Red Light Cameras: Nanny-State Nuisance Or Life-Saving Technology?
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We all cringed at the recently-released montage of nail-biting car crashes in New Jersey caused by drivers who run red lights. The company who provides the most red light cameras in the country, American Traffic Solutions, noted that 11 people were killed in the state in 2009 as a resulting of red-light running related collisions. But Monmouth County assemblyman Declan O'Scanlon believes that they're a scam. "They're ATMs in reverse—your money goes in and it never comes out," the Republican tells the Star-Ledger.
Scanlon went on to say that the cameras were supposed to prevent crashes, and that the drivers in the video "simply weren't aware they were going through a red light." However, as CBS notes, a recent survey showed that 77% of Garden State residents approve of red light cameras, and 56% say they change their behavior behind the wheel.
A spokesperson for ATS says they hope the video "brings to the light the dangers associated with red-light running and reinforces the need for motorists to slow down at intersections and obey traffic laws by stopping at red lights."
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For Chicken Underwear When ALL the traffic lights in NYC and everywhere else are engineered for maximum safety and not for revenue, the problems will virtually disappear. Jim Walker, NMA
jcwconsult
Red light cameras are a revenue scam that can only exist with improper engineering for reduced safety and/or unethical traffic management policies. They are "sold" with lies such as the ones found in the ATS video of NJ incidents, falsely claiming the cameras will stop these incidents. Did you notice that the terrible crashes and near-misses were ALL either cases of entry after the light was red for some seconds or while it was still yellow? And did you notice the greatest irony - the cameras did NOT prevent the crashes and near-misses? Red light cameras do NOT make their money by stopping entries after the light has been red for 2 to 5+ seconds, they make money by tricking safe drivers into entering a split second into the red. About 60% of violations are in the first 0.5 seconds of red and about 80% in the first full second of red. The most common way that corrupt engineers cause this to happen is the deliberate and malicious practice to time yellows too short for the ACTUAL 85th percentile approach speeds of free flowing vehicles - the criteria that the Institute of Transportation Engineers formula uses for maximum safety. Set the yellows up to 1.0 seconds too short for the actual approach speeds and the red light cash registers will overflow with fines taken almost entirely from safe drivers. See the science on our website and perhaps you will join us to help rid the country of predatory red light cameras. Then engineers will be forced to engineer for safety, NOT for revenue. James C. Walker, National Motorists Association, www.motorists.org, Ann Arbor, MI
In parallel to this conversation is a conundrum I have been talking about on my blog: Stale greens that leave cyclists that enter an intersection legally stranded one or 2 lanes shy of safety when the cross traffic green is lit. There was at least one wreck in the last week where the cyclist was in the intersection before the amber phase, but got hit by a vehicle that had the green in the motor vehicle's direction before the bike could clear the intersection. I have been trying to find a solution to this, but everything I think of either won't work, or is just as dangerous as being in the intersection when the light changes...
if the powers that be were serious about wanting to stop red light runners all it would take is a simple tweak to the yellow light timings. They just have to lengthen the time of a yellow light and instantly there would be less red lights run.
Instead what they do is install red light cameras, they get a taste of a fresh revenue stream and instead of increasing yellow light time they DECREASE it, causing more red lights to be run, more accidents to happen, and of course, more revenue to flow into their coffers.
It's completely asanine.
Politburo
You don't think an increase in yellow time would result in more people speeding up to make the light?
speakeasies
For those of you concerned with "scams" and "taxes," please think bigger. There is plenty of evidence that red-light cameras used properly reduce severe and fatal crashes. Those crashes would have cost many (taxpayer) dollars.
Not a private company, not a law enforcement officers association, but insurers, who have a vested interest in keeping the cost of accidents down (think about that for a minute . . . .), recommend red light cameras. They may not work in every last case, but overall, they work, and they save more taxpayer dollars on average than they cost.
red light cameras are a scam on the public. they are installed by private companies who collect when the town collects. the town basically is subsidized the equipment and they and the owner/operators split the revenue.
they do nothing to save lives or avoid accidents however. as others have observed the drivers causing accidents aren't the ones who are trying to beat the yellow, it's the ones that completely disregard the red and go through 1 or 2 plus seconds after the signal has gone to red.
the people red light cameras catch and have tickets sent to are not causing accidents since they have already passed through the intersection before the intersecting traffic has entered the intersection (there is a delay before opposing traffic gets green signal to account for this, also since they are moving from a stop it allows even more time for traffic to clear.
