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Inside Gothamist's Absurd Struggle To Get NYPD Press Passes

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Mayor Bloomberg, Police Commissioner Ray Kelly and District Attorney Cy Vance (nycmayorsoffice's flickr).

(Part 2 in an ongoing, Kafkaesque series...)

Recent reports have suggested that the relationship between New York City's most prominent media outlets and the NYPD has deteriorated in the past few months. Welcome to our world. In the eight years since the website was founded, Gothamist has applied for press credentials three times from the NYPD's press relations office (called the Office of the Deputy Commissioner, Public Information, or DCPI). Each time we've been roundly rejected, most recently last week.

The denial represents the beginning of the end of a process that has lasted nearly four months. Only five of the ten articles that I formally submitted to the NYPD press office were deemed to be sufficient according to the DCPI's eligibility requirements—or that's what we're forced to assume given the decidedly vague language of the rejection letter itself. My publisher, Jake Dobkin, also saw his application denied as a photographer, and his letter stated only one of his clips made the cut. (He's been trying to get one for Gothamist since 2004). You can view my ten articles and his six, along with both rejection letters below.

Why get a press card in the first place? "There are times when they are certainly helpful or necessary," one credentialed reporter who works for a major New York City publication tells us. "I had to go to some Homeland Security event—the Port Authority cops saw my credentials and they let me in." Other barriers that are helpfully lifted: "Getting into City Hall is a pain in the ass, but with credentials they let you right in…Courthouses: if you go to the courthouse in Brooklyn at 320 Jay Street, they honor those and usher you in." And they helped some journalists covering the Occupy Wall Street protesters who marched onto the Brooklyn Bridge in October.

The reporter, who has over 10 years of experience in New York City but did not have permission from his publication to speak on record, tells us he knew a credentialed photographer on the Brooklyn Bridge when over 700 people were about to be arrested: "He and a few others could move over to the side as he photographed the arrests. Now that situation is where the credentials worked perfectly." Other journalists who remained on the bridge that day and did not possess press credentials were arrested. "I think that's pretty significant," the reporter says.

A lawsuit filed against the NYPD in 2008 and settled in 2009 was supposed to make the procedure for obtaining a press pass transparent and available to websites and other non-traditional news outlets. The civil rights attorney who won the settlement, Norman Siegel, explains what his win meant: "We were successful in establishing the fact that bloggers—people using the internet—that they were 21st century journalists." Three online journalists received press passes as an immediate result. According to DCPI's website, these are the current requirements for obtaining NYPD press credentials, that resulted from the settlement:

Applicants must be a member of the media who covers, in person, emergency, spot or breaking news events and/or public events of a non-emergency nature, where police, fire lines or other restrictions, limitations, or barriers established by the City of New York have been set up for security or crowd control purposes, within the City of New York; or covers, in person, events sponsored by the City of New York which are open to members of the press.

Applicants also must submit one or more articles, commentaries, books, photographs, videos, films or audios published or broadcast within the twenty-four (24) months immediately preceding the Press Card application, sufficient to show that the applicant covered in person six (6) or more events occurring on separate days.

After a few months of regularly covering spot-news, I had become used to the puzzled looks and occasional outright hostility that I elicited by approaching the police and other officials without a press pass around my neck. I felt honored to be quizzed by a veteran Daily News crime reporter when he found out who my employer was ("Those guys pay you?"). But I still had yet to attend one of the mayor's press conferences, cover anything in City Hall or in a courtroom. And after all, the requirements seemed so reasonable. "I've been doing this for long enough," I naïvely thought to myself. "How could they reject me?"

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Christopher Robbins / Gothamist
For Gothamist, it took longer to get in touch with the officer in charge of reviewing applications, Detective Gina Sarubbi, than it took to have our applications reviewed and rejected. For over a month, starting at the beginning of September 2011, I inundated the DCPI office with phone calls asking to speak to Detective Sarubbi, and each time I was told she was out or not available. We began to question whether Detective Sarubbi even existed—maybe she was Keyser Söze? Viane Delgado? Emails—some long-winded, some brief, all polite—sent to the email address I was given went unanswered. One phone call with a DCPI officer proved prescient:

"All I'm saying is that If I were you," the officer said, "I would ramp up your efforts a little."

"What does that mean?"

"It means ramp them up, OK? I'll give her the message. Goodbye."

After more than a month had passed without ever being acknowledged by Detective Sarubbi, Mr. Siegel contacted a city attorney. The next day I spoke with a different officer, who gave me an appointment. We were told that Sarubbi claimed she had never heard of our inquiries.

"The NYPD is a quasi-military operation," Siegel says. "My experience is that most city agencies don't like anyone looking over their shoulder and potentially criticizing them, especially law enforcement. And it could be a reluctance to be transparent within their own agency." The veteran reporter I spoke with on background concurred: "They want to be completely in charge and control the flow of information." Peter Bekker, consulting director at The New York Press Club, says his organization "Has for many years been very concerned with what is a decline in the spirit of cooperation between news organizations and the NYPD when it comes to helping the press understand the stories they're reporting. That's DCPI's job, as I understand it."

