6,000 Rally To Stop "War On Women's Health"

Yikes. From baby-killing, Socialism, and right-wing conspiracy to jokes about dead baby arms, there are some scary comments here. I think there hasn't been a comment yet that has tried to analyze both sides of the spectrum:

WHAT DOES PLANNED PARENTHOOD DO?
According to the organization's website, PP is "the nation’s leading sexual and reproductive health care provider and advocate." The organization focuses on three areas within its mission:
1. Providing contraception and other health services to women and men (I didn't know men were included until now),
2. Funding research on birth control and educating specialists and the public about the results, and
3. Advancing access to family planning in the United States and around the world.
Is abortion assistance provided? Yes. But according to the 2008-09 Annual Report, THREE PERCENT of the 3MM patients doctors and nurses through PP saw receive abortion services. Now, 3% of 3MM (90,000) is still a lot, but it's important to recognize that abortion isn't the main piece of PP; contraception takes the lead at 36 percent of total services, followed testing and treatment for STIs (31%) and cancer screening and prevention (17%).

There is a lot more useful data in the report (the organization provides $2.5MM in grants, they also reach out to 935,000 people internationally, etc.), but looking at the other side of the coin, it's an annual report. What is the most important point here though is that only 3% of PP's work is due to abortion services.

Thus, say what you want about the methods of abortion, but don't say that Planned Parenthood is a bastion that solely engages in abortions.

ARE ALL OF ITS METHODS RIGHT?
I'd have to say no. According to the report, PP and President Obama are trying to eliminate "abstinence-only" programs. The problem here, like many political issues, is that it's a "one bad apple screws up the whole bunch" situation. Some organizations and institutions, instead of promoting abstinence as an ability to grow will power and promote self-confidence, inserts religion into the spectrum where sex before marriage is a sin. As a result, abstinence-only education gets a black eye.
Do I believe abstinence is the best solution? No, but it's a viable one when implemented correctly.

SHOULD IT BE FUNDED BY THE GOVERNMENT?
Technically speaking, because PP is an international organization, it should have the fundraising capability to support itself. That being said, it is an organization that I feel comfortable because it provides education to Americans about their bodies and how to care for and treat them. The government funds public television, which is full of educational programs. What about providing government funding to research institutions like the NIH?


What scares me the most about this whole situation is not about the result of the Senate decision. What scares me is the extremist responses to the issues. People are resorting to graphic language and violent thoughts towards one another. So what if PaulaNYC was a stripper for 5 years? Maybe it was the only way for her to pay her loans off. Maybe she even got a thrill from working as one. (Sorry to use you as an example, Paula, but I'm impressed that you mentioned it to the comment feed.)


Anyway, let's try to be a little more respectful here and focus on the main question: if PP loses government funding, can it make up for the lost money through fundraising?


(Oh, and knock it off on the dead baby jokes. :-) )

The "paula" avatar appears to be a cliched fabrication. Incapable of having a mature discourse, it's a troll who hurls around insults and incendiary rhetoric. Always the first to throw around epithets and expletives, his statements are never backed up by facts, they are always full of bile, and as soon as other commenters call out the BS in his posts, or when he starts losing the argument because of what often seems like a blind rage, the spewing gets increasingly erratic and personally disrespectful. Just click on his comment history and you'll see why people react the way they do. At some point in every thread, regular commenters tire of his hackneyed charade and sometimes stoop to his level (which isn't effective, but is sometimes entertaining for a while).

I'm starting to wonder if he isn't on the Gothamist payroll as a professional troll tasked with driving up page views and comments ...

On the point!!! He has actually gotten me to stoop to his level but it has always been fun. What a poor soul.

I don' t think the good people at Gothamist (wink) would do anything like that. But the account does seem to be textbook trolling. Eh, I fall for it as much as anyone. But then I am a Libra who likes to argue.

You gotta problem wit dat? ;)

uhhhh... no? yes? wait, what? oh look over there, the troll's posting something!!

Whatever Paula says shouldn't bother you. Let her say whatever she wants, and if you don't like it, just don't comment on it.

It doesn't bother me at all.

I was just illustrating the content of his posts and explaining what happens when he hops in and dumps a flaming diaper-load on the board.

It probably can, however it's important to note where this funding will come from, which is most likely the pockets of individuals contributing to other socially progressive causes.