RJAARC
Red light cameras are another tax. What the article doesn't say is that a typical red light camera company gets 50% of the ticket revenue. And that there are numerous documented cases of traffic light timing being "adjusted" to maximize ticket revenue. And that the "Poll" showing 77% of New Jersey drivers approve the cameras is pure garbage. Ask a leading question, get the answer you want Article implies WCBS took took the poll, but most likely it was a push poll taken by the camera company.
I'm all for ticketing someone running a red light, but it should be done by a cop, not a camera or a drone.
It is a tax you do not have to pay if you don't run the light.
robingee
Again? Is this a new story or a reboot of the other one that got 800 comments? How about a story called, "Hey! Catholics Don't Like Gay Marriage! What Do YOU Think?"
FDTW
But if I can't get up on my internet soapbox and argue with other lurkers in their mom's basement I'd have to actually find a hobby, talk to people face to face, or (ew) be a productive member of society! That sounds awful.
Give me an excuse to stay in tonight- discuss the following statement: the role of women is to cook, clean, and squeeze out babies, and they shouldn't be able to choose whether or not they want them.
robingee
I don't begrudge anyone living in Mom's basement; that's a pretty sweet deal right there.
FDTW
Traffic laws are in place to protect citizens- not to line the pockets of the local government or police department. The usefulness of red light cameras is debatable, but they certainly encourage corruption and abuse. First of all, the city and police (who are probably underfunded to begin with) install and operate the cameras, AND pocket the proceeds, giving them a vested interest in enforcement rather than deterrence. The more the law is broken, the more money the city makes. However, that's just theoretical- the cameras also result in more textbook corruption...
In Arizona, Illinois, Australia (NSW and Victoria), Alberta CA, and Italy (and that's just to name the bigger cases) officials have been caught taking bribes to secure contracts, installing cameras in places where they had no impact on road safety, and changing the timing on yellow lights to make it almost impossible to NOT get a ticket, even when driving normally.
There are better and more effective ways to make the roads safer, both in terms of determent and enforcement/punishment. Red light cameras could be a useful tool- if, and only if- the money generated from the tickets doesn't go into the pockets of the people issuing them.
cetriche
The fact that the local government could potentially be corrupt (stupid and negligent most likely in this city) is no reason to not back a measure to increase safety. I agree, that the best case scenario would be an officer sitting on every corner watching the light, bu A) city cannot afford that and B) we increase the subjective nature of police officers. Running red lights is a serious problem in NYC ( and clearly NJ) so we should find the most cost-efficient solution to address the problem right away, and hope the government doesn't fuck it up....
FDTW
All you have to do is look at the intersection of Bowery and Houston and see all the cars blowing through the red light despite the very obvious red light cams to see they aren't the best way to deal with this issue.
There are two distinct groups of people who run red lights, and they need to be addressed separately. There are: A) people who accidentally run a light due to distraction/ignorance/idiocy and B) people who consciously choose to run the light because they REALLY need to get to Starbucks 15 seconds quicker.
The first group, as DiegoHenry pointed out, can be drastically shrunk by being made aware. He also listed ways to do that and statistics proving it, which I won't repeat. Red light camera fines might help them pay more attention in the future, but a mental image of their ticket isn't going to pop into their head while they're jabbering away on the phone and coming up to an intersection; well painted lines, big reflective signs, and brighter lights work as a much better, much more immediate reminder.
The other group can only be stopped if it is made clear that they will be punished. Red light cameras with hefty fines certainly help with that, but being pulled over is definitely a stronger reminder that the cops are watching than a letter in the mail two weeks later. You're right- the city can't afford a cop at every intersection, but red light cams are only part of the solution, and relying on them makes us complacent when we really should be searching for newer, more effective strategies.
And as far as corruption goes, that can be largely averted by making sure the people doling out the tickets aren't pocketing the money. Simply using the ticket proceeds to finance something totally disconnected from the people who write the tickets and decide on the ticketing policy would be a quick, cheap, and effective way to avoid a lot of potentially deadly corruption.
Some documentation on how much revenue the local government or police department is "lining their pockets with, and on the corruption spawned by traffic enforcement cameras, please.
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