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Paul Steely White, Transportation Alternatives

012111white.jpg IT'S THE ATTACK OF THE TWO WHEELED MONSTERS! As you surely know, an impassioned war debate about bicycles has consumed New Yorkers over the past couple of years. Are they taking over NYC with their ubiquitous lanes and their reckless behavior? Or are they the key to alleviating traffic and turning New York into a sustainable, 21st century city? The incredible cycling boom over the past decade has certainly polarized New Yorkers, as drivers, pedestrians and cyclists cope with the dramatic changes brought by the DOT to our traffic-clogged streets. And in the heart of the debate you'll find Paul Steely White, the Executive Director of Transportation Alternatives, a group that has worked closely with the DOT to improve the cycling, pedestrian, and mass transit infrastructure. Yesterday we caught up with White, who had just finished a meeting with City Councilman Eric Ulrich, who plans to introduce legislation requiring all adult cyclists to get licenses and registration.

Let's start with the bike licensing and registration. Have you been in touch with Councilman Ulrich? We had a meeting this morning in fact.

And how was that? I think it was productive. The Councilman told us quite frankly that he doesn't expect the bill to go anywhere, which came as a surprise to us, because I guess we learned in civics class that elected officials are supposed to introduce legislation that will have an impact and also have some chance of passing, and apparently he doesn't believe that. [Ed.: Ulrich tells us, "My comments meant to underline the fact that I doubt it will be taken up during the remaining session, given how close we are to the budget season."] Clearly he's trying to call attention to what he perceives as the number one public safety problem: bad cycling behavior. So we started the meeting by talking about what we believe are the top safety concerns in his district and this city, which is of course reckless driving.

He agreed that that's a problem, and we talked about some ways to address that, and then we got right down to business on his proposal and asked him how licensing might improve bike behavior, because we don't understand how that would work. We left the meeting completely unconvinced by his argument that it would reduce bike and run situations, where a biker runs into a pedestrian—and no one really knows how often that happens—but he's basing his proposal off one anecdote where an elderly woman was brushed by a cyclist and the cyclist kept going. So we talked about some ways we think would be smarter ways to address bike behavior.

But on the matter of bike licensing somehow improving bike behavior, he seems to think that it would be a deterrent, that cyclists would be more likely to stay at the scene in the event that they brush or strike a pedestrian on a bike, than not. If someone is inclined to bike and run, my guess is they're not going to be bothered to get their bike licensed, so if you think a few moves ahead, it seems to me that he's just trying to deter cycling and strike fear into the hearts of anyone who might get on a bike. So it does seem like a very punitive measure, clearly one that has not been well thought through.

We looked at other cities around the country and world, where bike licensing exists and really the only purpose it seems to serve, mostly in small towns—we're unaware of big cities that have done it, but Toronto had it then they discontinued bike licensing because of administrative hassle. But in small towns it really is a way to guard against bike theft, if someone's bike is stolen. There really is no link between licensing and behavior, so the conversation then moved to education and enforcement, and I think we achieved some common ground on those two points, that there is a lot the NYPD can do to enforce the worst types of bike lawlessness, like riding on the sidewalk, for example.

As you know we're in the midst of bike crackdown from the NYPD. They seem to be ticketing anything that moves with two wheels, what I think what we agreed on today is that we need more consistent, effective and targeted enforcement on the worst kinds of bike infractions, not just ticketing cyclists for not having the right color of reflector on their bicycle.

About the licensing issue, I was surprised that a friend of mine who is a regular cyclist is actually for it. She's had many brushes with death from cars, as most cyclists have had to one degree or another, and she feels if cyclists had little license plates and registered, drivers might treat them with more respect, as an equal vehicle of the road. What do you think of that? That sounds dubious to me. I don't see licensing or registering engendering any kind of respect, at least in New York. I mean, I think respect is hard won in New York, and we have reports of families riding with their kids not being respected on the road. So with a license plate I don't see that changing. What I do see changing the problem of respect is better bike infrastructure. We know that quality bike lanes not only give cycling legitimacy in the minds of motorist, I think, but more to the point reduce lawless bicycling on streets, like with 9th Avenue in Manhattan, where we have a good quality protected bike lane. Sidewalk cycling, riding the wrong way and all these types of bad bike behavior have reduced remarkably—as much as 80%—on these streets with good quality bike infrastructure. So we know that the surefire way to improve bike behavior—every New Yorker has their own idea about how this can be addressed—but I think we need to look at what actually works and those two things are better infrastructure and more targeted, consistent and fair enforcement.

Statistically speaking, cyclists are responsible for far, far fewer deaths and injuries than people behind the wheel of cars, and so the amount of vitriol and rage and contempt directed at cyclists these days seems wildly disproportionate. Why is there this seemingly huge backlash against bicycles now? Why all the bike hysteria, why all the disproportionate response, considering that the NYPD has historically not even tracked bike-on-pedestrian injuries because frankly it's been so low, and continues to be low? We do recognize however, since bicycling is growing so rapidly, people are becoming more aware of cyclists and a few people have been brushed by cyclists who are less than respectful, and that is a problem. And we need to address that with enforcement and education.