Ben Fried, editor of Streetsblog NYC, part of a network of transportation websites aimed at covering "the movement to transform our cities by reducing dependence on private automobiles," tells us he and another reporter received credentials. "It wasn't quick but we scheduled an appointment, several weeks later we went down to One Police Plaza with our forms and clips, and a few weeks after that we got the creds," Fried wrote via email. "Streetsblog is generally pretty critical of NYPD, so that was a relief."

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Christopher Robbins / Gothamist
"And you attended all these events in person?" asked Detective Sarubbi when I finally received an audience with her, on November 1st on the 13th Floor of One Police Plaza. DCPI headquarters resembled a sort of municipalized version of The Office. Grey cubicles separated the officers, most of whom were on the phone, and an identical city calendar was pinned to the wall of each one. I took care not to bump into anyone's sidearm on the crowded elevator ride up. Detective Sarubbi was confirming that I in fact reported on the clips I had given her myself.

"Yes," I replied. She looked up from my papers. "Oh I know you, you call on the weekends all the time." While it was true that I worked weekends, and usually called DCPI several times a shift, I had never spoken to her before in my life. Every DCPI officer identifies themselves by name when answering the phone, and Sarubbi was one I wouldn't have forgotten.

After taking my photo with a digital camera, she said the process would take "a few weeks." In an abundance of caution, I submitted at least ten articles with my application—four more than is required. A few days later, she asked me for color PDFs of the articles, and again, erring on the side of caution, sent seven. Sarubbi emailed a reply for the first time: "Thank you."

Another month passed, and I spent a lot of time in Lower Manhattan, covering the Occupy Wall Street protest movement that was gaining steam, without credentials. I never felt lacking a press pass kept me from a story, especially on November 15th, the day the NYPD raided Zuccotti Park. Around 1 a.m. I stood at the corner of Cortland and Broadway next to two credentialed journalists, one from the New York Times, another from DNAinfo, as we were all shoved north down the sidewalk by NYPD batons and riot shields. No one was allowed to witness what was occurring in the park. Ten journalists, five of them holding NYPD press credentials, were arrested.

Mayor Bloomberg's spokesman, Stu Loeser, responded to complaints about reporters being arrested. "You can imagine my surprise when we found out that only five of the 26 arrested reporters actually have valid NYPD-issued press credentials." Loeser goes on to state that of the five, three "were in fact trespassing" and had their arrests voided. (One Daily News reporter was arrested covering this.) Aside from the obvious fact that five arrests of working reporters is five too many—credentialed or not—Loeser's comments illuminate the degree to which the NYPD is effectively in the business of anointing journalists. A tweet he fired off to New York Observer's Megan McCarthy encapsulates the Bloomberg administration's view: "@megan, you don't have a press pass; that's your option. But why should some random NYPD take your word that you're press?"

We asked Loeser eight questions pertaining to the process of obtaining credentials, his response to the arrest of five credentialed journalists, and, specifically, "Does a journalist need NYPD press credentials to be considered a reporter in the eyes of the city?" Loeser responded:

Credentials exist—as it says right on the back of them—to let their holders cross police lines during breaking news events when the public safety officials on the scene feel it’s safe to let them.  Many, many journalists never cover on-scene breaking news events.   Police lines are put up for good reasons beyond obvious concerns during police actions like drug busts—including preserving evidence at crime scenes and protecting the safety of people and property in situations like apartment fires (when neighboring apartment doors are often broken down).

Elizabeth Spiers, Editor-in-Chief of the New York Observer, penned an editorial a few days after the arrests that called the NYPD's process for receiving credentials "ridiculous," noting that even as the Observer's EIC she does not meet the city's definition of a reporter. "I don't think NYPD should be credentialing press," Spiers tells us. "It's as if the government is effectively licensing journalists, which I find disturbing." Ben Fried at Streetsblog also feels like the NYPD shouldn't be the gatekeepers. "There's a substantial public interest in giving this responsibility to an agency that is not itself the subject of constant coverage by the press."

According to Siegel, one idea batted around during the settlement talks two years ago was transferring the power to issue press credentials to the Department of Consumer Affairs. It was rejected by the city. The veteran reporter we spoke to isn't keen on that idea, but offers, "Why not City Hall? City Hall seems like a pretty logical alternative. Taking it out of the hands of the police is a pretty decent goal." During a meeting between the NYPD and The New York Press Club in 2010 to discuss the new credentialing guidelines, the latter proposed that a committee made up of journalists "closely monitor any new application process." They also asked that the NYPD report how many people applied for credentials, which ones were rejected, and why. Sounds reasonable to us. "Didn't happen," Bekker says. "After the meeting the whole process kind of disappeared. The rules were enacted, published, adopted by the NYPD."

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Christopher Robbins / Gothamist
Or how about abolishing press credentials altogether? Bekker told us that besides the need for some reporters to cross the occasional police line, the passes aren't all that useful. "The Press Club's position is that journalism cannot be licensed." Even the veteran reporter acknowledged that there were times when showing a press badge actually hindered access. "Marching up to a police line wearing press credentials around your neck doesn't work." Bekker noted that sometimes the passes act as an " 'Arrest me' sign dangling from your neck."

