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Last Friday, author and journalist Lynn Harris published a "Complaint Box" post on CityRoom about how hard it is for pregnant women to find seats on the subway, based on her experience during her two pregnancies and her friends' experiences. She writes that while people are very nice to offer her seats when she's taking the subway with her now-born children, she wonders, "Where were you people when I was pregnant? Oh, right. You were sitting comfortably in your seats. While I stood. In August."
If anyone did give up a seat — which, O.K., did happen, on days when there was a partial eclipse, a unicorn sighting and alternate-side parking suspended, or when I finally started asking for one — the donors appeared in this order of likelihood: (1) older woman, (2) younger woman, (3) minority man.A white man? Not on the list. Didn’t happen. Not once. Oh wait, once. That guy with a Playbill from “Jersey Boys.” Not a local.
Of course, besides empathetic remarks from other women who have experienced similar behaviors, the comments range from "i’ve always given my seat to preggos. im white as they come: irish american" (link) to "You don’t like rude men? Excuse me, darling, but then what are you doing here in New York, and taking the subway, no less? Next time, do yourself a favor and shell out the extra $$ for cab fare." (link)—and there's a share of "In this country, it’s still a choice to have a child. And if you choose that, you gotta take the bad with the good and not complain" (link) and "If you want to experience Mid-Western manners, come live in the Mid-West-you’re welcome!" (link). Some riders aren't sure if some women are pregnant—while others say they are honestly too worn out from the day to necessarily notice who's standing around them, so please ask!
Earlier this year, the Wall Street Journal's Jennifer Merritt tackled the same issue—"I just had the fourth day in a row where I stood much of the way on my 40-minute subway ride. I’m 6.5 months pregnant-and it’s obvious-and not a single person offered me a seat" — on a WSJ blog. The comments are very similar—"I’ve seen pregnant (and not pregnant but apparently just fat) women tell off people who offer them seats, saying I’m not disabled. You can’t win." The MTA says it'll fine people $50 for not giving up seats to the disabled (and pregnant women apparently qualify as short-term disabled), but how is that even enforced?
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I'm going to just set myself out for flame bait right now, I don't get up for a pregnant women unless she seems in some sort of physical distress. I've traveled the world and actually seen women give birth in the fields while harvesting crops, so the idea that a pregnant woman is somehow more fragile is just nonsense. I've heard my entire life that childbearing is natural and in now ways renders a woman incapable or handicapped, so let's not pretend this is the case. I will surrender my seat to the elderly, the handicapped, the tired, the stressed, the people who just look like they could use a seat, but I will be damned if I will get up because someone is pregnant.
Also, enough the child cult in this country. Children, and pregnant women, are not precious artifacts to be coddled, swathed in felt and venerated. Humans have been procreating for a LONG time in ditches, caves, hovels, log cabins, sod houses and tenements: I think they can survive a ten block subway ride.
And, now, I can be burnt to a tiny crisp for being an insensitive asshole. To this I would say: If that were case I would merely have said "Hey, I didn't put the kid in there, why should I be inconvenienced?"
well, you're just lovely, aren't you.
I'm 8 1/2 months pregnant and I ride the subway everyday. I'm totally capable of standing for my ride, I'm pretty likely to overtake all you slow-walkers on the stairs, I make it up a 4 story walk-up to work everyday. However, I do find it illuminating that throughout my pregnancy I've only been offered a seat a handful of times. It's fair to say that is never ever a younger white dude, nearly always a girl or older lady or gent (if it's either of the latter, I'm going to refuse)
More than anything I look at it as a little insight into the type of people I commute with, it's a politeness thing. Doesn't hurt to offer a lady your seat, specially not someone carrying a few extra pounds than normal in the August heatsoup. I'd actually be willing to bet that a gesture like this might even (shock/horror) make you feel GOOD about yourself...proud, perhaps...who knows.
Well since you put it that way, I am now willing to offer you, kittencrunchies, my subway seat (but no one else).
A detailed description of yourself would be helpful to avoid error.
btw Yes, I know you're 8-1/2 months pregnant, but I still need a more specific description so I can distinguish you from all the other 8-1/2 month pregnant women on the subway.
Thank you for this, finally someone willing to say it... Enough with the praise for choosing to overpopulate and test out your reproductive organs.
+1
Your mom must be proud. I guess no one gave up a seat for her when she was pregnant with you.
if you can't afford a cab, you can't afford a kid.
someone needs to remind them that quite possibly not everyone on the train is paying attention to every other rider and every other rider's comfort...asking may be a far more effective way to procure a seat if you must take the train.
if you can't afford a cab, you can't afford a kid.
wow.
Double "Wow"...