What it comes down to really is this: New Yorkers have very precise patterns. We live in a very dense city and people evolve particular patterns of dealing with density and we protect our personal space very carefully. I think bicycling is growing very rapidly and growing pains are to be expected. I think what we also have is a history of entitlement for driving in New York, where a very suburban transportation mode and planning policy has been shoehorned into a dense city environment. So whenever a single parking space is taken or there are a few more bicycles on the street than people are used to, then people are on edge because it's already very difficult to drive in New York City.

And people who drive in New York City are people who routinely are definitely angry, because frankly it's very hard to drive in a dense environment. That's why our organization fights very hard to make the alternatives to driving very attractive. So I think that there is just a lot of innate frustration that has to do with driving in the city and there is a perception that bicycles are adding to that. The data however shows that bicycles are actually making the streets safer and giving people an increasingly safe alternative for short trips that people make. About 22% of the driving trips that people make in New York are a mile or less in length, so the better our walking environment becomes, the better our cycling environment becomes, the easier it'll be for people to take those modes of transportation.

There have been recent reports of the NYPD issuing $270 tickets to cyclists running red lights in Central Park. What's your opinion is about cyclists and red lights? What do you think about what cyclists should do at red lights, and do you think this is something police should be enforcing strictly? The number one improvement to New York City cycling behavior should be to yield to pedestrians at all costs. Even when a pedestrian is crossing against the light, it is imperative that cyclists steer clear, stop, go behind a pedestrian and not in front of a pedestrian, instead of focusing on what cyclists should do in Central Park, which is frankly a very difficult situation because the Park has multiple functions for New Yorkers. For many it is a place to walk and see birds, for others it is a place they can train safely for an upcoming marathon or triathlon, so it is a very difficult task to figure out what the right solution is for Central Park.

It is really unfortunate that the NYPD, apparently to meet some quota for ticketing cyclists, is going and really cherry picking essentially, and going where the cyclists are instead of executing a more consistent and uniform enforcement policy that would yield what everyone wants, which is better cycling behavior. We're working with the Central Park Conservancy and the NYPD precinct over, the 33rd, to find a sensible policy that won't deter cycling in the park, because it really is the only safe place to ride and for kids to learn how to ride a bike, especially when cars are not in the park.

And the long term solution for Central Park with the red lights is of course, is to make the park completely car free, because right now the Park is serving a duel purpose as a motorway and a recreational asset. It is just increasingly inconsistent. So if the park were car free, you could do a lot of creative things not just with the signaling and changing that but also the way roads are portioned. Now cyclists and pedestrians are shunted over to that cramped and narrow space. When you are out in the road now, the first thing to be sure you are doing is yielding to pedestrians. Staying off the sidewalk is probably the second most important practice that all New York cyclists should keep in mind. One cyclist riding on the sidewalk engenders tons of ill will and strikes fear into the hearts of the elderly, who I think are more acutely aware of street danger and are already beset by motor vehicle hazards, so when cyclists are added to that mix that just puts some people over the edge.

012111lane6.jpg
Zoe Schlanger/Gothamist

I think we saw that in Park Slope, where senior citizens were mobilized to protest the new bike lane. You know I think back to your other question, without a doubt there is a surplus of anti-bike bias and I think the roots of that are probably very asinine. Everything from the culture we have here in America—that if you're not in a motor vehicle you somehow don't rate, to just the urban form we have here, where clearly motor vehicles get the lion's share of our precious public space. Motorists are rarely ticketed for the routine infractions, from motorists not yielding at the crosswalk to speeding, which is rampant. Anything that even begins to slightly curtail that kind of entitlement is going to engender a disproportionate response. That's what we're seeing now.

What we're also seeing is a lot of people coming around to the realization that when our streets are reapportioned—no one is talking about kicking cars to curb completely—but there is definitely a better balance to be struck, especially on streets like Prospect Park West, where there is a high demand for walking and biking. Other streets where cars have ruled the roads for 50 years, now it's time to strike a better balance and give New Yorkers what they want, which is a more livable environment, where they can live an active healthy life and that's what's attractive the new economy right now. It's not parking availability as much as people having the kinds of amenities and access to walking and bike lanes that is safe and accessible. That's where it's going and we applaud the efforts or our DOT commission to continue with the kinds of successes that we're seeing in Times Square and PPW and, most recently, the Select Bus Service on the East side. That had more to do with buses than bikes, but that project last year engendering a lot of support from across the East side. You know there were a fair share of skeptics who didn't see how reapportioning lanes to buses would work and predicted it would completely stall traffic, but the only thing that's happened is buses are faster and the majority of people there are enjoying a more efficient commute.

