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If the Health Department has its way, smoking Santas will be ousted from city parks. (Pixietart's Flickr)
One day after city health commissioner Dr. Thomas A. Farley revealed his intention to expand the city's smoking ban to parks and beaches, something terrifying happened: We woke up this morning to find ourselves in complete agreement with conservative NY Post demagogue Andrea Peyser. Obviously, this means that we were wrong in supporting the ban and ought to start smoking Lucky Strikes at once. Peyser opines:
Visiting the beach or the park should no longer require an oxygen mask. If one wants to smoke, there are places to freely enjoy that activity. Like China... The idea won't sit well with the pathologically addicted few who continue to force innocent citizens to unwillingly breathe their poisons. But this is a scenario whose time has come... Few things are more aggravating and disgusting than being forced to swallow fumes emitted by a mother, father, grandpa or stalker whose bond with nicotine prevents them from stepping outside the city's precious, toddler-filled recreation areas in order to slowly kill themselves.
Others, like smoker-on-the-street Ronald Carey, 63, tell the Daily News, "It's really ridiculous. I'm not going to support smoking, but things have gotten out of hand. What's next?" Hm, let's see, drunken gunslinging? Anyway, it's unclear that Mayor Bloomberg is even 100% behind the proposal, which was buried within the big public health initiative announced yesterday. Last night the Mayor's office released a statement explaining that Hizzoner wants "to see if smoking in parks has a negative impact on people’s health. It may not be logistically possible to enforce a ban across thousands of acres, but there may be areas within parks where restricting smoking can protect health."
Officials say the ban may require the approval of the City Council, but could possibly be implemented through administrative rule-making by the Parks Department. Council Speaker Christine Quinn tells the Times, "Conceptually, that’s an idea I’m very, very interested in and open to," but "fines should be modest and not intended primarily to punish." Similar smoking bans in public parks and beaches have been enacted in California and Chicago. What do you think?
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From that quote, I can't tell if Peyser is serious or seriously dripping with sarcasm.
Andrea Peyser does not understand sarcasm.
If you can't smoke them anywhere, then why are they legal?
I thought the same thing when I read this but then thought well they won't have anything they can tax the shit out of. I also thought where do they draw the line? Soon enough it'll be you can't smoke in your own home.
You can't smoke in your home if:
The smoke bothers your sensitive neighbors, especially in a coop.
You share custody of a child and and the non-smoking parent fears second-hand smoke.
You like to blend your own gasoline in the kitchen.
For what it's worth, it's not a legislator's concern to ensure that his/her laws/regulations are consistent with common sense or/any other laws/regulations.
what's up with all the santas? same thing with the pic used on the SI ferry story.
SantaCon! Ho ho ho!!
The thing that really bothers me is that for some reason smokers don't think they are littering when they toss their butts on the ground, otherwise its outside the smoke is avoidable enough.
It isn't always "avoidable enough" -- there are plenty of times when I get stuck behind someone on a crowded sidewalk, and just have to deal with it as they exhale large clouds of smoke over their shoulder.
God, I'm so divided about this. On the one hand I hate cigarette smoke - I'm allergic to nicotine and it also triggers migraines in me. I find that many smokers are cavalier about their own safety and the safety of others - which was fully illustrated to me when I tried to pass a smoker on the sidewalk and got burned by his ciggie. Apparently having an animated conversation while waving around a flaming piece of paper, on a crowded sidewalk, is a good idea to these people. I also really hate that every building courtyard that still allows smoking has become a gauntlet of smoke clouds. It's blissful to be able to enjoy bars and restaurants without worrying about debilitating headaches.
On the other hand, we have to draw the line somewhere. I'd like it if smokers were politer and more cautious, but you can't legislate behavior, no matter how hard you try. It's not like we don't already have enough friggin laws around here!