A little more than a month after the meeting with Detective Sarubbi, I received a letter signed by Lieutenant Frank Merenda. It read, "Your application is being denied for the following reason(s): 1) You have only provided five articles, commentaries," which met the eligibility requirements (see above). The letter offers the option of a hearing that will be scheduled by the Commanding Officer for the Public Information Division, Deputy Chief Edward J. Mullen. My publisher, Jake Dobkin, received a similar letter. His read, "Of the six (6) articles…you provided, only one is sufficient to show that as a member of the press," and then continues with the form language.

"No one ever anticipated that you'd even have to have an interview, so all this stuff is very troubling," Siegel, the civil rights attorney says. "I'm hearing reports from people that the process is overly burdensome…They should cease and desist in dragging their feet. When we revised the rules for press credentials it was never anticipated that it would take an extended period of time to apply." I asked Siegel if the whole process from application to rejection should exceed 90 days. "My opinion is, that's way too long. The entire process at most should be 30-45 days so at a minimum it should be cut in half." Asked if the delay was typical for the NYPD, the reporter says, "If they don't feel that they want to recognize somebody they often just ignore them completely and don't appear to feel obliged to offer any explanation of why."

Leonard Levitt, former Newsday reporter, author, and the founder of the acclaimed website NYPD Confidential, sued with the help of the ACLU in 2009 to have his press card renewed. "The process seems to be determined by the whims and prejudices of one man, Deputy Commissioner for Public Information Paul Browne, who is Commissioner Ray Kelly's closest aide," Levitt says. "Both Kelly and Browne can be vindictive. If they don't like what a reporter writes about them or the department, they can and will make it difficult for that reporter to get a press card." Levitt, considered an expert on all things NYPD, says he is beginning the process of renewing his press card again, and doesn't "expect it will be easy."

Neither Deputy Commissioner Paul J. Browne, Lieutenant Merenda, or Detective Sarubbi responded to requests for comment for this story.

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Jake Dobkin / Gothamist
Gothamist can't even be given the courtesy of receiving the department's "press wire" emails—formerly called The Sheet—which are sent out "in cases of homicide, high profile arrests or major occurrences…to all major news outlets." Many of these releases contain perp sketches or surveillance videos or even good news, such as the capture of a groping suspect, and would seemingly offer the department positive PR at a time when morale is supposedly low. But our repeated attempts to have Gothamist placed on the list have been rejected. One officer answering the phone at DCPI office told us we'd have to take our request all the way to the top. "I can't do that. The Commissioner has to approve every email address on the list." We incredulously asked how we'd catch Ray Kelly's attention. "I can't help you there, you'll have to go to the Commissioner's office." Click.

Later, we were told by a less jocular officer that Detective Brian Sessa handles the press wire emails. My editor Jen Chung asked Detective Sessa what we needed to do to get on the list.

"Do you have press credentials?" Detective Sessa asked. "Not yet," she replied.

"Once you get them, call me."

"What if we're in the process of appealing our rejection?"

"You need credentials."

And last week, while covering a demonstration at Foley Square, another cop put it more bluntly: "Get some NYPD press credentials or get out."

Chris's Clips



Jake's Clips
Chris's Rejection Letter
Jake's Rejection Letter
Contact the author of this article or email tips@gothamist.com with further questions, comments or tips.

Comments [rss]

  • Nick Hentoff
    Would you please post in advance the date and time of your hearing and whether it is open to the public.

    Sometimes, having press credentials can be a disadvantage when dealing with the NYPD as a New York Times Photographer and reporter discovered while covering the 1992 NYPD PBA protest at the Brooklyn Bridge. The Times photographer was surrounded by the police demonstrators, shoved and punched in the back. According to the Times: "A police lieutenant told the photographer, Keith Meyers, that he should leave the bridge. 'I can't protect you up here,' the officer said. A New York Times reporter, Alan Finder, was also kicked in the stomach."

    www.nytimes.com/.../officers-r....
  • ErstwhilePixie52
    "All I'm saying is that If I were you," the officer said, "I would ramp up your efforts a little."

    "What does that mean?"

    "It means ramp them up, OK? I'll give her the message. Goodbye."



    It sounds like someone's asking for a bribe.
  • You deserve the press credentials. Period. You are far better and more intelligent than a couple of  those idiots that I can think of at the post that get to have passes. There has to be a court case in here somewhere.
  • RevDaniel
    I got my nypd press pass on the first shot, and walked out with it the same day as my meeting at 1PP. Here's the deal if you want to get yours... it's ALL about police and fire lines. No rallys, marches, politics, blah blah etc. Crime scenes and Fire scenes, thats it. Ignore public events (parades, protests), even though they include it in their own description. Report on 6+ of them in person, in a TWENTY FOUR MONTH window of time and you'll get your pass.
    No disrespect intended, but after reviewing the stories you submitted, I'm surprised they even agreed with as many as they did, knowing what they typically look for.
  • Look at Chris' posts- they're all police and fire lines.  Mine were designed to test the rest of the policy- whether they'd give a card for "events sponsored by the city" and "other events where restrictions were in place."  If it's only police and fire lines, no prob- we subscribe to the wires and we can just send reporters out to traffic accidents six times each.  I could probably do that in one day.  But that would mean updating the policy- because the policy currently says these other clips are valid.  That's why I submitted them.
  • bobloblawslawblog
    So, you submitted articles you already believed would be rejected, simply because you wanted to see if the NYPD would follow the literal description of their requirements?  And now, you're upset you were rejected?