Speaking of the East side, is there any news on extending the bike lanes further north? We haven't received word yet, but we hope that we will soon. Later, actually next week, we're hosting a big community forum to release a collaboratively produced plan for the East side that includes community partners from Chinatown to Harlem. We hope that helps convince Mayor Bloomberg that it is a project worth extending, northward in particular. But no word on that, but we hope to receive word soon.

Is there anything else you wanted to address? At the meeting today, I think there were a few grains of hope. Councilman Ulrich wasn't aware of some of the efforts we're making and the city is making to better educate cyclists on the rules of the road: our biking rules program, the city's cycle smart brochure. We invited him on a bike ride; he said he rides a bike, and we invited him to ride with us during bike month coming up in May, so hopefully he'll take us up on that, but really in the next few weeks we really hope to bring him around to some of these more sensible ways to not just improve bike behavior but also making bicycling more accessible and safer for all New Yorkers, and we're still holding out hope he'll come around.

Did you actually get a look at any of his plan in writing? Did you see the actual proposed legislation?
No, and we did ask. Right now, it just seems to be an idea, napkin idea, and he seems to be backing off, as I mentioned at the outset. There's really, I think, no hope of this passing, and we're going to be working to make certain that's the case. We're confident that we can partner with the Council Member and the council at large to improve enforcement and continue to make bicycling safe with the roll out of new bike lanes. And I think also it is possible that in the next couple of years the city can start a formal city-sponsored bike education program. They have this in London, and other cities. It used to be compulsory for kids around the country in the '50s and '60s to get bike education in school. Bike New York does a great job, they have a bike education program that is somewhat limited, that I think would be great to expand, but I think a lot of New Yorkers are curious about biking and would love to get the skills to try it out, so if there is anything the city can do to facilitate that happening would be much more sensible than something that's punitive, that is going to reduce cycling.

We also talked about safety in numbers with the Council Member, and I think that was new to him too; anything that potentially deters cycling makes it more dangerous by definition, because we know from around the world whenever the cycling rate has tripled the crash rate has halved. And it is actually more than that in New York, where as cycling has skyrocketed we've seen the crash rate go down by more than that power relationship, though I don't have that exact number at my fingertips. But even the absolute number of crashes has gone down as cycling has gone up in New York. It bodes well for the future, provided we don't deter the wonderful blossoming of cycling we're experiencing now.

Contact the author of this article or email tips@gothamist.com with further questions, comments or tips.

Comments [rss]

  • To all the drivers complaining about cyclists breaking the law:

    1) When the light changes to yellow you ALWAYS slow down and stop, right?
    2) You ALWAYS come to a full stop at a Stop sign, right?
    3) You ALWAYS yield to pedestrians when turning, right?

    To the pedestrians:

    1) You ALWAYS cross the street at a designated pedestrian crosswalks and only when the light is green, right?
    2) You ALWAYS wait for for a cab or bus while remaining on the sidewalk, right?
    3) You ALWAYS remain on the sidewalk while waiting for the light, right? Never,ever step off the curb, right?

    Good, law obeying citizens. If you do all of the above then you're allowed to complain. If you don't then please keep your mouth and your web browser closed.
  • romkrr
    Surprising that the city is enabling bikers so much these days considering that they are not likely to be former drivers, but former MTA-ers.
    Loss of revenue from subway ridership, and cost to build all these bike lanes.
    However, Biking is a great thing to have in this city and its very hard to do it safely. I think the new rules are probably necessary. Bikers can't act like pedestrians, which is where their heads are at. I don't look forward to riding strictly in the direction of traffic, or stopping for full light duration - but it is probably the right thing.
  • Guest
    He isn't wearing a helmet.

    For shame.
  • kevd
    as is required by law when posing for photographs near bicycles

    I mean... ha.
  • Guest
    Being "surprised" by a bike is not the same as being hit by one. I've been riding in the city for more than five years and I can't tell you how many walkers are totally clueless about where they're walking.

    If they're not yammering on a phone, they are standing in the street off of the sidewalk (where the bikes are, ya know), cutting out from between cars, crossing against the crosswalk light, or just daydreaming. Every now and again you'll see someone surprised by a hybrid car, which they don't "hear" coming.

    I ride very courteously, stop at lights, signal, and use bike paths (and in my mid-40s am not setting any speed records) but I still get and dirty looks for (honestly) no reason. When you bike, you're constantly aware of your surroundings — as not to get hit or hit someone. That's more than can be said for pedestrians talking on their phones or drivers with the windows up and stereos blasting.

    Bike lanes help to reduce car speeds and allow an extra buffer for foot traffic. It's a proven fact that they help make streets safer for everyone.
  • kevd
    I particularly enjoyed being yelled at to "get off the sidewalk" when riding in a bike lane - by people who were walking in the bike lane.

