY has. I'm tired of hearing about how NY "lost its authenticity." A lot of it has to do with how corporations are flooding every city with the same crap. In the 70's and 80's there were not Gaps and Starbucks on every corner in every city.

Michael McTague

new york in the 80's was free, smelled like urine and dangerous if you were stupid. but t'was free.
now it's a jewish rich enclave, stifled like israel and as phony as disneyland. no urine smell, little mafia order, the cops had a sense of balance; not the fun it once was. Next stop Detroit?

Tony Reyes

70's, 80's NYC was gutty, gritty, a mile a minute, high octaine, walk fast, talk fast, move fast, brutally honest, straigh foward, cut thru the musturd, great story tellers, cooky characters, allowed to make money, big hearted, tough love, caring, over the top, a buzz in the air, the streets had electricty, their was a vibe everywhere, you were never bored & it was all free. AND I MISS IT SOOO MUCH. Now its bland, corparate, plastic, robotic, wishy washy, laidback, not as unique as it was once before, what u see here, u see pretty much anywhere else in other big cities. it's dull, crass, expensive & boring just like our Mayor Mike Bloombergs personality. he pretty much swept away NYisms down the hudson river..

Relaxasaurus

Probably not what you want to hear but people move to the city not necessarily to have an awesome living space, but for the experience and commute. If I'm spending too much time in my apt I look at that as a bad sign.

And yes my apt is shitty, but not overpriced.

Relaxasaurus

Well this doesn't belong here... should be nested under one of cetriche's ranty posts

Tony Reyes

NY is not NY anymore..

J

There was a quote published in a NY paper in the 1860's that went something like this, "How could I love New York? It's a different city every two decades." (Sorry can't find the original)

cary

You should checkout the original article on 12ozProphet, and Steve's video work that is posted on the post. This article is cool and all, but kind of loses the essence of why the body of work is so great to look at. It wasn't just what he captured, but the point of views that were evoked and eventually evolved in his work is quite impressive to view.

http://www.12ozprophet.com/ind...

BottomlessChips

Cool pics.

Does anyone know: Would linking to photos that aren't yours without more than a credit, no compensation, be legal under SOPA? Just curious.

cyncity.org

That's the "great" thing about SOPA...it doesn't matter! Kill site first, fight and lose later!

Lust Demented

Yeah - it wasn't as cool as you think. More annoying than now, since there were more problems, some seriously depressing sh!t. Still those are some great shots.

Manny Morales

By the way, that photo taken in front of Ezra Cohen is actually on the corner of Grand and Allen St. Not the Bowery.

Derek Dudek

yea man im good without getting robbed and harassed by homeless people, except now its yuppies doing the harrassing, whatever the city moves on...

dogbertt

Can't believe people are nostalgic for this shit.

MarquisdeLafayette

Hahahaha, the amount of posturing and feather-fluffing in these comments is hilarious.

Emmily_Litella

Except for subway grafitti and some things on the music scene, it wasnt all that great. We felt like we just missed out on the 60’s. Now THOSE were the great days (and I mean post 1965). right?

William Dunleavy

cool here's 80 photos of old ny http://superchief.tv/80-photos...

whitecastlerock

Nothing amazing about the photos. Someone just managed to capture the carnage at the right time...

Matthew Rader

IN THIS THREAD: HATERS HATING

cyncity.org

Gothamist- Go Over There Haters and Misers [is] Starting Trouble LMAAAooooo awful English....sorry, let's try again. Gothamist- Get Over The Hate and Make It Something Terrific...

cyncity.org

I am always looking for pictures like these. Thanks gothamist for the heads up.

evbo

I moved to the UWS fresh out of college @ the end of 1982. The neighborhood was in the beginning throes of gentrification but still ... if you looked long enough, you could always scare up a good deal on an apartment. That's the only way I was able to move here in the first place.

When I first moved to W. 85th St., my monthly rent was $425. For a 2-bedroom, rent-stabilized tenement walkup. That I split w/a roommate. And yes, it was legal. Our names were on the lease. So even tho I only made $11,500/year, I could actually afford to have a life -- movies, the occasional night out w/friends -- after paying my rent. Sadly, those days are gone forever.

dupreesparadise

@evbo: your story and the numbers you cite sound familiar. did you post your story in a comment to one of the new york times blogs a few months ago? i remember reading that comment and wondering just how much higher the cost of living can get relative to stagnating wages before our society simply collapses.

evbo

No, that wasn't me. And yes, I wonder the same thing.