SECOND-HAND SMOKING RESULTS IN LIVER DISEASE, STUDY FINDS
ScienceDaily: Latest Science News
Sep 14, 2009 8:00:00
Scientists have found that even second-hand tobacco smoke exposure can result in nonalcoholic fatty liver disease, a common disease in which fat accumulates in the liver of people who drink little or no alcohol. The researchers found fat accumulated in liver cells of mice exposed to second-hand cigarette smoke for a year in the lab. Such fat buildup is a sign of NAFLD, leading eventually to liver dysfunction.
http://feeds.sciencedaily.com/~r/sciencedaily/~3/2_KR3c-8Wzk/090910142425.htm
Or rather:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8kWMgQpgq-4
just wait, this is only the beginning. it's only a matter of time until they come after something you care about under the guise of the public welfare. Bloomberg is evil.
This isn't about public health, this is about restricting the rights of people you disagree with.
If we're really interested in public health, the first step is universal health care.
The lack of affordable health care is a much bigger threat to public health than secondhand smoke, especially in outdoor areas.
okay - you walked into this one - you say affordable healthcare is more important, I agree with you - but if there were less smokers, wouldn't you believe that it might make a dent into how much we're all going to be paying for it?
smokers are very expensive - I saw this guy who was 65 years old last weekend - he was a 3 pack a day smoker until like 6 months ago and let me tell you - he has so many things going on that it made me resent him for a fleeting moment that I might have to pay for his illnesses someday b/c he chose to smoke. Again, I am an ex-smoker, so I am the worst kind of anti-smoker - but you bring up a valid point about weighing down the the healthcare system.
just sayin.
let's see how many things are wrong with you when you're 65 years old. even non smokers get serious illnesses.
smokers are already the lepers of this city. I don't see many light up on the grass and I too would be pissed finding butts on the beach but for the most part they're in the periphery. OK, maybe at the hipster outdoor shows you'll see more but even then I would hope some of them would be considerate to know not to light up in such a close environment. (I've seen 2 Japanese tourists light up)
When I went to college some professors allowed us to smoke. I don't think there was one complaint.
You seem to forget that our lovely politicians already tax cigarettes up to the wazoo, that is supposed to go to health care, not their little pork projects.
The point of taxing cigarettes is to cover the social cost of smoking on third parties, not litigation awards, not Mr. Espada's cronies and car armada, and much less Charlie Rangel houses and apartments all over the place.
You should check out the north end of Central Park. There's just as many cigarette butts there as goose shit. I don't know where you are that people aren't puffing it up....
I'm in Tribeca and go to the hudson river parks.
Are these butts on the park lawn? then that's littering.
but smoking on a park bench I see no problem with. then we should give out tickets for littering, Yes, I've gotten one before for a gum wrapper discretely tossed to the side of a building. yep, if it wasn't for bad luck, I wouldn't have any luck at all.
Then that's the park to go to apparently. However, up north in Riverside, Morningside, and Central Parks it is all about puffing smoke and littering. Maybe if there was less of that shit to clean up, then "officials" could focus on eutrification of the Meer, the giant piles of dog shit everywhere, and people getting mugged.
I'm no fan of smoking. It adds to the low level smog, smells horrible, and causes breathing problems, but to be honest, if smokers were a little more considerate and less persistent in forcing nonsmokers to deal with their zeal, we really wouldn't be discussing this two days in a row.
sorry it's a double whammy for you. dog crap is one for me, for sure. I love the parks down here, no dogs on the law and few smokers. so few, my friends feel self conscience about lighting up. enforcement can be a bit harsh but that's why it's so clean.
but sometimes when the tide rolls in, now that's stinky.
and, I was always a considerate smoker, never flicked a butt, usually went down a sewer grate. there's one on almost every corner.
If you truly believe in liberty, str1cken, you can't be against this ban and then for another federal tax to insure others.
I'm happy that the poll is showing a libertarian streak in people. I just wish there was more consistency. People should be able to smoke outside. People should be able to drink outside, too. If someone is blowing smoke in your grill, be polite and ask them to turn downwind. Instead of this, we may get a law so people can tattle on others. How about civility? And how about personal responsibility, huh?
I would be okay with having sections of beach made non-smoking...it is an annoyance, and they tend to leave their butts in the sand, which is gross for everyone involved.