    Awesome job.
  • Yes- that's what a test case is.  You take the literal requirements and follow them, and see what happens.  That's why requirements exist- to be followed.  If there's some other, secret set of rules, then that's why we need to sue- to get those secret rules made public and/or changed.
  • bobloblawslawblog
    And you call everyone else a troll?
  • RevDaniel
    Yes I did look at Chris' clips. And I still stand by what I said earlier. I'm surprised they approved 5 of them.

    #1- a protest/rally (not a crime scene police line).
    #2- a protest/rally (not a crime scene police line).
    #3- an grafitti art exhibit (neither police or fire line).
    #4- a protest/rally (not a crime scene police line).
    #5- This is one I agree would qualify.
    #6- a protest/rally (not a crime scene police line).
    #7- a protest/rally (not a crime scene police line).
    #8- This is one I agree would qualify.
    #9- a parks dept farm opening (neither police or fire line).
    #10- a protest/rally (not a crime scene police line).
  • It sounds to me like every single on of Chris' clips meets this description- "applicants must be a member of the media who covers, in person, emergency, spot or breaking news events and/or public events of a non-emergency nature, where police, fire lines or other restrictions, limitations, or barriers established by the City of New York have been set up for security or crowd control purposes".  

    It sounds like you're saying that only crime scenes have police lines, but that's obviously not true.  Protests also have police lines, and if you want to get really semantic about it, since arrests were made at each of these protests, they were also crime scenes.  So I'm going to respectfully disagree that you can reject Chris' clips for not being behind police lines.
  • RevDaniel
    But I'm not saying that, regardless of how it sounds. Let me put it this way, since it's starting to appear like I'm taking sides when I'm absolutely not... Their own description is misleading. They look for crime scene police lines, and fire scene lines.
    When I went through my own submissions, I skipped covering the newly elected Pope's visitation, even though I had bomb sniffing dogs up my ass. I skipped several presidential visits as well.
    My initial post was meant as nothing more than a helpful suggestion on how to improve your chances. I hope this clears things up.
  • Guest
    You are not disturbed by the fact that the police are giving press passes on the basis of whether one reports on disfavored political events????
  • RevDaniel
    What part of what I said gave you that impression????? (sorry, had to one up you on the question marks).
    What I said was I know what they look for in the application process, and that it isnt all that hard, given they doubled the length of the window. The rest was my opinion on why some of the clips submitted were rejected.
  • Does no one see the problem with granting the hegemonic state authority to determine who may speak and who may not? A credentialed journalist is simply an apparatus of the state, a person who has agreed to report what the state approves of.  No reputable journalist should subject themselves to the approval of an agency that they should -- that they must -- be critical of without jeopardizing their impartiality.
  • nycpress
    Exactly, because only the uncredentialed, independent outlets ever reported on police scandals, and every mainstream media representative is warmly welcomed at emergency scenes by the Emerald Society pipes and drums.

    Meanwhile, in the real world...
  • nycpress
    Again, people are missing the larger point, that the whole concept of the NYPD issuing press cards is not some freakish, 1984-type method of ensuring lock-step control of Der Establishment's Message, it's because, once upon a time, the card was a FUNCTIONING tool for crossing POLICE lines.  The FDNY had a tradition of issuing its own, separate cards for crossing FIRE lines, which continued even after the agencies' permissions were combined on the press card.  Follow?  It's absolutely not up to one's blogger-in-chief to say "so and so has my permission to cross police lines."

    These lawsuits to get everyone and their pet goldfish a press card were the final nail in the coffin for whatever effectiveness these cards had.  It's no coincidence that they underwent a major redesign and rephrasing when this happened.  I would absolutely NOT feel comfortable with some of these so-called "journalists" next to me at an emergency scene.  Even before the floodgates opened, I thought there should be more control over who got the cards.  The two-tiered system, which included non-emergency cards, was a good concept (even though, in practice, I never saw anyone excluded from a spot news scene with a "square card.") 

    Anyway, this rush to get credentialed for the sake of getting credentialed has brought about too many cooks in the kitchen.  To paraphrase Mayor Giuliani, the more people you have, the higher the chance that there are going to be more jerks. 

    This is not even a new media vs. old media thing.  A 1952 article on the topic sums it up best: "Originally meant to identify newspaper reporters only, today the term 'press' has been expanded to include radio, television, newsreel, and news syndicates.  Despite the number and complexity of these agencies, the cards are limited in distribution.  Each application is screened thoroughly by the Office of the Secretary of the [Police] Department working in conjunction with the Police Commissioner's Committee on Press Cards.  This latter committee is composed of a cross section of press representatives who, because of their working background, are able to advise on the validity of an application.

    "Control of the issuance of press cards is welcomed by news-gathering agencies as an aid in their work.  As a result, at the scene of a public function, the movements of reporters and photographers are not impaired by the presence of many persons carrying press cards who have no legitimate right to them...

