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The world has been waiting to find out where Liam Neeson falls on the whole carriage horse issue, and you can stop holding your breath now, world: the actor has spoken...and PETA isn't gonna like what he has to say. Last week a story ran in the Irish Echo regarding the New Yorker resident's public support of the Central Park carriage industry, which came out in a letter to the City Council.
Neeson stated in the open letter that there's been a "coordinated attempt by animal activists and a certain Queens council member to ban the industry from the city." Indeed, Tony Avella's bill to put an end to carriage horses is being introduced at a public hearing on January 30th (at the same time the industry will also propose their first fare increase in 19 years). Neeson (who didn't seem at all like an animal cruelty supporter in that Love, Actually movie) continued his letter as follows:
As a horse lover and rider, I am deeply disturbed by the unnecessary and misguided political and extreme rhetoric against the horse-drawn carriage industry and feel obliged to counter this action.Today the NY Post is pitting him against Alec Baldwin, who recently came out in support of putting an end to the industry.The horse-drawn carriage business is an iconic part of this city, employing hundreds of dedicated, hard-working men and women, caring for well-bred, well-trained horses and attracting tourists to New York City for over 100 years.
As a proud New York resident, I have personally enjoyed the beauty of Central Park on a daily basis for many years, and these horses are an undeniable integral part of that experience. The notion that a well-nourished horse pulling a carriage through Central Park is considered cruelty may fit in with animal activists' extremist view, but not with the rest of us. Surely we have a responsibility to protect commerce, especially one with such history, and one I truly feel helps define this city. May pragmatism prevail.
Photo of carriage horse via Gerry Visco's flickr.
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Which one is the horse?
The horse is the one with the bit in his mouth and the blinders. the drivers don't even remove the bit for the horse to eat. on the left side of the picture of the horse is an ass.
Check out this video peta made
http://meat.org
im with Liam.
why dont we stop getting mail on snowy and cold days because its obviously cruel to make people walk around in that shitty weather.
Your comment makes no sense. This is not a discussion of mail carriers.
he is cleary not educated in the matter. i wish him to take the place of a horse for the rest of this winter and come back to human form and then tell us what he thinks. BAN THE CARRIAGE HORSE INDUSTRY. PETA GET ON HIM.
I believe I saw the movie he was in
when it was called "man on fire".
what an assface. and I will always be on baldwin's side.
Can't there be a compromise, better conditions for the horses?
Those poor horses don't even have a mandatory retirement home.
They have a place of retirement. It's either a glue bottle or can of Friskies' "Special Diet Classic Paté Beef & Chicken Entrée. Calling it "horse flavored" wouldn't sell the product.
agreed.
Micheleenoreilly wrote:
Those horses are so lame and so abused that NYC should be ashamed. NYC is corrupt and Council member James Gennaro received thousand of dollars from the carriage drivers to introduce a bill to increase they rate from $34 to $55 for 1/2 hour and to remove OVERSIGHT from the industry. What corruption. Christine Quinn is align with the Irish mob that think they own this city and we have to pay them money. we paid for Quinn $600/hour lawyer and we pay to clean the horse manure and to inspect the horses yet the drivers pay no taxes. TOO MUCh corruption
And no more Beefaroni.
The horses should unionize.
Maybe the horses like it. Did that ever occur to anyone? You cant ask them, so you dont know they dont like it. Maybe they love it, walking around the park all day. Its like a UPS driver, same route every day, but its steady.
For millennia horses were domesticated and no one complained. For example, NYC was full of horse-drawn carriages and wagons until the automobile pushed them aside.
Then along came pompous asses like Baldwin, PETAphiles and politically correctoids to worry about animals when half of humanity is oppressed and undernourished without adequate water, education and health care.
I have yet to meet a PETAphile who cares more about humanity than they do a marsupial.
Thefacts, the carriage driver that continue to deflect the issue.
http://www.youtube.com/user/donnyfmoss
http://www.youtube.com/user/horsesinnyc
These 2 channels have some videos on the miserable lives of NYC carriage horses.
NYC carriage horses are discarded after miserable years of service.
Ok, after reading his statement, all this idiot is saying is that he likes to be able to look out at the horses in Central Park from the window of his multi-million-dollar apartment. In other words, they are lawn ornaments.