Framed this way, it's tempting to view de-funding PP as another attempt to financially hamstring a well-known progressive institution.

Additionally abstinence as a contraception method is terrible. It engenders isolation and prevents interaction leading to understanding and consensus between genders.
It deprives young people of a basic biological right because whilst some people may feel its important to them personally, the reason abstinence has been so closely linked to religion is because religion is often the only ideological cudgel with which to beat it into young people.

As for PaulaNYC - I don't really care what she did or didn't do. I do care that she espouses ideas that have been shown time and again to be ineffective at dealing with issues at best, and violently socially incompatible at worst.

Well said regarding all points, bud. Hopefully whatever the result is, PP will be able to stabilize itself and continue to provide assistance to men and women.

wow - this thread is like the troll all-star game!!!

Yes, aren't divergent opinions really annoying? Wouldn't it be great if we just elect Obama "King", shred the Constitution, take everyone's weapons, disband the military, and become the first nation in a great atheist world-wide authoritarian state, with unlimited free healthcare and pet bunnies for everyone on what used to be called "Easter"? That way, we could finally do what we would prefer to do to all the people who don't espouse the correct way of Liberal thinking and send them to relocation camps in the Southwest.

funny, since it was provably bush that 'pretty much shredded the constitution' post 9/11.

no one ever "shredded the constitution" like Bush, Cheney and Rove.

so wait - you were a stripper AND you're nutty as a fruitcake? damn - you're like my kryptonite.

She was never a stripper.

:-(

So much compassion for the unborn and yet none for the living. Watch the holocaust of animals bred, shipped, tortured and KILLED for MEAT. This is REAL CRUELTY. Go VEGAN.

I never failed to pay tax, and I used contraception without exception. Still, I got pregnant, what was worse, it was when I was out of job and without health insurance. PP was the only place I could afford (It's not entirely free. You PAY, for instance, several hundred dollars for abortion) - they provided me very caring consultations for what I can do with my situation including how to survive as a low-income single mother.

I decided to give up that pregnancy, but I got married later on with the boyfriend who was the father of that baby, and we are expecting another one soon, in much, much better economic and psychological conditions. We never forget the pain of our past decision, but we are really grateful for PP's sincere service.

Hadn't I had their support, I might have fallen into living on welfare, in poverty.
At PP's waiting room, I was shocked seeing the majority of the patients are VERY young - they looked barely 16 years old. Does this society need more population which are fixated in poverty due to the lack of education, which reproduce themselves every 15 years or so? Who would pay the long-term cost of the consequence?

I strongly support PP. People who blindly support pro-life, and against PP's outreach, are very lucky ones, who always have great private health insurance, and have well-paid, stable job/income, who NEVER know the pain of living in poverty which deprives parents and children of opportunity and choice in life.

"Who would pay the long-term cost of the consequence?"

How about the people who have the kid? Maybe if you are not financially well of enough to support a kid, you should be having sex. Actions have consequences, sometimes unexpected. How about all you whiners start taking some responsibility and get some private health insurance?

I got a good laugh out of FU Boy's comment about my medical knowledge. I work in a hospital and I see it every day. Hey, here's a question....what happened to St. Vincent's? What about the other 17 hospitals within the NYC area that have closed in the past year?

The idea that health care is free is ridiculous. It's not. How would you like it if I came to your job and made you do stuff for me - FOR FREE?

Some liberals have twisted sexual liberation and women's liberation...

oh! the horror of people actually being able to enjoy themselves.

And you have twisted my point.

I don't care what people do with their bodies; but don't expect free care and testing that is subsidized by the state.

I'm more "live free or die" than 99% of the population, most likely. But I also understand that for every action, there's some possible negative consequences.

And you have twisted the original point - which is people are going to fuck, whether or not you approve of it.

It's a basic biological imperative that is the reason our species has persisted throughout history. One can no further deny the impulse to breed than the impulse to eat or breathe.

This causes a problem in society - STD's will spread and by claiming that enjoying yourself sexually is in some way something you should be ashamed of will simply increase the speed and frequency of that spread.

Institutes like PP exist to provide safe, anonymous and non-judgmental support so that people can be human beings and deal with the problems this causes in a rational and constructive manner.