Geez..
winnar
Nonsense.
Best story. I'm no kid. On a bus a few years ago a 20sh young lady offers me her seat. I politely refuse with a gracious thank you and a smile. She smiles back and says "You can tell I'm not from New York". I wanted to smack her but I just said to her "your gesture was very kind but your remark was totally uncalled for". A mature black lady sitting next to her looked at me and said "you told her right Mister". The young lady got off at the next stop.
You, my friend, are an arrogant cocksucker.
Cock-sucking can eventually lead to pregnancy. Or so my mom told me, anyway.
Geez, Mr. Mel sure is touchy today.
If this is the way he acts when someone kindlyb offers him her seat, how does he act when he is refused a seat?
I reacted to her remark where she said that she wasn't from New York, meaning that the rest of us didn't meet her high standards. It's a snide knock on the rest of us and I didn't let it go by. I really didn't think I had to explain this, even to 14 year olds.
Oh no, we got it. But by making that snide remark back to her, you were only reinforcing the "New Yorkers are assholes" stereotype you were so quick to ridicule her for playing into.
Why does everyone think that living in New York means you deserve this special type of respect? It's just another American city, albeit way more fucking expensive. You don't deserve a trophy for living here.
Wrong.It had to be said and has nothing to do with being a wise guy. She had a less than reasonable attitude and it doesn't give her a pass. There are many people that move here not understanding the diversity in the population or their attitudes and are offset by it. By and large, I have found, New Yorkers are reasonably polite and usually willing to help.
I agree with Mr. Mel here and have had similar interactions.
I was visiting family in a Southwest/Midwest city, and a friend of theirs asked me where I lived. When I replied that I lived in New York, he said, "Ugghh. Sorry to hear that. New York is a disgusting place." I responded in kind, by saying, "I'm not sorry. In fact, I like it there, and would much rather live there than here." The person seemed taken aback and felt I was rude, but he was the rude one.
I would never go out of my way to insult someone about where they live, especially to their face. But, people sometimes feel that if they visit New York, or meet someone from New York, it's perfectly fine to act like a jerk.
I think I have the solution. No seats, like the airport busses that pick up disembarking passengers from the tarmac and transport them to the terminal. Everybody stands.
I am not what you say nor am I your friend, the loneliness would be unbearable.
I had the misfortune of offering a seat to what I thought pregnant woman. She wasn't and made a scene about me calling her fat.
My suggestion to pregnant women is travel off peak to work if you can... and if you really really need a seat, just ask. I had a 20 something person who said they felt dizzy ask for my seat. I gave it up. Looked like he was just drunk and gonna lose it, but better to be standing and be able to get way from the soon to be vomit.
Instead of saying "I'm pregnant and my dogs are a'barkin', lemme get dat seat", she writes a passive aggressive blog post. Typical.
*Pregnant white women...
The story will no doubt bring out all the misogynist males screaming about women's lib and "feminazis" but the fact remains that common courtesy and civility should never go out of style otherwise our society is in big trouble. Holding doors open for anybody, male or female, makes a nice impression all around. Offering your seat to a person who looks in need, male or female, is also appreciated, if not by the recipient then by the many onlookers who observed your behavior and silently approved. If you encounter ungracious people who do not thank you, do not allow them to change your chivalrous habits, but chalk it up to up to their own ignorance and lack of class/manners/good upbringing. Do not stoop to their level to "get even with them." Pay all good deeds forward and it will come back to you.
you should have posted this on a weekday afternoon jen, it would have been a guaranteed comment bonanza.
1. we were all born from mothers who would have appreciated being shown a little extra courtesy too.
2. all that weight added on to any frame in such a short time puts enormous pressure on the back and ankles.
3. when you give up a seat, just make eye contact, point to your seat and if she nods, get up, you don't even have to talk or mention pregnancy.
are people retarded?
Very well said, John.
I was pregnant this year and was almost glad that I got laid off in the spring, because it meant I didn't have to deal with a commute. My pregnant friends said they were dying on the trains. Unless you've been pregnant, you have no idea how painful it can be, especially on a packed train during a New York summer.
It's not just pregnant women, though - I've seen people get on the trains on crutches and no one has given up a seat. I've seen people who look as old as the hills have to stand because no one will be courteous and give them a seat. I once stood up for a very old woman and some young douchebag came and tried to sit in the seat. I hoisted him out and told him who I was giving the seat to.
And the white guys are the worst - they won't help anyone. The only people who ever gave me a seat when I was pregnant (or years ago, when I had my arm in a sling) were other women or young black and Latino guys. The white guys have the biggest sense of entitlement around.