Assh*le.
quite true, let him live near Hell's kitchen where the stables are and see these poor horses navigate midtown traffic everyday at less than a crawl.
"Animal cruelty supporter?" That's the equivalent of the phrase "pro-abortion." Very loaded...
When we harness these beasts in the service of progress and the urban gentry, we hear the cries of angry mobs fulminating with rage o'er the fate of God's Creation. Well rest, my friends as they bed and dine better than most ill-faring and wretched humanity from Silesia to the Malabar Coast.
service of progress??? hauling overweight lazy obnoxious tourist around the city in the midst of traffic.
Comment from the post which I agree with:
Micheleenoreilly wrote:
Those horses are so lame and so abused that NYC should be ashamed. NYC is corrupt and Council member James Gennaro received thousand of dollars from the carriage drivers to introduce a bill to increase they rate from $34 to $55 for 1/2 hour and to remove OVERSIGHT from the industry. What corruption. Christine Quinn is align with the Irish mob that think they own this city and we have to pay them money. we paid for Quinn $600/hour lawyer and we pay to clean the horse manure and to inspect the horses yet the drivers pay no taxes. TOO MUCh corruption
https://secure2.convio.net/aspca/site/Advocacy?pagename=homepage&id=2247
http://horsewatchnyc.blogspot.com/
http://www.banhdc.org/
http://war-online.org/DemoReport12-31-08.htm
http://carriagehorsesnyc.blogspot.com/
http://centralparkblogger.com/?p=108
http://www.peta.org/feat-hdc_campaign.asp
http://www.hsus.org/press_and_publications/press_releases/carriage_horse_death_underscores_importance_of_ban_021408.html
Felix: have you stopped taking your Ketamine?
I don't know what ketamine is but again you are deflecting the real issue which is the cruelty of these horses who don't even have a mandatory retirement home. At least the police horse live longer and look better and have a retirement home. NYC carriage horses look miserable and are discarded after years of abuse.
Seriously. Felix -- don't you have any other hobbies? Any HUMANS in your life to do things with, other than this?
what do my hobbies have to do with the cruelty of NYC carriage horses. I don't see your point?
maybe neeson is into pony play? explains his interest in the kinsey role as well, ack my brain just got soiled
It means: "Get a life". The mind boggles at what could've been accomplished if you'd directed the effort to make all these posts into something more lasting.
And surely you'd know that Ketamine is a commonly used horse tranquiliser.
I think some people need to learn the principals of respect, that just because he supports a differing view it doesn't mean you're justified in calling Liam Neeson a "moron".
Blinders and bits aren't the problem. Blinders are calming to the horse (it'd be cruel to take a pack horse through NYC without blinders) and it allows the horse to focus only on the things directly ahead - if people had eyes on the sides of our head, we'd probably where blinders when we were driving, reading, watching tv etc. And horses enjoy the "taste" of copper bits - they gnaw on them, as a dog gnaws on a bone. The more spit and foam you see around a horse's mouth because of the bit, the better.
The problem are the drivers who don't really know horses - most of them are essentially hustlers. They don't really need to know the horse, or even how to "drive" the horse - the horse has been on the route thousands of times, it could probably do it on it's own; the drivers just need to be there to con tourists out of cash for the gimmick of a horse-drawn carriage ride through the park. Unfortunately, it seems as though they're not great horsemen.
You wouldn't put a kid on a scooter behind the wheel of a double-18 wheeler, mm? See the logic here?
Oh man, I'm an idiot. We wouldn't "probably where blinders." But we would wear* them. Haha stupid mistake.
Just wanted to set the record straight before some PETA dumbass tries to find something wrong with my argument, can't, and so goes after my spelling.
i agree, the drivers are independent contractors and per consumer affairs license they only need to view a short video and take a short multiple choice exam. No horse experience required. Police horses don't war blinders and they don't eat with bits in their mouths.