The state recognizes this is a better way of dealing with a problem than letting disease run rampant and wind up costing more in terms medical and social capacities later on.

This is preventative health care in action, and it is very effective.

m015094, maybe you should try and get a law passed to ban all poor people from having sex. That's what you're suggesting right? If you can't afford a kid, don't have sex? Oh my god, it's so simple. Maybe you forgot about the fact that people are POOR, they can't afford private health insurance! PP is not a free service. They take health insurance, and they try to make it affordable for people who do not have health insurance, it's not free.
And with all your medical knowledge and working in the industry I suppose you already know about the fact that Planned Parenthood's service comprise mostly of STD testing, pap smears, sexual education, birth control, and cancer screenings, and abortion is only 3% of their provided service.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...

Planned Parenthood isn't free, but it IS subsidized by the gov't to the tune of 1/3 of a billion/year.

As a man who uses PP's services, I've got three things to say on this matter:

1) This sucks. The government should not cut funding to PP in any way.

2) I'm always disappointed that more men don't use their services - the generally poor knowledge that most men have on reproduction and sexual health is pitiful.

3) I'm always slightly put-off when this is addressed as a "war on women's health". No, it's a war on the healthcare of our nation, male and female. Matters of sexual health concern everyone, and I often think that is the line that such activists should take.

On a side note, thanks to robingee, SFNY and cmdrogogov for holding down fort sanity on this thread - but do you seriously think that someone like aspiringrapper or m015094 even know what a pap smear is? Any clinical reference to ladybits and they probably shove their fingers in their ears and stomp around singing "la la la la la, I can't hear you, la la la".

Maturity? Reason? Apparently ineffective with the obstinately ignorant.

ima try dis: "yo bro no joke u can get ur balls cupped at planned parenthood cheap as f*%&! fo' realz!!!!"

Then every attempt should be made to enable them to relate to the issue in a more mature and rational manner.

Additionally, voices of reason need to start shouting louder.

Meanwhile, the military budget deflates by a meager 2% after all the 'creative accounting' is worked through.

It's sad the US is destroying itself by short-sighted and antisocial policies. It's already the lowest scorer out of developed countries by a number of academically rigorous metrics including quality of life, health and access to health care etc.

And yet that still isn't enough for republican ideologues and fundamentalists. A regressive is a regressive regardless of whether they're a christian or muslim or whichever religious fairytale they choose to couch their ideological fantasy in.

Stop killing babies you Communist trolls!

But they taste so good.

Stop... dancing on cotton candy, you clown from Mars!

(are we playing the Make No Sense game?)

I'm a democrat, a liberal, a health-care provider and pro-choice, and I recognize that the removal of funding from abortion centers accurately reflects the diversity of opinion on the issue. Many people (by some polls a majority) in this country don't want their money paying for something they find morally reprehensible. This is a democracy and I think we should all accept that. This is hardly a war on women's health. Hyperbolic statements like that should not be taken seriously by anyone right or left.

Everyone seems to be emphasizing that money for abortion centers does not go towards abortions. This argument does not change the fact that people are uncomfortable with their money going to centers that perform abortions. It's the same problem people have with federal funding going to churches to do things other than preach - they are mistrustful.
Yes, lots of money goes to things that many people don't support, but that has little to do with my point. Viagra is not the abortion debate that has been given decades of discourse, scrutiny and obsessive legal action. In that time frame, it makes sense that a majority, or near majority opinion would come to this result.
When most people say they don't want money going to Planned Parenthood, and unless we want to make the case that this is a minority opinion rights violation, democracy has spoken.

Justin, as much as I appreciate you being a pro-choice man and a health care provider, I'm surprised you don't know that federal dollars have not gone towards abortion in OVER 30 YEARS thanks to the Hyde Amendment. And you're right, this isn't just a war on women's health, this is a war on the health of any person of any gender who can't afford insurance, it's a war on any person whose insurance company picks and chooses whose services are more important, its a war on any person that wants to be fully educated about how to live sexually health lives, it's a war on people across the globe whose only access to health care period is provided by international family planning funding. This is a war on women that will affect EVERYONE's health. And people need to realize this. So many people don't fully understand the implications of the budget cuts that are being proposed. Please educate yourself! Here's one place to start: http://blog.iwhc.org/2011/02/g...