But I am not in favor of banning smoking OUTSIDE, for God's sake.
Where is my mobile plastic bubble?!
yes, plaese continue to take away more and more of my rights. if this passes what is next?
You have a right to blow carcinogenic smoke in my face?
Oh absolutely. I agree with you 100%. No one should have the right to walk up to you and blow smoke in your face. But we're talking about having the right to smoke in public parks in general.
There is no "right" to smoke.
@Str1cken: Even when smokers aren't intentionally trying to blow smoke in people's faces, it gets in people's faces. We're all breathing the same air; smokers can't will their smoke to only stay around themselves.
by your logic we should also ban cars because they blow exhaust fumes in my face.
I want farting in public made illegal too.
Nah, start with the subway cars and then move above ground.
Ticketing smokers who toss their cigarette butts for littering is the way to go.
There are a lot of people arguing the cigarette but is polution card, but honestly, if that's an issue why not put up more recepticles, little sand stands, whatever... it's kind of hard not to throw them on the ground when there is nowhere else provided, or would you rather the hot butt get thrown in a trashcan full of flammable garbage?
I don't doubt there are plenty of people throwing them on the ground but, i also don't doubt, that provided the means, they would use a designated disposal. Granted you will always have ill mannered people, but for the most part, most people are considerate enough.
I'd have to agree that there should be more places to put out cigarette butts. A lot of busy bars have sand buckets nowadays and most people seem to use them. But yea, when I'm walking down the street I'm not about to toss a lit cigarette into a trash can.
And, if we're really complaining about a trash issue, then cigarettes seem to be a pretty minor one, at least in my experience. They might be more frequent but they're tiny, barely noticeable, and don't smell. What about the piles of garbage that sit on Grand St or Myrtle Ave all day? Deal with those first, please.
oh... you can smell it? Fine, I'll let my dog shit right next to you instead, I bet that's more enjoyable while you're eating. At least it's still legal.
You and your delicate little sensibilities. Tell us; how else can we conform NYC to you and your likes, hmm?
From what I understand, in Japan (or at least major cities) people almost never smoke while walking. They stop, find an unobtrusive place to light up, and smoke. When they're done, they put out their butts and discard them into public ashtray/receptacles. No one just flicks their used, burning butt into the street. FWIW Japan probably has one of the highest percentages of smokers in their population.
You can smoke on underground subway platforms in Tokyo, too.
Well, you don't have to wonder, pollution does bother me. Which is why I vote for and support more environmentally sound policies and technologies. To be clear, I don't mind the smoke so much as the jackasses who think I'm "taking away their rights" by expecting them to put their butts in the trash. If smokers continue to act like impudent children, they will get treated like that.
Why don't I just avoid the smokers? I do, why don't they just kill themselves more quickly? Jump in front of a train and save us all the medical costs, which we all pay for you selfish shits.
yo0u pay my doctor bills? Really?
Gimme a break, we all know you're unemployed. Nice try though.
That santa's smoking!
ha!
If Bloomberg wants an election year winner, he should forget about his obsession with smokers for a minute and go after the graffiti vandals.
@PKMKII:
Yes, it is a right. I don't smoke but I am God-Dammned allowed to light a cigarette and blow it in your face for being an obnoxious prick.
Who are you to tell me what I can and can't do? I am a grown up and can make my own decisions.
@PKMKII:
Yes, it is a right. I don't smoke but I am God-Dammned allowed to light a cigarette and blow it in your face for being an obnoxious prick.
Who are you to tell me what I can and can't do? I am a grown up and can make my own decisions.
And then PKMKII has the right to have you arrested for assault.
As Oliver Wendell Holmes said: The right to swing my fist ends at the point of another person's nose." You have the right to do what you wish; you don't have the right to force others to inhale your secondhand smoke and share your habit with you. If secondhand smoke didn't cause real health problems for others, it wouldn't be an issue.
LMAO... Assault? for blowing smoke on someone's face? What a pansy..... I'd love for you to try that.... I'd put a lawsuit so far up your ass your grandchildren would be paying...
Same goes for punching someone for blowing smoke up your face.