    "It is a symbol to the police officer that the possessor of the card has been screened and authorized to collect news and as such has the privilege of crossing police and fire lines.  Conversely, the cards serve to eliminate unauthorized persons from gathering information to which they are not entitled  By eliminating them from the scene it is easier for the authorized holders to operate.  In this way the Police Department is able to identify and cooperate with the press, the press is helped in its important job of gathering news, and the public is benefited by getting its news quickly and authentically."
  • Also, I'd welcome anyone going on the record and saying specifically why they think Gothamist doesn't deserve press cards- and why the clips we put up don't qualify under the current policy.  Our next post about this will be next week, so if you want to get in touch- email me at jake@gothamist.com and we'll get a quote from you.
  • bobloblawslawblog
    After reading more on this subject, it seems that plenty of press passes already exist for established news media outlets.  as such, I don't see what Gothamist could cover or what news it could bring that I would otherwise miss from the NYT or NY1, etc.

    Gothamist's greatest asset is that it is one of the premier (if not *the* premier) aggregator of NYC-related news.  That's something to be proud of, but not something that requires/deserves a press pass in my opinion.
  • Guest
    I'm curious to know what scenarios you imagine when you forewarn of passes being issued to the wrong people.  How, exactly, could a legit blog editor put others in danger in a way that people from NY1 wouldn't?
  • Really?  Did everyone with a Tumblr account spend four hours down under the street bed getting pictures?  Or spend the hours it took in advance to get the permissions to get in without a press pass?  Or spend the hours it took to post-process the images so you could insult them?  Give me a break.
  • Just thought I'd pitch in to say that I also E-mailed and called Ms. Sarubbi and and got no response. You are far from alone.
  • Bernie_Geotz_Squirrel_Luv
    You know when Gothamist shines compared to other sites?
    When a real time emergency hits. How many times would we turn to Gothamist to hear what just happened or to keep up to date on events. Whether it's OWS, a blackout, earthquake or a hurricane. Even a subway delay. People come here to get some info before the big guys.
  • eyekantspel
    well, just do the written request for appeal and get a hearing date.  Like most things in New York City, this is probably just about being tenacious enough to overcome the obstacles government employees put in your path. 

    It looks like the basis for rejecting Christopher Robbins' application was that he only submitted 5 items instead of 6; and yours was that they only approved 1 of the 6 you submitted.  Not clear from that if they actually reviewed his 5 or just rejected based on the count, but maybe you can compare notes and see if there's any substantive difference in the support you submitted.
  • coolmikeperry
    And yet America is still considered to be a democracy.
  • JC
    If you deserve a press pass, so do I and everybody who feels confident/presumptuous enough to post their opinions on everything under the sun on the interwebs.
  • Guest
    If Albany allowed the city to hand out Rape Passes, Ray Kelly would make sure that each and every member of der Führer's private army got one.If Albany allowed the city to hand out Petty Corruption Passes, the PBA would make sure that each and every one of its members got one.
  • virgilstarkwell
    god, you're annoying.
  • Guest
    Not a single response to my points, just insult and invective.
  • eyekantspel
    I thought Gothamist was bought by Cablevision?  They can't help?
  • No- we are not owned by Cablevision!  Still 100% owned and operated by me and Jen.
  • Guest
    Further evidence that every single member of New York's 'Finest' should be put into execution vans. As if more were needed.
  • m015094
    You don't personally know any police officers, do you?

    I didn't think so.
  • Guest
    I don't make it a practice to socialize with goose-steppers
  • virgilstarkwell
    jake - i agree with you, but you're not making it easy. saying 'I don't really care what you believe about the site in its totality' isn't a way to get your readers/page viewers on your side... and, if that's not your goal, then why post the article in the first place?
  • I don't like people insulting the site- and this post is def troll bait. We work really hard around here to produce real, original reportage.  Of course we also aggregate- that's an important function of the site.  But when someone says we never report, or we aren't doing journalism, I just can't let that stand.
  • m015094
    Take it as 1% insulting and 99% encouragement. 

    Like many news sources that "aggregate," you won't really be taken seriously until you get a big, exclusive, story (and maybe not even then).  I'm sure that you know this. (being the smart Ivy leaguer you are.)

    Example:  Nobody gave two squirts of piss about the National Enquirer because it was considered a tabloid rag.  Then came John Edwardsgate or whatever it's called.  They had about 15 minutes of actual journalism going on over there.  That's what Gothamist needs.  A real  story that people pay attention to. 

    This NYPD press thing could have been it, but you're making it too personal.  Step back and look at the big picture.
  • TBE11
    Hardly anyone is insulting your site. You should be please this many people read and take an interest in the content. We wouldn't be here if we didn't like what you do.

    The lines between blogs, journalism, news, and opinion have been blurred, and depending on your own experiences, opinions on whether this is good or bad will differ. Though my perception of your site is not the same as the one you hold, I did find the process documented in this post to be fascinating.
  • Newhce
    Do sandwich shop reviews count as original content?
  • SFNY
    You mean like what the NYTimes does?
    www.nytimes.com/restaurants/........
  • bobloblawslawblog
    I've been wondering that myself.  The editors claim they post 12-24 original stories a day, but that seems WAY too high,  It could just be that the original content isn't really breaking news in any way, which is fine, but I'm not sure if I consider it journalism...