    I tried to calmly explain their mistake, and failed. Some people are too dumb to teach.
  • "Some people got their heads so far up their butts that all they hear is mumbling when you're trying to explain anything to them."
  • TheFlatMan
    "he's basing his proposal off one anecdote where an elderly woman was brushed by a cyclist and the cyclist kept going."

    If this guy thinks this is the only incident where a cyclist endangered a pedestrian in NYC he's a total apologist and brain donor.
  • How many people are killed in NYC by cyclists annually? How many are killed by cars?
  • Rod
    you changed the subject.

    would you be right wing by chance?

    the issue wasn't "does this happen a lot". the issue was that Ulrich wasn't basing his plans on actual evidence and that his OWN understanding was that it's very rare.

    did you miss that key distinction?

    i thought so
  • TheFlatMan
    you changed the subject.

    I am not right-wing. Why do you think so? The political affiliation of a person does not matter when a cyclist is racing down Clinton Street or Seventh Avenue through red lights. This happens all the time.

    I know it is painful to have your prejudices confronted but if I opened your closed mind a little bit it was worth it.

    I thought so.

    Don't forget to capitalize, Rod, it marks you as an uneducated person.
  • Rod
    the political affiliation of a person DOES matter when engaged in a debate.

    if you believe in a virgin birth then I'm not spending another second debating with a kook.

    and I couldn't help noticing you changed the subject yet again.

    (real Liberals don't change the subject. they disprove what you meatheads say.)
  • kevd
    "you changed the subject."
    "Don't forget to capitalize, Rod, it marks you as an uneducated person."


    ??
  • kevd
    200,000 in 8,000,000 is 2.5%.
    So, I'd say that is significant.
  • FallOut
    Say you have a $100 in your pocket.

    If $2.50 falls out, would you say you lost a significant part of your money?
  • Fronko
    Brilliant logic.

    How about this? Say you have $8,000,000 in your pocket and $200,000 falls out. Would you say you lost a significant part of your money?
  • FallOut
    "Would you say you lost a significant part of your money?"

    No. I own mutual funds that go up and down 2.5% in a day! It's insignificant. I never lose sleep over such a fluctuattion.
    I've owned stocks that lost 80% of their value. That is significant.

    The current interest rates are well below 2.5% per year. Few people are investing in these instruments because the return is "insignificant".

    An income tax rate of 2.5% is insignificant. A rate of 35% is normal. A tax rate of 50% is significant.

    If 2.5% is a significant percentage, what word do you use to describe a percentage of 97.5%?

    Sorry, my friend. An increase of 200,000 people in a city of 8,200,000 people is insignificant, especially considering all the hoopla and the millions of dollars that DOT has spent in infrastructure and public outreach, not to mention all the efforts in time and money of TransAlt, streetsblog and others, and Gothamist's claim that it represents a "boom".

  • thendryjr
    [Shaking head] come on FallOut.... Seriously!? Do I have to crush you again in a debate?
  • FallOut
    "Again in a debate"?
    WTF are you talking about, newbie? You're quite delusional, aren't you?


  • thendryjr
    Hahaha.... Making reference to the other bike related article comment thread in which you decided to troll and debate the very same baseless argument. Debate- a discussion, as of a public question in an assembly, involving opposing viewpoints.

    Ha I swear your like an overzealous teenager filled with angst and with to much a yearning to use a verbose vocabulary in which you utterly fail to use properly. Stick with your video games my friend. You probably have a more thorough knowledge of all things relating to "forward, back, A, B".
  • Rod
    say Fallout has $1,000,000 invested, and his investor steals 2.5% ($25,000?)

    is Fallout going to contact the SEC or law enforcement or will he say $25,000 is insignificant?

    and if i mug him outside his home and only get $10 will he laugh and refuse to turn me into police because the sum is "insignificant"?

    gee i really wonder.

    Fallout = retard
  • kevd
    i'd get pants with better pockets.
  • FallOut
    And one to cover your butt better, because you are really showing us here what an asshole you are.
  • kevd
    he fails at humor as easily as he fails at logic
  • Rod
    DERPY DOOP DORP!
  • whitecastlerock
    I think the bike lane along Herald Square is under utilized-mostly because it is very poorly designed. I rarely see bikers-mostly push cart vendors, bums, and tourists waddling up and down the path. The bike line intersects a pedestrian promenade along 33rd street-rendering it very dangerous. My impression is that a lot of the bike lanes have been quickly added. Some paths in Astoria are alongside parked cars- I fear for the bikers who I do see get doored riding on these streets. It isn't pretty-pedestrians are complete idiots when glued to their hand devices with ear buds rendering them deaf, dumb, blind and mute.
  • StedyRuckus
    just because idiot pedestrians use a bike lane doesn't mean its poorly designed. It means that tourists and pushcart vendors are idiots
  • whitecastlerock
    Umm painting a bike riding icon alongside a pedestrian promenade is pretty bad design. I like the lanes that are separate from traffic-however there seems to be a mad dash to create bike lanes out of streets where it simply isn't sufficient to paint a bike rider on the ground. Why not do a good job with it? What is the hurry?
  • random transplant
    Thanks for the reassuring interview.