I offered my seat to a pregnant girl once. She was standing in front of me and I got up and said, "Take the seat". She just glared at me. She was obviously pregnant and not fat since her belly was round as a beach ball and she didn't have much fat on the rest of her body.
Anyway, after staring at each other for a really awkward 15 seconds, not saying a single word, a 30-something guy just sat down in my seat. I turned away and stopped giving a shit.
I think mr. j. matrix above.said it best,
a simple eye contact gesture should convey your act.
a response should be a simple nod or no thanks.
where are these preggers who refused seats?
Unless you ask for a seat and someone actually says no, there isn't much room to complain.
If I'm sitting on the subway (rare), my eyes are either on the floor, in a book, or on my phone. I don't want to look at all you's jerks.
ITA. I have absolutely no sympathy for the passive aggressive whiners. Don't expect strangers to read your mind or know/care about your health problems. If you need a seat, ASK.
Why do pregnant women feel so entitled? When I see a pregnant woman I don't see the future of her giving birth to a beautiful baby but the past of superdirty kinky sex. I mean they just gave blowjobs, handjobs, got fucked 50 different ways in different positions (yeah your parents did that) and then had a cum explosion in their love cave. So why should pregnant women get rewarded for Fucking and having an orgasm? We have a surplus of people on this planet, it's not like ww2 where we needed to repopulate. All you are going to do is make people on airplanes very very angry in a couple of months. I still give my seat to pregnant women and fat women because of societal niceties, but that's my choice cause I'm a nice guy. But the entitlement pisses me off.
I don't think she'd have as much problems if she asked people to give up their seats.
We're still talking about this? Pregnancy is not a disability. Women are no more frail than men. Quit whining and just deal with the discomfort. Few babies weigh more than 10 lbs. at birth anyway.
Riding the subway when crowded often sucks. Also, the sky is blue.
There are seats at both ends of most cars that are labeled as seats for the handicapped. By law, you have to give up these seats if requested. Are these pregnant women going to the ends of the cars and asking for these seats? That's what they should be doing.
I specifically do not sit in those seats, ever, (except maybe late late at night when there are many other seats open as well), because I like sitting down and want to sit for my long ride. Even if these are the last empty seats in the car, I will not sit in them and will instead stand, leaving them open for handicapped people who need them. However, I often see people who are not obviously handicapped (but certainly could be) sitting in these seats. Do they get up for pregnant women on their own? I doubt it. Do they even know they are sitting in special seats? Maybe, maybe not. But do the pregnant women go over to these seats and ask for them? Do they even just go over to these seats and look at the people sitting in them to try to make them feel guilty? Maybe, but I haven't seen it done. I usually see pregnant, old, and disabled people get on in the middle of the car and stand there waiting for someone to give them a seat. They make no attempt to go over to the seats that are especially reserved for them.
If I wanted to give up my seat at the first sign of anyone in the handicapped category, I'd sit in one those special seats! But instead, I sit elsewhere, even though I get on at the end of the line. While I certainly would give up my seat for an obviously pregnant women, or an obviously disabled person, or if asked by either, no matter where I'm sitting, I would really appreciate if these groups of people would first make an effort to go sit in the seats that are reserved for them.
Of course sometimes in rush hour it's hard to move throughout the packed subway car, but if they are regular commuters, they should know where the doors will open at each of the stations they regularly board at, and thus they should board regularly at the doors at the ends of the car so they will be right next to the seats reserved for them.
I'd like to see pregnant women and old and/or disabled people start asking for those special seats, and if the occupant refuses to get up, then people sitting in the non-special seats should not hesitate to immediately get up.
are these women, who are too delicate to sand for 20 minutes, the same pregnant women I see jogging? Shoving past me at Bloomingdales? Holding a two year old? Please. If they are that fragile let's stick 'em all in wheelchairs but until then they're fucked (literally) not crippled.
Giving up your seat to massively pregnant chicks is nice because their feet are swollen. However, I usually pay no attention whatsoever to the other riders on the train, and I would laugh in the face of anyone who tried to imply I was rude because I didn't notice some pregnant chick while my nose was buried in my book. This is New York. If you want something you are going to have to speak up.
I've lived here for 17 years, and I don't think I've EVER seen a pregnant woman on a train who wasn't offered a seat (if not by me if I'm close enough, then by someone else).
I think she is lying, or at best, exaggerating a great deal.
Pregnancy is a choice in this country. No one made you do it. You should not get special treatment. If someone chopped off their own legs on purpose, I wouldn't give them a seat either.
Don't like it? Don't breed.