    Look, gothamist is a fun place to visit, but it's on par with the Gawkers of the world, and I can't imagine anyone considers that journalism.
  • I would count a sandwich review as an original post if it involved actual reportage- going to the shop, eating the sandwich, etc.  So yes, some original content is in food or A&E.  No one said all original journalism has to be hard news.  

    And I don't really care what you believe about the site in its totality- that's not the issue here.  The only issue is whether or not we've completed the necessary steps to get a press pass under the current process, which again, is 6 original clips in certain categories over 24 months.  And I defy you to say the clips linked above don't meet those very specific standards, which are quoted in the post above.
  • bobloblawslawblog
    Dude, you are way too sensitive.

    My criticism is actually not even that harsh; in fact, I like Gothamist.  Sh!t; I'm here now, aren't I? I'm actually surprised you guys have come this far if every small critique (by someone who admittedly knows little about your business) causes a mini-aneurysm or keeps you up at night.

    From what I can tell, Gothamist has come a long long way as a successful business where others have failed. Given your rate of ascent, I would argue that someday Gothamist may be a hard-hitting news organization... but I don't think it's there (yet).
  • Newhce
    I was going to let this go, but i decided to look at your "original conent."  This is the best representative work you could come up with?

    Today was a big day for the Second Avenue Subway project: the enormous tunnel boring machine that will dig the "phase one" tunnel from 92nd to 63rd Street was switched on for the first time. (It arrived at the location last month.) We stopped by the site this morning to take some pictures of the current site and the sandhogs who are working down there. And after the jump, some video of the boring machine beginning to turn.

    Pictures and boring video? Basically that is everyone with a tumbler account
  • TK41c
    What the heck, as a former tv news guy I feel for you. The yearly process was not as painful as yours, but then again I was working for a large, established Fortune 5 [Yes, that big] company. Do yourself a favor and look at the NY State Dept. of Motor Vehicles site and the application for NYP [press] license plates - you can only get them as an employee of a NYC-based company if you DO have an NYPD press pass. So there is a secondary need for the pass. And get some decent parking to boot. How do you think Geraldo Rivera gets NYP plates for his Bentley?
    http://nysdmv.custhelp.com/app...
  • Newhce
    rev
  • picaflor
    @ virgilsterkwell
    this is great - something you and I can agree on - that Gothamist has the right to report and be on the scene
  • picaflor
    Love (and by love I mean loathe) how the naysayers are so quick to denigrate Gothamist and its staff, yet manage to avoid posting any serious responses to the main point of the article:

    Why the hell is a police department granted the authority to dole out media passes in the first place? How is it not a conflict of interest that this organization gets to decide who may or may not disclose to the general public their wrongdoings?

    Are Gothamist critics ok with this?
  • TBE11
    I don't see a lot of denigration of Gothamist or its staff going on here. I get that everyone likes Gothamist, but that doesn't mean they are beyond questioning, right?

    Why should the police have the authority to dole out media passes? I'm sure they will argue it's for safety and security purposes. But it would seem to be better if the city decided on press passes to act as a buffer (at least somewhat) against conflict of interest.
  • picaflor
    Absolutely every blog and news organization should be questioned. Including Gothamist. I was referring to those who specifically referred to this site as not being legit, not being informative, figuratively clapping at that detective's decision...

    In any event, I agree that the decision to manage press passes should rest elsewhere. Not with cops.
  • bobloblawslawblog
    This I agree with.

    What I find irritating about this story is all of the crap (and all of the attachments - did anyone actually read this?) about how dare they do this to Gothamist, etc.; the signal to noise ratio is so low, it's difficult to take it seriously.

    The real story, as you correctly point out, is about the NYPD overseeing who gets to write about it.  Unfortunately, again, that is sort of lost in all of the noise of this post.
  • m015094
    You're confusing two different things.  The press pass is to allow one a physical presence into an area that is normally restricted (e.i - court houses, press conferences etc.).

    This doesn't prohibit anyone one from publishing their story - online or in print.  It's not like the NYTimes has an NYPD employee that is giving the ultimate OK on what is OK to print. 

    This is simply allowing a small number of legitimate press people to have access where the general public wouldn't be allowed.  I realize that it must be frustrating for Gothamist writers/editors/photographers not to be included on that list, but play Devil's advocate.  What if EVERYBODY with a camera and a blog wanted a press pass?  Bloomberg would have to conduct his press conferences in Madison Square Garden to accommodate the Jimmy Justice and Joey Boots wannabees.
  • picaflor
    Don't think I am confusing anything here
    Of course not every article has the NYPD seal of approval, but let's not be naive here...
    We all know that evidence is needed to support reporting
    and if photographers are blocked, and if media is kept outside the areas where action is taking place, if journalists are prevented from covering events as they happen, then again - we have no choice but to go by what the NYPD say. I don't want to go by what they say. That's not a society anyone, especially a country that lauds itself as the model of freedom, should be ok with.

    And no, let's not conflate the two because again, we all know not "EVERYBODY" would get a press pass. Let's not equate Gothamist folks with EVERYBODY.
  • bobloblawslawblog
    And by the way, while I may not feel that the"ists" are worthy of being labeled as "journalism", it does not mean that I don't think the staff (and specifically Gothamist) haven't done a great job of building a successful business.