If you walk up to someone and just deliberately blow smoke in their face, it could fall under the category of fighting words and that punch could be legally justified.
Besides, smoking is usually dominate by lower-class, lower educated people and judges are quite the opposite. The odds of a smoker friendly judge are rather slight.
Awww, how sweet! Like most people who feel the need to make aggressive threats on Gothamist, ten to one, when you're not hiding behind a computer, you're a frustrated, cowardly wimp. If there ever were an example of the "lower class, lower-educated" people ANGRYGOD has mentioned, you're it.
I'm sure the logic will go over your head, but ANGRYGOD is right. The moment you act in a physically aggressive manner toward someone, they have the right to press charges for assault. They also have the right to defend themselves. Any judge in this city would laugh a lawsuit protesting that right out of court.
Ban cars, buses and all that good stuff too!
:D
I wish they would ban cars from Central Park.
right. i will stop polluting your air with my cigarettes when you stop polluting my air with your car.
Being a non-smoker, I really don't mind smokers in moderation. But that's not what happens. They consistently push the limits of "their rights". They chain-smoked themselves out of Bars and Restaurants, and now congregate in little packs in front of buildings.
To the other posters, yes, it's about rights, MY rights not to inhale your @%$^ stench...do us all a favor, grow up and throw your butts in the trash and maybe daddy Bloomberg won't have to spank you.
it's funny, people like you. "I don't want to breathe in carcinogens" - so how do you avoid the fumes released by all the cards that drive past you? How do you avoid the black smoke billowing out of buses? If you don;t want to breathe carcinogens - don;t want to breathe all of them not just the ones you pick and choose because that only serves to make you and your ilk look retarded. Sick air is sick air - there are way more cars than smokers, I'm curious as to why those don't bother you.
Well, you don't have to wonder, pollution does bother me. Which is why I vote for and support more environmentally sound policies and technologies. To be clear, I don't mind the smoke so much as the jackasses who think I'm "taking away their rights" by expecting them to put their butts in the trash. If smokers continue to act like impudent children, they will get treated like that.
Why don't I just avoid the smokers? I do, why don't they just kill themselves more quickly? Jump in front of a train and save us all the medical costs, which we all pay for you selfish shits.
Thank you !!!!
and for your information etypical - i have lived here for 11 years and maybe I was born somewhere else, but at least I was around when this place was a true dump. Please spare me about the weak ones to go home to ohio, I am sick and tired of amped up jerks like you making this place look bad. Just b/c you have lived here your entire life doesn't it deserves an upgrade. Sorry sweet treats, some of us who have lived here a long time are a little tired of - the dog crap, the bus smog, the smell of pee in the subway, and frankly, people like you.
You're probably not even old enough to remember when this place was a complete mess. again, spare me.
"i have lived here for 11 years and maybe I was born somewhere else, but at least I was around when this place was a true dump. "
This is hilarious. You really and truly think that New York City was "a true dump" in 1998?
Really, that's all anyone needs to know about you.
wow... you're really pissed off. maybe you should simmer down a little sweets.
why is it hat every time a society attempts to evolve some people perceive it as restrictive to their freedoms? no way would cigarettes ever be approved for use today, knowing what we know now about them. Speed limits on highways, building codes, and other such limitations to our "freedoms" are necessary steps along the way to becoming a civil and safe society. Addictive, cancer-causing personal pollution devices need to follow suite.
As I said before, if we're really interested in "evolving", let's catch up with the rest of the industrialized world and have universal health care.
Until we take legitimate, serious steps to protect and maintain the public health at large, the argument that we're interested in public health will be a clear excuse to impose the preferences of others on the minority (a minority that, at this point in smoking's history, is drawn almost entirely on class lines).
How about this: let's ban all non-commercial vehicles in the city (there is way way way more car exhaust in the air then cigarette smoke), and we'll add the no smoking in public anywhere, you must be in your bathroom with the door locked exhaling into a jar, law.
That I can get behind.
As I said before, if we're really interested in "evolving", let's catch up with the rest of the industrialized world and have universal health care.