1. Pregnancy IS a disability. Just look up the American's with Disabilities Act.
2. Stop whining about not getting a seat when ~gasp~ you never ask for one. I was pregnant last summer and most of the time I was fine standing for my commute but on the mornings I was feeling sick or the evenings when my feet were swollen beyond recognition, I ASKED FOR A SEAT and since the majority of NY-ers are decent people, I was never turned down. Please, pregnant women of NYC, don't be martyrs, ask someone to sit down. You'll do yourself a favor and you won't end up seething about how no one gives you a seat.
I'm six 1/2 months pregnant, and I have only been offered a seat once, by an older black lady. Not a big deal, as I can still stand without huge effort, but I appreciated the gesture. And I would speak up if I really needed a seat that day.
Still, why not be courteous and polite to someone who is carrying around an extra 30 pounds, who gets light-headed or nauseous more easily, and whose balance is temporarily thrown off? That makes it harder to stand on the train.
The amount of parent and child haters in this city still astounds me. I mean, god forbid someone make a different life choice than you. And that you show a bit of temporary kindness because they did.
A) If a pregnant women, older person, or disabled person asks for your seat, you would be a complete heel not to give it up. It might have been embarassing for them to ask in the first place, so they probably really need it.
B) If you're pregnant and no one is getting up, just ask. People are often reading or distracted, and they might not have noticed you. It's probably not their fault, so don't get angry like the woman who wrote this post. Don't assume the worst in people, it's an ugly trait and makes you seem petty and self-absorbed. It might be embarassing to ask, but it's better than standing there angry and in discomfort.
C) Sometimes it really is hard to tell if a woman is pregnant, and the pain you would cause by guessing incorrectly would be a terrible thing for certain women.
Pregnant women always get my seat...because I ride in cabs!
When I was pregnant, it didn't bother me until I was pretty far along - 8 months or so - because pregnancy can affect your balance and no one wants to fall on the subway. I will almost always give up my seat to someone who is pregnant or with a small child. What I wish that Lynn had taken her claws to is the issue of helping people carry strollers up or down the subway stairs. Between the kid and the stroller, it can easily come to 40 pounds and it is just good manners to help someone carry something that heavy. The helpers were about 80% female to male, and rarely white men at all.
You seriously have the nerve to complain that strangers don't have good manners because they don't offer to lug your heavy stroller up and down stairs for you? Wow.
It's common courtesy to help someone with a stroller on the stairs -- no one said anything about expecting a stranger to do the carrying. Obviously, you have never experienced carrying a 30 pound sleeping child in a 15 pound stroller by yourself during rush hour. It's a 2-person job, but not surprisingly the only ones who would offer to lend a hand were other moms or non-white men.
I'll usually offer my seat to pregnant women, the elderly, and anyone with a cane. I have no problem with offering my seat to heavy women as well, since I know that standing for a long time isn't their favorite pastime either. I suggest if you're not sure someone wants the seat (can't catch their eye, etc.) just give it up anyway. They'll take it if they want it.
I *used* to give my seat up to mothers with little kids in tow, since being a mother of little kids is usually to definition of tired. But nine times out of them they give the seat to one of the kids. And I'll be darned if I'll give my seat to somebody with more energy than a car battery and won't know back pain for another twenty years. Mothers! Take the seat and let the kids stand! A little bit of roughing it will do them good!
(And since it appears we're keeping track of this - I'm a white hetero male in my 40s.)
I've offered my seat to women on trains and they sometimes decline my offer.
Then those particular women did not need a seat at that time. At least you offered. It's still appreciated.
I rarely take the subway - just did the other day because I figured the train would be faster from midtown to Soho than a cab. A fairly elderly guy gets on just after me and looks like he wants to sit down. I give him my seat. Who sees the whole thing go down and continues playing video chess? Young-ish (under 40) white guy sitting just to my right.
I didn't have a fit about it or anything, but I noticed. To young white men who make no move to be gentlemen: everyone notices, we all think you're kind of a scum bag, and if you happened to have some misfortune on your way out of the car ... no one will help you. Just things to consider if you choose to "not notice" in the future.
Don't get me started on the "strollers on the subway" thing... I always help people carry their strollers up & down the subway stairs, but I sure wish some people would be more reasonable about 1. the size of the strollers they take on the train 2. trying to take one of these behemoths on the train during rush hour.
I was on a crowded 1 train today -- not rush hour obviously, but the 1 is *always* crowded -- and this woman got on with a HUGE stroller. Her kid was was about 3 months old and seriously didn't need such a huge contraption. Anyway, she stood there almost fully blocking a door with the thing and got all pissy and huffy anytime anyone tried to get past her to get in or out. I had to restrain myself from pointing out to her that SHE was the nuisance, not them.