    Investing in a T.A. membership now seems a lot cheaper than paying to register a bike & getting an illogical ticket tomorrow.
  • Fronko
    ""The community asked for all the underlying data, in its raw form, and instead DOT intends to present a rosy summary..."

    The underlying data includes NYPD accident reports, which includes private information such as names and addresses of accident victims as well as descriptions of their injuries. I don't know about you, but if I was involved in an accident, either causing it or as a victim, I would not want documents containing my personal information handed over to a group of private citizens that includes a corrupt former deputy mayor. Because that's what they want: raw data, not edited.
  • FallOut
    ^twelveicat whine: "So, you AREN'T seeing more bikes in the streets?"

    What part of my statement, "I guess if you go from 100,000 in a year to 300,000, you may call that a 'boom' ", don't you understand?!

    Better stop wearing those Lycra tights. They're cutting off blood circulation to your brain.
  • StedyRuckus
    Whether its a drop in the bucket in NY or not, you'd be lying to yourself to think that 200,000 people is an insignificant number.
  • Rod
    it doesn't even matter the number.

    this is like fallout saying "we don't need to give faggots and negroes equal rights, b/c there are not many of them!"

    same shit, different day of ignorant bigotry.

    and when whites are soon the minority in the usa, ya think they'll still be using the same talking points about how the MAJORITY should be in charge!?
  • FallOut
    200,000 in a city of 8,200,000 - 2.4%- is an insignificant percentage!

    If you think 2.4% is a significant number, you better get a new calculator.
    Or, better, a new perspective on reality.
  • StedyRuckus

    You're right 2.4% of $100 is insignificant, because 100% of $100 is insignificant.

    If you truly think 200,000 people in a city of ANY size is insignificant, then its not us who needs a new perspective.
  • Rod
    there's an easy way to test this:

    FALLOUT - come by yourself and meet 200,000 of us in the part for a brawl.

    i think you're going to change your opinion when you have 500,000 punches to your clod head!
  • luke_1
    Your grasp of the human anatomy is amazingly poor.
  • FallOut
    Fail!
    My dog-eared, grad school copy of Gray's Anatomy belies your inane assumption.
  • Spirit of 76
    Is that supposed to impress somebody? People who actually use Gray's Anatomy get it long before grad school.
  • luke_1
    What? Was that some kind of modernist poetry? Please make sense.
  • In fall,
    liek 2 fallin snoflakes
    the moon
    is liek
    the gray anatomy book
    for i am many doctors, & mensa.
  • you realize that it's a small population of cyclists that wear lycra AND lycra is also worn by a ton of joggers?
    tired joke/pun/whatever, get a new one, please.
  • luke_1
    A lot of people who you definitely don't want to see in lycra are the ones who make fun of people wearing it, if you know what I mean. They think it is an insult because it wouldn't exactly be flattering for them.
  • FallOut
    Gee, we have a fucking fashion maven here on Gothamist! How sweet.
  • Rod
    fallout says "DEEPY DURPY DOO!"
  • Spirit of 76
    Ah, yes. If you can't argue with facts, then go with the ad hominem.
  • I in general support bikes. Man, they sure are better than cars, by a huge margin. Sure, there ARE bikers who are jerks, & I think those bikers SHOULD be ticketed-- but acting like bikers are the big problem is silly. People have a huge blind spot when it comes to cars-- you know how they all speed up to go through a yellow light, or run a red light? Yeah, THAT is way, way worse than a biker running a red light. Keep your stuff in perspective.
  • FallOut
    " cycling boom" ??
    LMAO

    Bike lanes are mostly empty; way more cars and peds to bikes - way, way more; plus, no figures to substantiate such a hyperbolic claim = more b.s. from the cycling zealots and their paid lobbyists.

    Let's get some real facts instead of bullshit. How many regular cyclists are there in NYC? 1 in 20? 1 in 100? 1 in 500?
    I guess if you go from 100,000 in a year to 300,000, you may call that a "boom". But in the grand scheme of NYC, it is a drop in the bucket.

    As a matter of fact, in today's Post, Norman Steisel, a well-respected Deputy Mayor, actually did a REAL survey and found that the DOT was bullshitting with its stats, something I've been saying here for years.
    I hate to tell you cycling zealots, but the government lies to us.

    Steisel: "The community asked for all the underlying data, in its raw form, and instead DOT intends to present a rosy summary," Steisel said.
    "We are getting only what DOT wants us to see. We have a right to more."

    If anyone one believes what a bloated bureaucracy like DOT claims, you are really naive to how NYC government works.