Also, just a side note: it's funny how people don't object to the subsidization of things like Viagra, but birth control, they have a serious problem with. Huh, I think that's called misogyny.

And guess what? Their money ISN'T paying for abortion. It's paying for birth control. The vast majority of American women (98%, in fact) will use birth control at some time in their lives. And the majority of Americans think that low-income women should have subsidized access to birth control services. AND the majority of Americans think abortion should be legal, even if they wouldn't choose it for themselves.

You are correct that the majority of Americans do not want to have their taxpayer dollars go to abortion, and lucky them, their Congress actually cares about what they want their money to go to. I personally would prefer not to pay for penile implants for men on Medicare, or much more seriously highly immoral activities carried out by our government in Afghanistan, Iraq, and Pakistan, but I hardly see anyone making it their number 2 legislative priority.

Yeah it doesn't quite work like that. I don't want my taxpayer dollars going to asswipes like Boehner or BP, but it off it goes anyway.

I don't want to pay for illegal wars, but all anyone cares about are the miniscule number of medical procedures that women have the LEGAL right to have.

Justin, the federal funds are not used to fund abortion. They are kept seperate and used for preventative care such as birth control provision. Health care plans that routinely fund viagra do not provide funding towards birth control. So if people don't want to be funding abortions then they should be happy to support something that prevents the need for abortions rather than removing the funding (for birth control!) and thereby increasing the likelihood that abortions will take place.

I don't really care if these women want to get an abortion every time they get pregnant, but don't make the rest of pay for your stupidity.

PULLLLEASSEE!!! Do you REALLY expect ANYONE on the Left to be responsible for their OWN actions???? YOU have to pay for them!

Nearly 80 years since FDR and you don't understand that yet?

And when it comes to healthcare, its may be THEIR healthcare, but it is ALWAYS YOUR bill. That's simply a given in Left-wing ideology.

The saddest thing is that these parents drag their poor little kids out on a beautiful, Spring-like day to particpate in Mommy's whack-left demonstraction. They should have been having fun in the park somewhere.

Go back to stripping. Your political arguments are from outer space.

Maybe we should add "astronaut" to stripperlawyermodelceo. He keeps furthering the evidence that he wasn't a trial lawyer, given his incompetent arguments; perhaps he clerked for pet adoptions between angel investor meetings, zero grav training, and pole dances?

Actually, refuting you on this board has been, for me, a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.

Simply put, I don't think you're terribly bright.

>> a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent. >>

Isn't that a joke from like, the 1950's?

Now THAT would actually be interesting.

except in your distopia, the park would be a parking lot surrounded by chainlink fencing and probably littered with needles from all the drug addicts hanging out there.

Are you trying to say that all those Black children that you support aborting (and it IS black children, by a factor of 3x's) would end up as heroin addicts?

Is that why you so fervently support the genocide?

I don't see why encouraging people to reproduce responsibly and bring up their children to have access to the same rights and privileges that I do can possibly be construed as 'genocide'.

Poverty can and does happen to anyone, irrespective of race.

I might well turn the question around and ask why you so strongly support denial of planned parenthood - can you honestly claim that encouraging people who are completely ill-equipped socially, financially and in many ways psychologically to raise children could possibly have a positive effect on society?

Yes, the fact that the African-American population would be nearly 40% more than it is certainly has had a positive effect on society for you and your White Power friends, I'm sure.

None of that post actually addressed the point I was making. Go back and try again.

yes, shame on those parents for trying to teach their children about activism and democracy at an early age. how dare they!

Yes, I'm sure a little three year old understands all the aspects of contraception and abortion.

The good thing is that, ten years from now, Mommy will be able to explain to the little boys and girls that they have no brothers or sisters because Mommy dismembered them before they were born.

Can someone dismember you NOW?

Mysoginist, much?

I take your comment as a threat. It has been reported to the authorities.

ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!

lolz

She is a total nut case. Maybe a cocktail of Haloperidol/Lorazepam is what is called for here.It works wonders on the EDP's in the psych ward.

Yes.. "these women" (which ones?) want to get an abortion "every time THEY get pregnant." That's what pro-choice means. Every time we get pregnant because we are stupid, we run out and get an abortion.

Have you researched what Planned Parenthood actually provides?