Until we take legitimate, serious steps to protect and maintain the public health at large, the argument that we're interested in public health will be a clear excuse to impose the preferences of others on the minority (a minority that, at this point in smoking's history, is drawn almost entirely on class lines).
How about this: let's ban all non-commercial vehicles in the city (there is way way way more car exhaust in the air then cigarette smoke), and we'll add the no smoking in public anywhere, you must be in your bathroom with the door locked exhaling into a jar, law.
That I can get behind.
"why is it hat every time a society attempts to evolve some people perceive it as restrictive to their freedoms?"
a laughable statement. many societies have attempted to "evolve" only to eventually be overthrown as oppressive themselves. re: cultural revolution, bolshevik revolution, etc.
Right, because going 50mph in an 8 lane divided highway is evolution. Just wait 'til you try to obey those speed limits and get buzzed and tail gated. Tell us how safe you'll feel then.
this is fucking bullshit. it has nothing to do with public safety and everything to do with harassing smokers with more taxes...ooops...i mean "fines".
I'm not a smoker, but I say "BOOOOOOOO!"The criminalization of smoking is absurd!
Once again although I think it's a great idea, Bloomberg did not come up with it. Just look around, butts are everywhere. Most smokers are slobs - that is a fact! Stay at home and indulge in that filthy habit.
I was gonna waste my time replying to your racist, one sided, close minded comment, but in looking at your previous posts, you're just an infection of ignorance on this site. Must be nice living in a dreamworld of false perception, but i guess there, you can be king of all things moronic, so you go!..... go right back under the rock you crawled out from.
now that's what i call a pimp-slap.
I'm an on-again off-again smoker so I consider myself sort of in the middle. Sometimes I couldn't care less about secondhand smoke and sometimes it drives me crazy.
I've visited countries where it's still legal to smoke in bars and restaurants and I'll agree that it sucks to eat with someone smoking next to you. Also, bars become really clogged with smoke and it's totally unpleasant. The smoking ban in bars sucks because everyone just hangs out outside but so be it.
This idea, of banning smoking in public spaces, seems sort of insane. First of all, if you live in New York City it's absurd to expect everyone around you to accommodate your health requirements and/or preferences. You live in a big city. Sometimes you're going to have to deal with things that aren't pleasant, like the smelly homeless man on the subway. Let's say I was deathly allergic to dogs. Being anywhere near a dog could cause me serious harm. Should we ban dog runs? Or walking your dog on the sidewalk? No, I should probably just make sure to avoid them whenever possible, and when not, deal with the fact that I'm allergic. It's not the dog owner's fault that I'm allergic, is it?
Secondly, there are so many other kinds of polution in the air in New York City that banning cigarettes seems like a drop in the bucket. What about all of the freaking cars? I'm a biker and breathe that stuff in all the time, and it's probably terrible for me, but I'm not about to demand that they ban cars. What about all the sorts of pollution pumped out of the factories in Bushwick etc.?
I also torn about this - but I am the worst kind, I am en ex-smoker as of a year and a half.
I think designated smoking areas is fair, this way when I am in a park, I dont have to sit next to someone who is smoking, which literally gives me a headache. But this law sounds like it's going to be just as enforcable at the bikes on the sidewalk - and the honking. So, smokers, don't get too upset about this.
I just think that smokers should be a little more aware of their surroundings. Especially in parks - if someone is eating or a child is very nearby - yes, its outside, but we can still smell it.
wow - you non/ex smokers seem to get headaches really easily. Have you considered that you have brain tumors? Of maybe your vaginas shifted into your brains. That's the dumbest reason I've heard to ban smoking. If you have spots on your lungs or can't walk without coughing up a lung fine - but headaches?! In the jackhammer capital of the world? Just move, NYC doesn't need such pathetic, sickly little babies. NYC is a city for the strong and creative go whine in San Diego.
did you even read what I wrote? or did you come on here to flame me? I am reporting your post jerk.
Sorry - did I cause you a headache? Report it to Bloomberg so he can ban me from the city.