    Cycling boom? Don't make us laugh. It's a legend in your own mind.
  • Rod
    actually, millions more new yorkers would ride bikes, but after having their 3rd, 5th, 8th bikes STOLEN (right from under the noses of the largest and "finest" police force on earth?) they GIVE UP CYCLING.

    that fact is critical, but don't expect even TA to remember to mention it.

    everyone I know has had too many bikes stolen.

    and we can see bike carcasses by the thousands, abandoned by their owners, who give up.
  • Rod
    and what's really priceless is the DISHONESTY and retardation of those who say "get bikes off the sidewalks!" and "get bikes outta our car lanes!" and then when they put in proetcted bike lanes the STORY CHANGES to "how dare you get bikes off the sidewalk and give 'em their own lane?!:!""

    a dishonest retard can't change their stripes.
  • ShunHipsters
    Have you shunned a hipster today? www.shunhipsters.com
  • FallOut
    Funny! Whenever I try to picture the losers on this blog defending DOT and their little, pretty bike lanes, they all look those characters: a bunch, of whiney, scallion-armed, nasally, deadbeats.
  • Rod
    and you look like another ass-kissing right winger who can't think for himself and gets all his ideas from the nypost.
  • Fronko
    Steisel's "real" survey, a count of bikes using the lane, was conducted at the northern end of Grand Army Plaza. The DOT's count was conducted closer to the middle. Many cyclists who use PPW are coming from the south Slope or Windsor Terrace and use bike lanes on 9th St, 3rd St, 2nd St, etc. to continue commuting elsewhere in Brooklyn or to the bridges to Manhattan. (Few people who start their commutes near the northern end of PPW need to ride on that bike lane to get to Manhattan or downtown Brooklyn.) So, since there is no connecting bike lane near GAP, of course you'd see a smaller number of bikes down there.

    To prove the point, Steisel's numbers and the DOTS's were nearly identical when the same survey was conducted on a Saturday, when more people were riding bikes all the way down to the end of the bike lane to go to the farmer's market at Grand Army Plaza. Even Steisel's NIMBY group agrees on this point. (You can read their own report on this point.)

    If Steisel & co. had moved their count to the same block as the DOT they would have counted the same number of bikes.

    To compare, I'm pretty sure if I stood at the very end of the LIE, I would not count as many cars there as I would somewhere closer to Queens. But if you gave my survey at the end of Long Island the same credence as the DOT's closer to the city, you could reason that there's no need for a highway.

    Nevermind, the facts however. If anyone believes what a bloated former bureaucrat like Norman Steisel claims, you are really naive to how NYC government used to work.
  • FallOut
    You make some assumptions in the first paragraph, but without any evidence or stats to back them up.

    E.g., it could just be validly argued that as many using the PPW lane entered at GAP and exited at 9th St, 3rd St, 2nd St, etc, as entered there and continued southward - your points of reference.

    All I know is that the bike lanes where I live are underutilized and that when I FOILed some DOT stats a few years ago, what those actual stats revealed and what DOT had previously claimed orally in public were way off. In fact, DOT had no stats. They just lied and said they had them, and sent out a team of surveyors to get the results that were FOILed.

    I'm sorry. If you want to believe as gospel what the government tells you, be my guest. Personally, I rely on what I see, not what bureaucrats would have us believe.

    For instance, here is your heroine, Sadik-Khan addressing the gothamist cycling zealots: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...

    Is that you in the front row?
  • Fronko
    Considering that there's an assisted living facility at the start of PPW, no apartment units in the arch, and no connecting bike lanes, it's a stretch to argue that many trips are starting or entering at GAP.

    Also, it can't be argued that lots of people entered at GAP, because the NBBL people's entire point is that not too many did, therefore the bike lane isn't necessary. I think that's your point, too, so if you're now saying you could argue that a lot of people could start at GAP or enter there, I'm not sure I follow your logic.
  • FallOut
    So, all the people coming up Flatbush from Downtown and Vanderbilt wouldn't be entering on GAP?

  • Fronko
    Well, there's no bike lane on Flatbush, so my guess would be that it's not a huge route for cyclists coming towards the park, even on weekends. As for people coming from downtown, there is a bike lane on Plaza Street, so it is definitely possible that many of these reverse commuters could be entering the lane at or near GAP. I'll give you that.

    But the south Slope and Windsor Terrace has some of the highest bike commuting rates in the city. Most of those people, when they commute into Manhattan or downtown Brooklyn, are probably gone from the PPW bike lane well before they get anywhere near GAP.
  • StedyRuckus
    You really think that DOT sent out a team to gather stats in response to your FOIL? You think pretty highly of yourself don't you?
  • FallOut
    You really are quite ignorant of how this City operates , aren't you?
    When you learn, then I'll respond to your comments.
  • StedyRuckus
    if you honestly believe they sent out a team to perform a study to respond to your specific FOIL request, then you have no idea how this city, or any organization works. Unless you hold some high ranking government position, they are not performing studies in response to your inquiry dummy.
  • StedyRuckus
    You are automatically disqualified. Norman Steisel, a "well-respected" deputy mayor??? Are you kidding me? He was busted trying to pick up a prostitute off the street in Brooklyn. No respect in that.