If anyone's interested, I had to move out of my cheap apartment roughly 5 years later. I lived on the top floor. The door to the roof was broken, and the landlord never bothered to fix it. My neighbor down the hall was a crack dealer & there were people coming & going all hours of the day & night. The final straw for me was when I came home one night to find a fresh, steaming pile of human shit at the foot of the stairs to the roof (and right next to my apartment). Good times.

pleasenocalls

I afford to have that life in park slope on $15,000 a year, probably tighter than you had but not too bad.

cetriche

exactly. It's not that New York is expensive, it's that New York is almost non-liveable unless you make millions....

kevd

"unless you make millions...."
That's completely f'ing insane and not in anyway true.

cetriche

Ok, millions is an exaggeration. A standard living wage in this city, if you're completely independent, is nearly impossible when you first graduate from college, or even 4 years after. The average college graduate starts out less than 40K, factor in $800-$1000 a month in rent plus $500 in student loans, and you end up having to max out 3 credit cards just to afford a metrocard and a bagel that lasts you breakfast, lunch and dinner. We wonder why the economy is in the shitter, it's because one of the biggest consumer groups has no disposable income. I've lived here 6 years, ranked pretty high at my company, and still my parents co-sign my apartment. I know I'm not alone.

kevd

In 12 years on this city I still haven't paid $800/month in rent.

cetriche

Of course you haven't, cheap, nice apartments do exists. I got lucky this last time around and found a sweet place in Greenpoint (where my heart is) However, we're the lucky outliers. When you look at what the average price is for a studio now, compare it with entry-level salary, vs what it was 30 years ago compared to entry-level salary, you'll find that things have changed, and not for the better. My first apartment was with 3 roommates in Harlem and I paid $400 a month. I had to move out one morning when the bathroom ceiling caved in while I was on the toilet...nuff said.

kevd

Oh, my apts have never been 'nice.' And there have always been roommates.

DrSysz

You realize that 50 years ago no one here over the age of 22 lived with "roomates" unless that was a euphemism for boyfriend or unless the folks on the floor next to you in the crashpad warranted the fancy name....

People in their 30s with fancy degrees forced to live like in dorms?? That wasn't NYC at all....Glad you're getting by though.

kevd

They're only gone if you insist on living on the UWS (or its many, many equivalents).

cetriche

That's not true. I've lived in the outer parts of Brooklyn on my modest salary, and still find it challenging to make ends meet. Any place in New York, unless it's a rodent infested place 30 minutes from the subway, is completely overpriced. You can find good deals, but they're rare and competitive...

kevd

While rents increases have certainly outpaced inflation across the city, there definitely are still some neighborhoods in NY City - less than 30 minutes from a subway. I live in one.

9 times out of 10 when I hear people complain about rent here, it's because they can't afford to live in whatever hip or desirable neighborhood they like most.

I'm not saying there aren't sacrifices to make. I'm just saying that those days are not gone forever.

cetriche

True, you can find a nice place, but they really are rare. When you apartment hunt and plan on spending less than $2000 in rent, you expect to find a shithole. And if you do end up finding a place in your desirable whitewashed neighborhood that you can afford, the management company treats your unit like the red-headed stepchild because they know they can find someone to replace you immediately. Simply because you're paying less in rent does not mean your rights as a tenant should be violated.

kevd

You and I clearly have very different ideas of what "a shit hole" is. I could find a non-shit hole tomorrow for way less than that.

Harrison Bender

Kind of a fallacy to think that these two views aren't incompatible, but whatever.

Anyway, if you think that NYC is sterile, full of chains, etc., you should check out literally everywhere else.

cetriche

True, 30 years ago chains weren't so ubiquitous in America. We can't blame New York for that...

cetriche

so true. it's not just New York. Even Portland has lost it's edge...

dogbertt

Portland never had edge to lose, compadre.

Tim Osman

You might say America has lost its edge

cetriche

I don't know about that. Burger King delivers now.

Tim Osman

I think that pretty much seals it

canofpeas

No hipster mascu-feminists in the 80s... NYU and it's students from the 1% didn't own the LES. Loved the hard core city back then.