I know that roughly 1/3 of the $1 BILLION annual budget comes from the government, so what was your point again?

a WHOLE BILLION

omg.. that's like... two fighter jets or something.

Seriously. I wish I could find the graph I was looking at last week that depicted US spending. I think people need to realize that we don't need 50% of our budget to go toward the military; we spend more than the next three largest defense budgets combined. Compared to that massive amount of money, the money put towards PP is a drop in the Atlantic.

None of the federal money pays for abortions. It only pays for STI testing, pap smears, etc

Unless these Planned Parenthood supporters are willing to pay for my trips to the eye doctor and the dentists (which aren't covered under my insurance), then I don't expect ANY federal money to go for their pap smear.

From a pragmatic point of view, I reap almost no benefit from paying for your eye doctor and dentist (except in the unlikely event that they catch a condition that untreated would lead you to require disability payments and Medicare for the rest of your life), while I save $3.80 for every $1 I spend on family planning services. I like saving money so I choose family planning.

I don't benefit from paying for someones STD tests or birth control. The only way you win that argument is admitting that these are the same people who place the cost of raising children on the taxpayer - and not themselves. It's called personal responsibility and it seems like a lot of people in this country don't know what that is.

I can't even begin to plumb the depths of idiocy present in this post.

"I don't benefit from paying for someones STD tests or birth control."

So you would rather STD's spread unchecked and maintain large scale outbreaks of such charming diseases as AIDS, syphilis, gonorrhea and chlamydia would not have a large scale economic impact as people unable to get treatment get ill, have their brains eaten alive or spend time miserable and alone because things are a "bit funky" down there and they don't know why?

You would rather that children are raised in slums, with no chance of education and grow up to be gangsters, or just terminally sick, mute disposable workers?

How can you rationally deduce that the above examples constitute 'no impact'?

Personal Responsibility is a great thing. I'll tell you what else is - Social Responsibility. That's the next step. Understanding that helping your community out pays dividends and serves to improves the lives of everyone around you.

I'm assuming that you have taken a vow of celibacy (priest? nun?) and only know and care about other people who have also taken a vow of celibacy (can't be a Christian then, I guess priest or nun is out) so that the safety benefits that the rest of us enjoy from increased STD testing in our communities doesn't apply to you. I forgot that some folks live in bubbles and so that public health initiatives don't benefit them

Are you secretly Howard Hughes?

Yeah! Screw everyone but ME! ME!!!

http://www.plannedparenthood.o...

This provides their most recent data explaining what it is that Planned Parenthood provides to these "stupid idiots" Again, how can some people be as ignorant as they are being?

>> Again, how can some people be as ignorant as they are being? >>

I don't know! It's like, you present them with facts and they bleat the same stuff over & over like they didn't retain the information.

Because it's a lot easier to plan how you're going to regurgitate your same old argument while your opponent is talking than it is to listen/read and actually sit back and think.

because they didn't click the link, and they didn't read it.

That full 1/3 is to support only abortions? I seem to have read that Planned Parenthood provides many other services: http://www.plannedparenthood.o...

Also, those that choose abortion also pay out of their pocket for that service. From the data that has already been posted, 97% of funding is for all non-related abortion services. Seems silly to get rid of their funding when almost all go to other services.

i'm addicted to this song right now, and i would really like to share it but i don't know where to post it, so...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...

hehehehehehe!!! NOW, THAT'S TROLLIN'!

(hiding)

PS why type when you can just click on "Like"? :-)

Chuck Schumer is a Senator.

you might actually be correct.

Why can't so many people see the benefit in being pro-active and preventative? Planned Parenthood is just that preventative and staying pro-active; helping to reduce and prevent the amount of health problems that many American citizens face daily who were not so lucky to be spoon-fed their whole lives!

Planned Parenthood does NOT equal 100% abortions....they help to prevent them from happening! They do so much more than people are so ignorant to realize...abortions are such a small percentage of what actually is done.

If you get rid of Planned Parenthood I guarantee there will be a major increase in unwanted pregnancies. What does this mean? More abortions! And not sanitary ones! For people that are talking about babies in dumpsters...this will be a common thing on every news station. People complain about their "tax dollars"? Well, say goodbye to more of your money than what your complaining about now! Many more people may be on more welfare, definitely more crimes, more diseases, etc.