In any case, that's getting pretty far off topic. I definitely agree with those pointing out above that someone should feel bad about asking for a seat...insensitive jerks aside, most people will gladly give up a seat to someone who needs one.
(sorry if this posts more than once... getting error messages)
I'll admit it. I don't give a crap if you're pregnant and you're not getting my seat.
You people might call me rude, but you guys are being hypocrites by being judgmental bastards which in itself is rude.
And you people that go on the trains with strollers, you all can DIAF.
Lesson: everyone hates white men.
Another thing is perception. Do you perceive that we are all part of the same humanity and that helping one person of the species enriches everyone or do you perceive it as individualistic wherein you get egoistic relative deprivation and get jealous that somebody else gets to carry on their genes and memes and you go home to a chicken sandwich. A very delicious chicken sandwich.
I am a fat chick, and most of my weight is in my belly. People offer me seats about three times a week. I never take them (I simply decline politely, there is no need to make a scene). So based on the fact that I get these offers regularly, and I only look sort of pregnant, I also think this woman is overstating the issue. But I will say that the people who offer me seats are black or latino guys about 90% of the time.
I think you must be a very cool person, and I salute you for that.
They just like fat chicks.
giggety
Ha, white men are an entitled group.
so, why are they always complaining?
oh, before I forget, Al sharpton involved in this yet?
Al Sharpton has been pregnant for at least a decade from what I can see. That shit's ready to pop.
I believe the great Reverend has lost a lot of weight from his choo choo charlie days of protesting on the subway tracks.
It's just common courtesy. I think this goes for kids too. I have the exact same experience with a child. And it's always older women, younger men and young men of color.
While I agree that pregnancy is not a disease, it does cause physical changes and impacts one's body. You try growing and incubating a predatory human being in your stomach for 40-42 weeks.
One may experience swollen feet and ankles, shortness of breath, horrible back and nerve and leg pain, compressed internal organs, nausea and vomiting, barely being able to walk, pressure and other issues that effect women when they are pregnant. You can be healthy and pregnant and still experience these issues, as they are not exclusive to pregnant women with health related issues.
And sometimes a pregnant person needs to leave the house, and god forbid, use public transportation. It's public and not exclusive to non-gestating citizens.
If you can spare your seat, do so. Why not? It's a relatively simple and kind act that is often much appreciated.
And parasitic.
yeah, i agree with the above poster, If you can't afford a cab, then you can't afford a child.
That is just really bad logic. And an even worse argument.
No one said people who rode public transportation did it because they cannot afford cans.
I always offer my seat to a pregnant woman when I'm sure she's pregnant and not just fat. Old people or people who are handicapped in some way also (not counting the mentally handicapped).
Pre-term labor can happen if you over-exert yourself. You have to be MOST careful between weeks 24-32... At 6 month pregnant, the fetus has a 50-50 chance of survival, at 7 months, an 85% chance of survival. That's just survival. We're not talking about making it out of the NICU without disabilities (mental and physical) that are likely to arise as a result of pre-term labor. Pregnancy is fraught with dangers.
I must say, at 7 months, I have NEVER had anyone offer me a seat on the bus or subway. My feet are swollen, I'm tired as heck, and I take care not to overexert myself cuz I'm well aware of the dangers. In fact, I've actually gotten up to give my seat to a woman with a NEWBORN carrying a large box of diapers home. Not one person got up except me, the pregnant lady. Interesting.
Been living in NYC for 15 years and didn't realize till my own pregnancy how awful it is to have these extra 20 lbs on me. Stairs? I hate them. Bending over? Can't... my belly is in my way. Balance? I have none and fall/trip too easily. Yes, I take cabs more often now, but even as an attorney, my salary does not allow me to take cabs EVERYWHERE and EVERYDAY TO AND FROM WORK. Who are these jerks on this site? New York-- as with any cesspool you gotta deal with the pigs too.
Take your UNBORN child out of the CITY an perhaps you will find ENOUGH room to BEND over.
who let you out of the kitchen?
I'm sorry... Who LET you out OF the KITCHEN?
I suggest you bend over for a well deserved baseball bat up your ass--there's more than enough room up there given the horseshit you're spewing...
How can I tell if a woman is pregnant or one of the burlesque performers that have had too much PBR?
I read the same article about 15 years ago in The Daily News, with a different pregnant reporter, of course.
It's interesting to note the same people were willing to help (older women, Latino men) and white men were the least willing to help a pregnant woman 15 years later.
I had no idea so many motherless bastards are still riding the subway.
Its a silly groundless article and best ignored.
when i see one i wait to see if the other women on the train gives up a seat. if they don't, then i don't worry about it. feminine solidarity first - take care of your own.