    There is a cycling boom, my friend, open your eyes, they are everywhere. I grew up here and have always rode. I was a bike messenger for a couple years in the mid-nineties and used to commute by bike to Hunter College every day for four years. Point is, I've been on the road on my bike a lot, and very much aware of ridership. There is a boom. Everyone and there mother is riding now. They love the bike lanes, and they aren't scared to ride in NYC streets now because of them.

    You're right. There are more peds and cars than bikes. Doesn't mean there shouldn't be bike lanes. By your logic I could say there are more daily subway commuters than drivers, and more pedestrians than drivers, so we should shut down streets to auto traffic.

    And if anyone believes an informal non-scientific study from an arse like Steisel over DOT, then they are morons.
  • FallOut
    Your puritanical comment regarding Steisel's sex life notwithstanding, he was respected in his position as deputy mayor, and your peculiar interest in what he does in his private life shows how desperate you are to discredit his career and his current statistics. If you are without sin, go ahead, cast the first stone. Otherwise, stick to facts.

    Facts are not: "Everyone and there mother is riding now"

    How many NYers are actually partaking in the hyperbolic claim of a ' cycling boom'?
    I ventured that there is an increase of perhaps a few hundred thousand, which you did not dispute. I followed that with the statement that in a City of some 8.2 million people, a few hundred thousand is a mere drop in the bucket. Surely you do not disagree with that.

    Once you get over your interest in Steisel's sex life , please address the issue. Thank you.
  • Rod
    "respected" by who?

    it's you right wing tards who always praise big government.

    I've never seen a smart deputy mayor and I doubt we ever will. it's a position for political cronies, not intellectuals.

    YOU WERE PROVEN WRONG.

    take it like a man.
  • StedyRuckus
    I'm not without sin, but I am not a lawbreaker. (prostitution is illegal, in case I need to remind you). I don;t care what he does in his home. He was on a public street soliciting sex from a street walker. That is illegal. And its not that I care what he does to get off, but in response to you referring to him as well-respected, when in fact, he is not well-respected at all for precisely the reason I am referring to.
    Your reading comprehension is pretty low.

    Whereas my comment of everyone and their mother is not a fact, but an observation, just as your refutation that there is no boom is your opinion (though a poorly supported one).

    We can give you plenty of facts though if you like. The one agency charged with monitoring these sorts of numbers is the DOT. The problem is, idiots like yourself, who for some reason think people riding their bikes is a bad thing, refuse to believe the data that DOT provides.

    There is however a secondary form of data that would could be conclusive, and that would be the rise in business of bike shops across New York City. How does a 40% increase in business over the past 2 years sound, because that's the average that bike shops across the city have reported to me.

    And again, 200,000 people is a mere.025% of 8 million. But I don't care... 200,000 people is a lot of effin people. If a politician receives 4,000 letters you better believe that they sit up and pay attention. Don;t tryto tell me that 200,000 is small number.
  • kevd
    Dude. Please.
    200,000 is 2.5% of 8,000,000.
    Please stop saying its 0.025%.
  • FallOut
    Thanks.

    I wasted enough time with an ignoramus like Stedyruckus who failed 6th grade math, as well as Civics. Maybe, he'll listen to you.
  • kevd
    Well, he did some division and didn't move the decimal place when converting the raw number to a percentage.
    But you're just a douche. A douche that's pathetically desperate for attention.
  • FallOut
    Glad to see I annoy you.
  • smorrebrod
    Get back to your cave. It better not have WiFi.
  • FallOut
    Anyone who claims " I am not a lawbreaker." is a liar, plain and simple!!

    Never smoked pot? Never drank underage? Never ran a red light? Always reported each and every cash payment to IRS? Never jaywalked? I suppose your shit don't smell either?

    But you confirm my statement by saying, "200,000 people is a mere.025% (sic) of 8 million". "Mere" is the keyword. "Mere' certainly is not a "boom", except in the mind of someone who claims never to have broken a law.

    A 40% in bike shops? Be specific. You mean they went from 10 to 14, say? Ha! There are more Duane Reades in my community than that.

    As far as DOT being honest and truthful, have you ever FOILed DOT?
    Try it sometime.
    I did. I caught them in outright lies. You'd be surprised at what they have in their files and what they claim to the gullible public like yourself. Very surprised.

    But, instead of arguing with me, I have a nice video for you to view. It is Diktator Sadik-Khan addressing the annual meeting of Transportation Alternatives: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...
  • kevd
    Boom is a reference to a change in percentage, not the total number.
    if 10 people rode last year and 40 do this year, thats a boom.
    If 7.9 million rode last year and 8 million ride this year, that is not a boom.
  • StedyRuckus
    Dude you really can't read can you?