Oh and one more thing might I add for all of those that want to push their religion on other people! Think about your daughter or son that ended up making one "mistake" and heaven forbid having sex once in high school with someone that was unsure if they were carrying any kind of disease and couldn't go get checked in to get tested. Now you have just given your daughter or son a disease or possibly pregnant because of being so ignorant!

i'am pregnant but i'am not sure it's mine,.pro life, pro choice your both annoying

It was inspiring to see so many people there yesterday.

Why do women have so many problems? They make up the majority of the world. They are 54% of the human population and the number is increasing. More men die from wars and women outlive them by ten to twenty years so it would be safe to say that if they just stand united they could probably be the most powerful voting bloc in the world. We should have had a woman president decades ago. Why are they so fractured? Are they enslaved by the manmind? Is the sisterhood of the traveling pants merely a movie and not a real lifestyle? ideas?

I don't know... there are quite a few women that I have run across who do not have any fight in them at all. They are happy to go along and not really care about issues or anything outside of their own lives. If they have husbands with health insurance they don't think about their sisters without it.

yep - but even more important robingee, these women's priorities are aligned with their husband's. The GOP has successfully placed a wedge between working and single women and those who are married and most likely at home with the kids. Consequently, they perceive a fight to increase the rights of women to be at the expense of their men.

Huge generalization I know -- but just my overall sense. We will need to appeal to these wives and mothers and see that this is a universal issue that impacts us all.

I know, it's hard to reach them.

Right on, sisters! Embryos are NOT humans...and neither are Republicans.

Gimme, gimme, gimme more government freebies now!

http://www.abortiontv.com/Pics...

Republicans fought to protect their precious private health insurers ("...they can't possibly compete against a single payer option!"). As long as the private insurance companies have control, out-of-pocket care is prohibitively expensive for most people. Planned Parenthood is really the only option for some.

I'm really beginning to think Republicans lack some sort of basic brain functionality. Every other industrialized nation around the world can successfully implement some sort of affordable health care for its citizens. Just because Republicans treat the "free market" as a religion doesn't mean it's best applied to everything.

Those other countries that have reasonable health care are socialist and communist! grrr!

Planned parenthood isn't free, stupid. It's low-cost health care. Not everyone has a job with health insurance, not everyone can afford it. Do you think that every job that exists in America is a wonderful, high-paying job with full benefits? Do you think that, if you don't have a job like this, you are lazy and do not deserve health care? Do you think that there are plenty of good, benefits-rich jobs to go around and people just choose not to take them?

PP provides birth control and education to women, so there are LESS unwanted pregnancies. Learn it.

Wish I could have been there! Awesome!

Note: Everyone who is bleating about "abortion" - you DO understand that PP is BASIC HEALTH CARE FOR WOMEN, right? You choose to ignore everything except the one thing you don't like.

Why should I have to pay for YOUR healthcare? Are you poor? Or just irresponsible?

In civilized countries, the government pays for everybody's health care, that's why.

Not to shock you or anything, but "the governemnt" is, umn...US!

There is no free lunch. The notion that there is has driven us to near bankruptcy.

actually tax breaks to the super-wealthy and their failure to re-invest into the economy and create jobs is what's driven us to near bankruptcy, as any economics student will be able to tell you.

You're such a totally brainwashed LibTard, its pointless to even reply to you.

EVERY tax cut...going back to the Kennedy Administration has INCREASED tax revenues in the years after. EVERY ONE.

You have an IDIOT, IMMATURE, UNPREPARED CelebriTard who was voted into office by silly LibTards. The reason people aren't hiring is because we don't know what is NEXT on the LibTard ideological agenda.

IDIOT!!!

How is Obama a celebrity? And putting "tard" on the ends of words is offensive.

Please link to the figures you used to draw this conclusion.

So I guess all the elderly should get a lump sum of all the money they paid into medicare in their lifetime and use that, and whatever other savings they have, to purchase their own health insurance.

Oh wait. No private health insurance company will ever insure someone over 65 because they're too likely to cost more money than they pay! Sorry Granny, no free lunch for you. Once you've spent all your money in a few years you're SOL.

Family planning saves money. Medicare is what's dragging us down (and Medicaid for long term care for those who run out of money paying for their nursing home stays).