Nobody wants to mistakenly offer their seat to a fat woman. If you're pregnant and you need to sit, just ask.
"man, what a rough day at work. all i want to do is get on this train and read a book. oh hey wait, the train is stopping at another station. ok, i better stop what i'm doing and scan the crowd again to see if any impregnated women happened to get on the train just like i do every time the train stops at another station."
sorry, not gonna happen.
the worst part of this article is the blatent racial break down of who's given her a seat. WTF?
"A white man? Not on the list. Didn’t happen. Not once."
WTF? What does the persons race have to do with giving you a seat?! Evil, stupid article. Its only convinced me not to give up my seat to pregnant ladies anymore.
I see just as many women who don't offer their seats.
I've made the mistake of offering a fat women my seat, thinking she was pregnant. Sometimes if I'm in doubt I just get up nonchalantly as though I am just deciding I want to stand, removing any possibility of being an asshole.
The truth is this: many of the women I am giving my seat to are getting it because they are reckless, irresponsible burdens on society. Many of them clearly cannot afford to be having kids, many of them do not deserve my seat. But at the end of the day what am I going to do? They're fucking pregnant and although they may be horrible people, I am not a horrible person and I will sleep well that night.
Oh and by the way, why is everyone getting all racial? I'm white, I give up my seat. I don't do it because I'm white. If you want to put this thing through the lens of race and try to argue that white people are more inconsiderate than other races on the train, I think you would find that argument a losing one to say the least. When someone is blasting music on their ipod so loudly or speaking so loudly that people on the other end of the car can hear them, they are usually not white. Is that a racist statement? Probably. Is it true? Absolutely.
I see people offering their seat to pregnant women all the time on both the subway and the bus so... One blog post does not an epidemic make.
New yorkers, by nature, are notoriously oblivious to anyone on a train. Unless they see a neon sign flashing :boobs: with promise of said boobs accompanying, we don't pay any mind.
What's all this bullshit about whites/non-whites/m/f?
If this woman could not find a seat (which was most of the time) that means that every seat was taken in all of those occurances. What are the demographics of all those people? Why aren't you so selective when you couldn't get a seat?
In my observations, those sitting and most eager to lunge for their seat are not white men.
I dont even sit because I prefer standing and watching fat cows fight for ass cheek room while sucking their teeth at the skinny chick who has already moved so close to the side wall that she's in half a seat and smelling fresh grafitti.
Sigh
You forgot to mention the lardass men who also spread their fat thighs to air out their tiny, shriveled genitals.
how come she didn't comment on the usual race/gender of the people who hold the subway doors open while shouting to their friends standing on the opposite platform, therefore delaying everyone's ride including any preggos on board. and when asked to let the doors go shout 'mind yo own fuckin bidness cracker or you get stuck'.
Stupid liberal guilt.
I see people giving seats often. And, like many said, she could've politely asked for a seat.
I had foot surgery last week. Last night, around 8pm, I stood on the C Train, foot bandaged and in an orthopedic boot, on crutches. I was the ONLY person standing. Not ONE seat empty. Not ONE person offered their seat - and believe me, I was not invisible.
Unless the train's deserted or there's a seat directly facing a hot chick in a miniskirt, this white man just stands anyway. When I have a seat I have given it up for old or pregnant people, or women with kids. But never to the women hauling an industrial sized bag of McDonald's home for their brood's dinner. I'll be paying for their families' poor eating habits for the rest of my life. They can stand.
I am constantly amazed at the number of people who will not give up a seat on the bus or the subway for an elderly person; a disabled person; or a pregnant woman.
C'mon, people. These are basic manners. This isn't about being from New York. This is about being a decent human being. I shouldn't be the only person getting up on the bus for an older gentlemen with a cane. I shouldn't be the only one standing for a pregnant woman.
I'm a woman, and don't expect a man to simply get up because I'm a woman. I refuse and say thank you when a gentlemen does. And it' always the older gentlemen. The guys who have worked hard all their lives, fought in a war or two, supported a family, sent the kids the college, and who have every right to keep on sitting.
I'm thirty-six and wasn't raised to be an asshole. What the fuck happened to the rest of you?
People bitch about the decline of society, and then don't realize they are part of the decline. It's these small things that help this marvelous city continue to chug on.
Thank you for making sense, newsyspice. The issue is not that pregnant women should be more aggressive and have to ask for a seat. The issue is that we should live in a society where women should NOT have to ask.
According to my wife, she was rarely offered a seat when she was pregnant. Sometimes when she finally started asking, people would actually get pissed about being asked. Oddly, she felt that latino men were the worst offenders, but its entirely possible that there weren't many white men on our train line to outdo them.