    The editors, funders, writers, aggregators, salesmen, other staff, etc. have done a great job of making these sites a web destination and ad-revenue generator for its backers. Many web companies have failed miserably at this, yet Gothamist has succeeded, which is something to be proud of.
  • Trustafarian
    yeah, i was surprised to read that as well.  total conflict of interest.
  • bobloblawslawblog
    I enjoy the "ists", but I see it more as an aggregator of real journalism, so I'm not really all that surprised that press passes would be denied.

    I have several friends who work for real news outlets, and I watched them get degrees in journalism (some but not all) and cut their teeth on small-town sidebars, covering boring city council meetings all day, pouring their lives into low-paying work because they love it.  Then, sites like Gothamist copy/paste and add snark.

    Now, Gothamist does do original writing *every now and then*, so maybe there's a need for a press pass?  I doubt it, though, and while I enjoy this website, I would never equate the people who work here with real reporters or journalists.
  • Again, you've obviously never spent any time reading our site.  We do a least a dozen, sometimes two dozen original pieces a day.  And for those, we need press passes.
  • bobloblawslawblog
    I spend a fair amount of time here, maybe not a ton, but I usually just notice the aggregation.

    I'm sorry if my opinion bothers you, but it's just that. If you feel otherwise, congrats.
  • virgilstarkwell
    as much as i find the anti-cop bias on gothamist to be knee-jerk, childish, and sometimes infuriating, i support your right to be all those things. it can't be about what you say but your right to say it.
  • krinklecutfires
    I think your fate was sealed when you broke the PapaJohnsgate story earlier this year...

    http://gothamist.com/2011/05/0...
  • bobloblawslawblog
    This must be one of the dozen or so original stories Goathmist posts every day.
  • Trustafarian
    Good luck guys.  Considering a NYC gov't bureaucracy is involved, you'll probably have to grease some palms to get anything that you want.
  • Right- I'd be stunned if anything less that a lawsuit gets this changed.  But we need to go through the motions of appealing the last two rulings. Once that's done and we're rejected again, I think the next step is starting a new case.
  • You guys need a rabbi in the NYPD. My experience getting a press credential was entirely different. A while back, I was working the local South Brooklyn crime beat for one of the local papers (which I won't name, but it's one of the tiny ones). It was basically all police blotter stuff, and occasionally I would hear something on the scanner, or get a call from a DT I know, and head over to a crime scene.

    One of the DT's offered to help me get a press credential. I filled out the forms, mailed in clips, and the DT made a call for me. A month later I got a letter asking me to go down to 1PP for an interview. I chatted with the cop there, got my pic taken, and got a credential shortly afterwards. Painless.

    Sadly, the NYPD is always about who you know, and who wants to help you, which is absolutely not the way it should be. This system needs to change, and quick. Good luck, Gothamist is a great news outlet and deserves credentials like any other news outlets.
  • I would say the chance of us getting a rabbi inside the NYPD is approximately zero.  And besides, what about all the other people who don't have as large a platform as us and are also getting treated badly here?  The point of this post, our applications, and any lawsuit we eventually file is to get the rules enforced fairly across-the-board- anything else would just be us getting co-opted.
  • I couldn't agree with you more. I think the entire system is broken, especially the fact that the NYPD has such power over the press. My whole point in commenting was to point out that this is a corrupt process, and dominated by "who you know", which is terrible. I'm definitely hoping to see some changes, and rooting for Gothamist to get your neck tags very soon.
  • openheads
    *Chuckles*
    Gothamist is a snark blog. Stay in your lane.
  • m015094
    When Gothamist starts doing some actual reporting instead of copying/pasting from the Daily News and the Post, then maybe they'll get a press pass. 

    I mean, some of the commenters on this site have probably written more original words than some of the Gothamist "press"  corp.

    Don't get me wrong - I love you guys!!
  • tomhenning
    Does m015094 have Commenter Credentials?  I think that the NYPD issues those, as well.
  • John_Del_Signore
    You are obviously not a regular reader. And there are links above in this very post, to some of the "actual reporting" which we submitted to the NYPD.
  • m015094
    I seem to remember offering you the opportunity to do a story about theft here in Harlem.  I even included pictures of the perp.   It wasn't reported by NY1. the Post, Daily News etc, so you claimed there was no interest and too commonplace even though 90% of the things that happen in this city are commonplace. 