@kingpin, "get a life" is a dismissive remark to avoid the issue. the issues is the Cruelty of NYC carriage horses. I don't know about Ketamine but of course thefact, a carriage driver would know. I can also easily respond to you "get a life". We all have lives. what is your point?? Do you want to compare lives? I am not interested in doing so. the issues again is that these horses are abused and discarded and this industry is corrupt and has a lot of political clout. instead of using the money to buy a retirement home for the horses, they use the money for lobbyist to lax laws to protect these horses. this industry sue the city to stop the law to restrict horses only to the park. They don't give a damn about these horses and that is THEFACTS
No, it's a dismissive remark to get you to stop your flurry of angry, often incomprehensible postings so that the adults in the room can discuss the issue. You've not just commented more than anyone else -- you've commented just about as much as EVERYONE ELSE COMBINED. When that happens, you know it's time to turn off the internet and go outside.
I put links and actual facts in the posting. Perhaps you need to do something instead of counting how many comments I posted. The Issues is the CRUELTY of NYC carriage horses who are abused and discarded. NO mandatory retirement home for them. Council member Gennaro received thousand of dollars from the drivers to introduce this bill to increase their rates and decrease inspections. That is THEFACTS
Liam vs Alec. Steel cage match. My money's on Liam. Alec is a pompous wimp.
But to be serious, it is a sure sign of the lunatic fringe when these so-called animal activists would call for a ban instead of reform.
Then again, I believe that people who keep pets--especially cats--are serial animal abusers.
yeah...it is all reduced to maintaining a handful of male egos instead of the horses well being. This horses don't EVEN have decent veterinary care. How's that for cultural identifications based on cruel domination of other species; very primitive.
Perhaps a few more women should do a grammar check to make sure their comments are comprehensible?
yeah...it is all reduced to maintaining a handful of male egos instead of the horses well being. This horses don't EVEN have decent veterinary care. How's that for cultural identifications based on cruel domination of other species; very primitive.
"How's that for cultural identifications based on cruel domination of other species; very primitive."
Ha, ha. That's an awfully polysyllabic, high falutin, involuted phrase for something "very primitive" . I think I'll write my next doctoral thesis on it. And I'll make sure to throw the word "apoplectic" and "elbow" in for good measure.
PETA wants no life saving medical testing or pets or circuses or racing or leather or fur or steak houses or chicken sandwiches or even fishing. Giving in to them will only empower them. I'm with Neeson, he's a rider he know how to treat horses. Treat the horses humanely and that's it.
Horses have thousands of years of doing one thing and that is serving man. They don't work, they don't get fed (paid as it were, particularly in this economy) and you can bet that there are not many places where they can roam free.
I can't believe some neutral party like him would go out of his way to defend this cruel industry. Does he seriously think that it is okay because they are "well-nourished?" They are held in extremely cramped conditions in a facility that is not designed for horses, where they can barely lay down. Horses are easily frightened, and to force them to walk the streets of New York City (it's not just Central Park, Liam) is cruel, and dangerous to those nearby. Serious accidents have occured when frightened horses have gotten out of control and run into traffic. Face the facts. Some of the people working in the industry might be decent people, but they need to find another line of work. Things change, and this industry needs to go.
Amanda's m.o. on this blog is multiple posting the same comment.
Has Amanda stopped taking her Ketamine as well?
Who is Liam Neeson?
#40, excellent argument, for a 10 y.o.
Amanda, does your hatred for the male of the species also include male animals?
As a former horse owner, rider AND an social scientist, I am constantly amazed when government officals fail to voice their sceptisim when a group of specialized, self-interested individuals propose a series of laws intent to "improve"a non-financial aspect of their own business. Even if said laws address legitimate issues, the "street reality" remains that too many public laws (animal, human, and enviromental) remain nice words, written on paper, and the actual impact of the law waxes and wanes depending upon the amount of funding the issue receives. Of course, no one knows experiences this reality better than the individuals promoting the self-regulatory laws- that's the very reason they propose them . I agree it is time to outrightly ban horse drawn carriages in NYC . Doing anything less "extreme" only means that the abuse will happen later, on another's politicians/self-interested patrons watch. And that tradition is one all of us have had enough of !
Some type of logic follows exclusive premises where if X it is impossible for Y to exist.
Why does caring for animals would in any-case be supporting neglect for humans? ZERO SUM logic is not a good argument.
Letting people with very poor logic participate in the democratic process has given this country masters of stupidity like well known republicans puppets....we can keep trying, but the cost stupidity involves more than those proudly making displays of it.