    Not a 40% increase in number of bike shops - of which there are more than 120 in the 5 boroughs - but a 40% increase in BUSINESS. As in their sales have increased 40% over the past two years. Any business in America would kill for that sort of increase, even in a excellent economic climate, much less than what we are mired in currently. What a yutz you are.

    And you can talk about FOILing DOT, why don;t you be a little more specific. What exactly did you uncover? Blow the lid off this thing man! Blow my mind!

    Thirdly - What is so incriminating about the JSK speech?

    Fourthly -Touche - perhaps I have broken a law or two in my day. I'm so glad that you are defending the right of a married man to pick up street hookers and get a $5 blowie on Nevins Street. Besides, there are different level of standards for public servants. If you think its appropriate for public servants and government officials to exploit sex workers. Then good for you!

    Lastly - You can focus on the 200,000 as a portion of the city all you want. 200,000 is a BIG ASS NUMBER. Any politician in the city would be falling over backwards to get a voting bloc of that size. 200,000 is more than the number of soldiers who stormed Normandy on D-Day. 200,000 is larger than the size of Alexander the Great's army that conquered the civilized world. 200,000 is the population of Rochester New York or Des Moines, Iowa. 200,000 people would be 109th largest city in America. And 200,000 is only the increase!!!!

    Nah, but its cool. You are condemning bicycling and bicycle lanes, and yet are defending nothing. If you are cool with speeding traffic, massive pollution, old ladies getting run down on boulevards of death, and the death of public space in NY. If you are cool with disconnect from your fellow citizens, and neighbors and prefer to see life speed by at 70 mph, then I truly feel sorry for you sir.
  • FallOut
    40%? Stop with the bullshit percentages! Give us dollar figures, if they actually exist and not concocted from the hyperbolic imagination of a blatant liar who had claimed never to break a law, and a prude who is more obsessed with Steisel's dick than his wife apparently is.




  • Rod
    fallout is fake troll.

    who probably wears a bowtie.

    ignore him.

    he's not interested in an honest debate.

    i'm just hoping he jaywalks in front of me!
  • luke_1
    No one said that there are more cyclists than drivers around. But really, I'd like to see some of your data on this. I see that you monitor bike lane traffic since you can confidently say that they are mostly empty, whatever that even means.
  • anon_cyclist
    I'm also curious. How many miles do you commute above ground and how aware are you of all the different cyclists on the road all day, every day?

    For the last few years I have ridden my bike an average of 15 miles a day, every day between Brooklyn and Manhattan. A majority of that is along the same or similar route, and typically the same times of day. I always see quite a handful of people riding bikes, and very rarely do I see the same people. Trust me, you do recognize people when you see them daily and a new face is always a new face.

    If you are driving, keep in mind that bike riders are obviously not moving as quickly as you or necessarily on the same roads.

    Also, we all know (and argue) about how many red lights most bike riders to disobey. I'm sure that if or when every person on a bike starts sitting at all the lights, you will see congestion and then everyone in their cars will get mad that there are bikes in front of them waiting to legally go through the green light they were mad about them running when red in the first place.
  • twelveicat
    So, you AREN'T seeing more bikes in the streets? I was under the impression that the reason that we have this much anger and unwarranted vitriol is because all of a sudden there are more bike riders.

    You're saying that there are indeed NOT more bike riders? What is everyone complaining about then if there aren't more bike riders? Maybe they're just mistaken and really it's elephants in the street with little pink ponies on their backs.

    You sir, are an idiot.
  • jibbly
    Hook, line, and sinker.

    Don't debate the new gothamist troll. He get's hungrier and hungrier.
  • Rod
    and if you follow city politics you see that BIKE LANES are the new talking points of the ignorant, along with "immgrants' and "unions".

    just another scapegoat for the goombahs.

    that's a main reason for the war on cyclists by the tyranny of the majority.
  • hotstepper
    "yeah, everyone rides a bike, when they're fucking six!"
  • FallOut
    Right! At least at six, you're allowed to ride on the sidewalk, not like the Peter Pan cyclists who infest our city.
  • We have actually "outgrown" average zombies that infest our city.
  • Ragingsemi
    "Peter Pan cyclists"? Please explain, because none of the cyclists I know have the ability to fly, although I have seen a couple with green tights, and more than a few that really like the pixy dust. Did I just answer my own question?
  • FallOut
    Google "peter pan syndrome"
  • Ragingsemi
    Peter Pan syndrome: Term coined by pop psychology author Dan Kiley in his book "Peter Pan syndrome: Men Who Have Never Grown Up."

    Peter Pan is in reference to J. M. Barrie's classic 1904 play in which a boy who refuses to grow up teaches Wendy and her younger brothers how to fly and then it's off to magical Neverneverland for adventures with mermaids, Indians, and wicked Captain Hook and his pirate crew. The play's full title was "Peter Pan, or, The Boy Who Would Not Grow Up."

    The Peter Pan syndrome is not at this time a medically accepted syndrome,

    Still don't get it...maybe I'm just stoopid?
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