*Hotstepper - I was born and raised in the city and man do I hate (hate!) these delicate little dilettantes that came here from Ohio and Delaware to "change" us. Thanks Asshats, go home.
I love how some people born in this city believe it makes them special, as though they are imbued with some sort of NYC superpower by virtue of where they were born. Please - most of the transplants I know are ten times the New Yorker you are. You're the dying type - the ones who sit in their apartments and whine about the "good old days" that never actually existed and complain about all the newcomers "ruining" your city. If you don't like it - why don't you do something instead of acting like a little bitch? Cities change and grow - and if they don't they go extinct, just like the dinosaurs, and you.
Yep - you know me so well.
Maybe I'll just move to Podunck, PA where all you Urban Outfitter shopping useless hipsters are from. Once I get there I'll demand a starbucks on every corner, a daily Natalie Portman sighting and an outpost of the Bowery.
Look you narrow minded piece of boring tripe, I'm not the one trying to make everyone conform to me. You fucktards are. And yes, this city was way more interesting and fun in the 70's and 80's before every idiot who wants the "Sex and the City" life showed up and tried to be Carrie.
And I don't give a shit if you "like" me or not. I can't think of anything more incidental to me than your feelings - on anything.
Uh, what? I don't care if you don't care if I like you. I said you're going extinct like a dinosaur - my personal feelings are irrelevant, as are yours. And I am not a hipster, a Pennsylvanian, an Urban Outfitter shopper, a Starbucks customer, or a Sex in the City fan. In fact, I would like to spit in the face of every tourist who comes here looking for the "SATC" experience, which doesn't exist, any more than your magical playland of NYC in the 80's ever existed. Hell, if you had actually read any of my posts, you would realize I'm basically against this outdoor smoking ban - it goes way too far, civil liberties wise. Nice fail though. I mean seriously, it's great that you know a lot of cliches about other residents of your city, but maybe if you ever left your apartment, you'd discover that other human beings aren't just there to annoy you. Enjoy your miserable existence living in the past.
oh... you're one of those huh? Everytime you read something you don't like it's flaming? I wonder what here is most flaming...
this town is full of sissified suburban granny types.
Amen!
Word to burger.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_FaJ79CeB4&NR=1
those sexy pictures of smoking trollopes should be illegal!
I can understand putting a ban on smoking in areas like the playground or picnic areas but a park wide smoking ban is ridiculous. People need to realize this ban being accepted only sets us up to have more laws infringing on our basic freedoms passed.
Exactly. Why not ban all perfumes or eating peanut butter in public because people have allergies?
Smoking in public is not a basic freedom. Breathing clean air, however, really is one.
Exactly. I'm never sure why smokers feel their right to nurse their addiction should trump other people's right to oxygen.
If smokers weren't so selfish, they wouldn't have to worry about this. Namely, the Parks Dept. is interested in fines, but I'm sure they're also interested in no longer having to spend absurd amounts of money to pay people to pick up butts all over the parks and beaches.
I don't really care when people smoke at the beach or in a park, but I'm always amazed to see people just flick the butt onto the sand or ground, not caring that someone may have to pick it up, or a dog or kid might eat it.
Instead of banning smoking, I'd like to see a gestapo-like enforcement/crackdown of littering, specifically by smokers, in parks and at beaches.
you know who else are chronic litterers? fisherman. they leave styrofoam worm cups, beer cans, and fishheads all along our waterways, those nasties.
let's ban them too! more laws everyone! pile on!
phuking phishermen, thinking the world is their garbage can.
and harming our beloved sea-kittens, don't forget.
The laws are already there - they're just no enforced.
If we are going to ban behavior that is a risk to public health, can we start with Fire Island?
I think it would be fair if they coupled it with easily accessible sectioned-off smoking areas like at airports
Most smokers are careless litterers too. Cigarettes butts never turn to sand assholes.
I'm so confused - I've never felt this way about Santa before.
This is why I chew tobacco.
agreed! i see people smoking all over the parks and then it blows in everyone's face, including the faces of children. smoking is gross and bad for everyone's health. figure out a way to quit and save yourself some money and a few years on your life.