    Oh, and it would have been a story about a bicycle - which you KNOW generates hits.  Anyway, of course you're free to report (or not) on whatever you want, but I was bummed. 
  • TBE11
    A Top 50 is not a regular reader? Uh oh.
  • I am a regular reader. A top 50 is a someone who posts allot.
  • John_Del_Signore
    Reading and mouthing off in the comments are two very different things, as you've just proven.
  • AlexTheOriginalPartyDog
    Someone is wearing their crankypants today.
  • whitecastlerock
    I read the content, that is after I have already read it in the NY Post.
  • TBE11
    Man, you are thin-skinned.
  • Again, see my other comments.  With a staff of eight, I think we do more reporting that many outlets here in New York every day.
  • berbplerb
    That's crazy, but not unexpected.  I used to work in city government and I often had to rely on the police department for information....the effort that you have to put in to even get someone on the phone is enormous.  My only advice for you is, become the most annoying person on earth, keep publicising your predicament, and get a lot of lawyers involved.  Good luck.
  • Being annoying is something I'm good at!  But definitely- expect us to be writing about this regularly for the foreseeable future.  We'll also continue to launch new applications every time they deny one of ours, and when our lawyers say it's time, we'll sue.
  • whitecastlerock
    maybe the NYPD doesn't want to deal with felixthecat....
  • AlexTheOriginalPartyDog
    Finally, something the NYPD and I can agree on...
  • StacyHorn
    I just want to add that you have my sympathies and you did a good job of outlining all the issues, the most important being that the NYPD should not be the ones to decide who gets press credentials for all the reasons stated, they are not an objective party in the decision process.  They shouldn't be the ones to decide who reports on them.

    I was actually able to get press credentials when I was writing a book about the NYPD, but I haven’t renewed them in years for again, all the reasons stated above.  I don’t work in a breaking news environment (I write books!) and it has served me better over the years to not represent myself as press.

    I also want to bring up a similar problem.  The Property Clerk Division of the NYPD is responsible for storing evidence from crime scenes.  Since that evidence can be used to establish either guilt or innocence, and the NYPD is again, not an objective party with respect to the outcome of a case, they should not be the ones storing the evidence. I would also argue that a third party should be the ones to collect it, or at least be present when evidence is collected.
  • randomtransplant
    Anybody covered by a companies liability insurance who reports on events should get a press pass. You generate cash-money through content, and you are recognized as responsible for the conduct of your content producers. 

    It isn't even an old media/new media debate. Gothamist is functionally every bit as "old media" as CNN.com. This a gag on your future earning potential as well as your first amendment rights. 

    You should offer free add space to colleges whose law departments sue on your behalf, and publish the process for the page hits. Or something. 

  • I don't mind paying for the case myself!  I don't want to waste the resources of an NFP that should be suing for more important civil rights violations- like people getting denied fair housing or something.
  • randomtransplant
    Good point. Get this Siegel guy on the line!
  • We've been talking to him!
  • AaronRed99
    I'm sorry but I have to ask. When did Gothamist become a prominentmedia outlet?
  • I'll give you an honest answer to a trolling question- we became prominent once we had 1MM readers per month.  That's larger than some sites like The Village Voice and The Observer.
  • nunyadamn
    Readers alone do not make you a prominent media outlet.
    I was going to point to TMZ as high viewers but not news but I'm sure they've got a press pass.  You get my point though.
  • GentleGiant
    You have an interesting definition of "prominent".
  • nunyadamn
    Please read Jake's post. He said that Gothamist became prominent when they got 1MM readers. My point is that readership does not make one prominent because the TMZ is prominent. Content makes one prominent but thanks for making my point clearer.
  • slickpoetry
    No, gentlegiant is right. "Prominence" is not strictly defined by quality of content. Promincence is defined either by importance, or fame. So both gothamist, the new york times, and TMZ can all be considered "prominent"
  • nunyadamn
    Yeah you are right. But I still contend that prominent does not mean you are due a press pass.
  • GentleGiant
    I think you are confusing prominent with prestigious.  TMZ is prominent because lots of people read it and even more know about it.  Almost no sane person would call TMZ prestigious.
  • Bernie_Geotz_Squirrel_Luv
    How is it that you guys don't get a Press Pass but that dude on MNN
    Public Access TV with the tall Russian chick get's one? You know, that
    irritating guy who does man on the street interviews and acts all smug.
  • I've also wondered why whenever I'm at a protest or whatever, it seems like every foreign journalist in the world seems to have an NYPD press pass.  I don't want to sound nationalistic here, but it offends me that they'll give press passes to the smallest newspaper in Korea or whatnot, but not a large, homegrown NYC website like us.
  • edgie168
    mostly it's because they probably (well, more than probably) couldn't give a rat's ass what some mouthbreather in some country that isn't the US of A writes.

    now i need to go shower after writing that.
  • mattbrooklyn
    The objections are bizarre.  Why do people want there to be tighter limits of journalism in the US?  Even if the deal is that people who have press credentials do not get hassled by the cops, then so what?  The issue is how the press behaves at the scene - if they become involved in the news, then the police may act, if they are only reporting on the news, then the police have to be hands off.

    That means that if you are a blogger who is participating in OWS for the sake of reporting, you may be press, but you don't get special treatment.
  • ennuipoet
    I can understand to a point the logic behind issuing credentials.  Just because I take photos of people whacking each other with plastic light sabers doesn't entitle me to sit in the White House Press Pool. However, the system is designed to control access to information, to selectively allow who is reporting on the activities of the police and the City in general.  Presenting a press pass does not give anyone "special treatment", your credentials can be pulled for failing to follow the lawful instructions of the police.  The police, however, are supposed to see those credentials and differentiate the press from the public and freely allow them to do their job.
  • Politburo
    It sounds like it's easier to get a WH pool pass than to get an NYPD pass.. 538, TPM, HuffPo, WND, all have WH passes.
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