Well said, at least i'm not the only thinking somethings wrong here. In general, we all had a mom at some point going through the same thing you see all these other women, don't forget where we all started. It's really disheartening to see the lack of human kindness that exists here, do we need another 9/11 to bring us all together again and remind us what it is to be caring and decent people again, cause that's the last tine i remember seeing any form of it here.
My favorite arguments are for giving seats the fashionistas who wear uncomfortable shoes. Give me a break. If you wear high heels in this city you deserve to be in pain, fall through subway grates, and any number of other instances I find pleasing.
Bunch of complainers. If you're preggers, ask for a seat - it'll avoid embarrassment for the just plain fatties.
I am a white male (late 20s). Always give up my seat for preggers women and the elderly.
However I refuse to give up a seat for obese women. Would it kill them to stand once in awhile? They always give you evil eyes for making them stand. I think it's good that for once someone says no. My guess is their laziness is the reason for the gigantic gut.
Seriously, I have NEVER seen an obviously pregnant woman not get offered a seat by someone. Never! (And I am one of those annoying people who sits on the train staring around at everybody else, so I would certainly notice.)
I'm with you... I always see someone offer their seat if they notice the pregnant woman. I've also seen, on more than one occasion, a fat/not-pregnant woman get offered a seat. They usually refuse. Thats on the 4/5 trains.
I'm young and white and have given up my seat many times without being asked; I've also been completely zoned out and been asked for my seat when I did not notice a pregnant woman who needed it, and I gladly gave it up.
There are definitely rude people on the subway, who do not offer seats willingly, but I really feel most people are just not paying attention. I think a better article would be to show how many times the author asked for a seat and was refused.
a better article would be if she shut her yap and stopped making babies.
who the fuck expects a comfortable cushy ride in underground public transportation while pregnant? forget about the seats and evil white men, lets talk about this for a minute.
I don't think anyone expects a cushy ride, but I think most people expect to be treated with some moderate amount of respect, pregnant or not.
Most pregnant women in New York know what they're getting into and don't honestly seem to expect everyone to jump up and kiss their feet (some may, but they're a minority). But, if anyone is feeling woozy or sick, I think as a society we would expect that people be courteous enough to stand up and offer a seat.
The way I tend to look at it is that chances are someone else "deserves" that subway seat more than I do. If in fact they don't, then who cares? I'll be off the subway and moving in 15-20 minutes anyway. 95% of us in this city sit on our asses all day, staring at a computer anyway.
Would it really hurt us to get up and offer a seat to someone who is particularly old, seems disabled, or pregnant?
I find the majoirty of comments here to be, while typical of Gothamist hate, a sad commentary of how the majority of people here were raised. Were you raised to be mean-spirited? Unkind? It's one thing to not notice a pregnant woman it's another to defend the fact that you won't knowingly give up a seat. This leads me to believe what I already knew about many of you. You were not born from pregnant women, you were hatched, like reptiles.
No, they were just raised in New York.
right, so go back to fucking kentucky fatty
Could we leave KY out of this?! The people of that fine Commonwealth don't really need more taunting do they? It's such an easy target.
let it be known:
i offered my seat one evening to a very obviously pregnant woman.
she declined, as she said she was getting off at the next stop.
but she didn't say thank you.
Wow. You offered a seat? Once? Can we designate you for saint-hood?
No one can read anyone's mind and many people do not even notice.
Yes this is hard to believe but that is reality - in nyc everyone is in their own bubble.
Just ask
Please
Just ask
Then you can cry bloody murder if the person refuses.
You have to ask for a seat.
21st century.
With regards to culture differences between who gives up seats and who doesn't, the white male has this going for him above all others: he's the only one I've seen who rarely, if ever, makes a mad dash for that one available seat left (every other group is guilty of this, especially asians who act as if that seat were their lifeline), and I've seen plenty of them continue to stand even if some seats are available to them. They didn't get off at the next stop either, they just preferred to stand for whatever reason.
So let's here it for the white guy! Oh by the way, I've seen plenty of young white men offer their seats to elderly/pregnant people.
How many white pregnant women are asking for seats as opposed to non-white pregnant women? Is it possible that the author's pregnant friends are all white? If she can generalize that the majority of white men don't give a Fck, maybe its true that most white women complain a lot. The article was kinda crappy.
I am generalizing but it seems that white men tend to have "delayed" reactions. they would give their seat up too but they first observe the scenario by that time a minority would just get up and give the seat. I think white men see women as equals and non-minorities see women as those that need protection.
I give up my seat but only after i gauge how struggling someone looks. I'm asian btw.