Lavon Rick

and this is supposed to make me nostalgic?....

aleXander hirka

Born here. Lived here in the 80s. Went away for a while - just moved
back last year. It's still imperfect - it's still amazing.
Was it better in the past? Go see Woody Allen's "Midnight In Paris".
As to other cities - well, Neil Simon's quote sums it up for me:
"When its 100 degrees in New York, it's 72 in Los Angeles. When its 30
degrees in New York, in Los Angeles it's still 72. However, there are 6
million interesting people in New York, and 72 in Los Angeles."
It all depends what you're looking for, and what you're willing to do (and put up with) to get/have it. Same as always.

kevd

Sadly, he's over shooting the mark by about 1,000% with that 6 million interesting people in New York.
Still way more than anywhere else i've seen, though.

(love that line, and have used it without proper attribution many, many times)

cetriche

Agree, all cities have their baggage, but no place quite like this one

Tim Osman

New York was a festering shithole in many ways back then but damnit it was our festering shithole!

Derek Dudek

its definitely still a festering shithole

Tim Osman

Yes but now there are bike lanes!

cetriche

I think the thing that bothers me about New York is that so much rips a hole in your pocket and you get absolute shit. You spend over half your income on rent, to have your apartment infested by bedbugs because as Disney-fied as we think this city is, slum-fucks are still in power. If I'm going to pay yuppy white-guy prices, I want yuppy white-guy quality, not a door that falls off the hinges and non-working heat.

SPsGhost

Feel free to move to Washington DC then.

matthew731

Really? I sure pay a lot for my place in DC, shitty heat and all. And I don't think that the recent waterfall from the third floor through to the basement was supposed to happen. Plenty of slum-fucks around here too.

Relaxasaurus

Yea DC isn't the best example. The difference is the housing is older in nyc and people here are more accepting of shitty ass apartments. Apt hunting sucks here with all of the fake conversions, broker fees, and whatnot.

And btw cetriche, the unofficial formula for city-living is no more than 1/3 of your income on rent. Even if that means moving to an outer borough :x

a

If some of you "real" NYers crave for some grit, let me recommend my hometown of Caracas. It's like NYC in the 80s but with better weather, more murders and plenty of "authentic" places. I am happy that NYC (where I live now) doesn't look like the pics above anymore...I'm happy that I can walk through Avenue A at 2 AM and get $10 Ramen.

TuraLura

How do you know it was like Caracas? Were you here at the time? Or were you in Venezuela?

It wasn't great because things were dirty and broken. It was great because the dirt and brokenness created an amazing, secret space for creativity, humor and ingenuity that is difficult, but not impossible, to find today. People knew that if they couldn't hack it in the world of middle class suburbia, they could move to NYC and be whatever they wanted, no matter how off or strange or unacceptable to the outside world...and a lot of things that are accepted today were not back then.

But another difference between that time and now was that people had lofty aspirations that didn't usually have anything to do with money.They aspired to be taken seriously, to think and say and create serious and seriously interesting things. It's that mentality that I miss the most.

StedyRuckus

So you miss being young and having dreams is what you're saying. Because, NYC in the 80's was still a city with 99% working stiffs just trying to provide for their families.

kevd

Lots of people here have those exact same ambitions today. Some of them were even born in the Midwest. Maybe its just harder to find today amidst the all the bland corporate entertainment and fashion.

TuraLura

Maybe people have the same ambitions, but they also have to have a full-time job or some other tangible support to survive here. And it's much harder to find a space to develop your ideas. Clearly you're a Gothamist regular, so you've heard about all the Brooklyn and LIC art spaces that have been closed down recently.

And therefore the pressure in on, in a very real way, to create work that will make money. And not necessarily primarily for the artist. Having a city/neighborhood/scene for like-minded outsiders where they could just work without too much hassle was the primary reason the pre-1990s NYC was such a culturally important place, especially for underground and punk culture.

kevd

Oh, I'm not saying its a easy as it once was. But I think that mentality does exist in places - and you do a disservice to those who are still fighting for artistic communities when you say it doesn't exist any more.

cetriche

I don't think New York will ever allow itself to be void of artistic communities. And as good of an artist as you might be from any part of the world, you won't be truly established until you've made your mark in this city...