As someone who just gave birth last week, I'd like to add that people should know that pregnant women can't just suck in their bellies when you're trying to squeeze past them. This irritated the hell out of me - people would look at me like I was really inconveniencing them when I really could barely move.
Oh, and if you're walking down the street and a pregnant woman is walking towards you, and one of you needs to move to let the other pass, let that person be you. I could hardly walk towards the end and decided to just plow into people who didn't get out of my way.
If people would have the courtesy to walk on the right side of the sidewalk like they're supposed to, rather than walking down the middle or taking up the entire sidewalk with their group, this wouldn't be an issue.
I am a 50 year old white guy. I have been riding the subways and buses for 35 years. I have been giving my up my seat for pregnant and elderly people all this time. For the past 5 years or so I have been dealing with a really bad back problem. You may not notice it because I do not have crutches or look pregnant. If I get a seat at this point in my life I am not giving up my seat and I am not going to help anyone carry their strollers up flights of stairs. If I do not get a seat I stand and deal with it. I have gotten dirty looks from a women that gave up her seat for a pregnant woman a few weeks ago. She was no more the 30 years old and look quite healthy.So to her and all the white male haters out there and the woman that bring on huge baby strollers on the subway and then want help getting them up stairs, FUCK YOU! How dare you judge me when you know nothing about me or my past. Sounds racist to me.
You make a very good point. Not all disabilities are obvious.
You also don't know where people are coming from or what they've been doing just prior to getting on the train. I'd say the waitress who has been on her feet for the past 9 hours dealing with the public deserves to get a seat much more than some pregnant Park Slope mommy on her way to her knitting circle.
Problem is, you don't know that the pregnant lady is a Park Slope mommy on her way to a knitting circle. She might have been on her feet all day too (my wife and many others I know worked right up to her/their delivery.)
Without being able to do a background check, the default social rule is: give up the seat for the pregnant lady... unless you have a more debilitating condition.
Sorry, I meant to reply to WorksInDUMBO at 1:14pm
The moral of the story: Everyone, most likely, deserves a seat more than you do.
I'm not pregnant, not old, and not ill. Unless a train car is more than half empty, I don't bother sitting down.
It's just common courtesy. Do it or don't. But trying to justify the need to sit down is just as bad as the man who needs three seats to spread his legs.
PullMyFinger: You are not the problem demographic in my extensive anecdata experience. It's the 18-40 men who seem to be the most self absorbed and inconsiderate.
why do some men need to do that? can someone please explain this to me? Are they airing out their balls, or what?
Just sit on them. That's what I do.
I sat on a guy's leg once while he was taking up three seats, and he completely freaked out; I explained to him that his testicles were not as large as he thought, and if they needed airing, he should try standing.
sometimes ur nut sack gets stuck to your thigh. very uncomf. u asked :)
PS remedying this should just be a quick gesture, not a posture. In the latter, like manitoba suggests, they just want you to think they've got basketball testicles. they dont. and they're broke too.
You should try baby powder, especially in the summer. I know it sounds pretty girly, but it helps with the "sticking".
I also find that a "manual readjustment" is more helpful than "the spread", but make sure you have Purell - not so much for after rearranging your junk (though that would be courteous), but more for before you do so. I would never readjust after touching all of the bannisters, subway poles and door knobs of New York.
Purell should actually use that in their ads: show a guy picking up his dog's crap, opening doors and riding the subway. He then reaches for his hand sanitizer, cleans his hands and then manually shifts his boys. If you're "uncut" you should especially sanitize your hands before messing around down there.
ur awsoem :)
I call bigot Jen Chung!
Even my 6 year old son doesnt leave a woman (pregnant or not)standing. I take the train daily and see grown, able-bodied men of ALL colors pretend not to see a woman looking to sit.
It's the demasculinization of the American man.
I see people not get up for pregnant women and old folks all the time. It's crap. I get up for them 100% of the time. It's not about ethnicity or where your from... it's how you are raised. And the sort of person that would sit there in slackerdom while someone who truly "NEEDS" the seat suffers was not raised by my mom. She would have beaten them with a wooden spoon until it broke over their head.
I mean that's just the way of it.
Whatever happened to "no pay, no sit"? Kids with passes and others with free-o should stand. No wonder kids are so obese (and while we're at it, there used to be a mile cutoff for passes if you were over 13--you walked if you were closer.)
My kid usually sits, I stand. I paid. It's none of your business how I use it.
Not to mention, paying does not mean you get a seat.
Not a New Yorker, but I've been and ridden the subway a few times. Reading these comments has me LMAO and has made my work day much more amusing. I want to move...
Some people are giving in life and some are selfish
What else is new?