The facts: you have a fulty logic. If your read hate for males when I refer to facts in this case, maybe you should read more, the stuff that matter, not merely sports articles. Perhaps all women with a little brains are too much for you.
No way these horses are psyched on hauling fat-asses around the shithole that is midtown west. They are a traffic nuisance, and drop shit everywhere, which is expected, but unnecessary. Rent a bike or walk around the city, you'll see the same stuff, just maybe a little faster.
While we're on the subject, get the NYPD off of horses and onto bicycles.
The facts: you have a fulty logic. If your read hate for males when I refer to facts in this case, maybe you should read more, the stuff that matter, not merely sports articles. Perhaps all women with a little brains are too much for you.
Many people who support animal rights causes are likely to also work for human rights. One does not cancel out the other. The fact that people get so defensive when someone questions an accepted "tradition" of animal abuse really suggests an underlying discomfort with this practice that exists in all of us.
People who abuse or condone animal cruelty also abuse or condone cruelty against others, including children and women. THEFACTS hates animals and now shown himself to be a misogynist. I on the other hand don't support animal cruelty and I definitely love women, smart ones as well. I feel sorry for those NYC carriage horses that are in the hands of THEFACTS. He is one of the owners/drivers in the industry.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=caSBg-OFW-A&feature=channel_page
some of the accidents that occurred
People who pull 'facts' out of their ass to use in a war of words with others who disagree with them are just as full of it as the ones they battle. The only true fact here is that there are way too many people anthropomorphizing these animals.
Is there some animal extremist course that says writing things like "cruelty" and "oversight" in block capitals suddenly makes people more likely to read it? If so I think you should demand your money back.
My point being, as Thespis observed, is that you've made more posts about this subject and most of them are the same diatribe of you posting "the truth", how corrupt the system is and how amoral the whole affair is. That isn't an intelligent discussion, that's a Merry-Go-Round.
Your message got across, give people a break.
And unless you've had first-hand experience with the neglect you're alledging, and not just parroting the same claims PETA has presumably already stated ad nauseam, then I'm really not interested in listening.
If someone is not interested in the conversation, maybe they should cover their ears and close their eyes and ignore what's going on, instead of just telling people with different opinions that they are extremists and that they should "give people a break."
@kingpin, you have not stated any informative comments. You are too busy obsessing over the number of comments that I have posted and how many words are capitalized. And you tell me to get a life? I have pasted a lot of links from ASPCA to Win animal rights.
forget kingpin, he's not even a NY'er,
there I said it. isn't there a Londonist?
"anthropomorphizing these animals", can you explain further what is the "anthropomorphizing" in this case?
Why do actors think that we look to them for for their opinion on anything? Shut the f up and entertain me.
Amen to that.
carriages horses probably dont live under the most idyllic conditions possible, but i dont know how you can rationally want to ban the carriages and not the shoe stores and restaurants that also surround central park.
animals raised and killed for meat, clothing, shoes, etc. on commercial farms live in conditions that are much much much worse than these horses endure, and then are killed.
it is terribly hypocritical to call for the ban of the carriages horses in central park and not for the ban of the hot dog vendor next to them.
if you eat meat or wear leather or fur, you support industries that are infinitely less humane than the carriage industry and inhumane to tens of millions of more animals than exist in the carriage industry.
it's unfair, irrational, and hypocritical to pick on one small industry because you dont happen to use their services while simultaneously supporting huge corporate interests that are MORE inhumane to MORE animals because you think cheeseburgers are delicious.
Some of us who oppose the carriage horse industry are indeed vegan, myself included. It might be hypocritical to oppose this industry and still support fur, leather, and eating animals, but this article is about the horse carriage industry. Reducing suffering is the goal, and change happens one step at a time.
thats fine. if you are vegan and dont wear leather shoes when you dress up, oppose away.
but, 2 things.....
one is hat there are a lot of non-vegans who are opposed to the carriage industry. i know some of them. why do they oppose the carriage industry and not the hot dog industry? because they are new yorkers and dont care about riding in a carriage but they love the taste of meat. if there was a slaughter house on central park south, maybe more people would be protesting the hot dog vendors. but there isnt one there. its easy to pick and choose which forms of "inhumane" treatment of animals you are opposed to based on what is convenient to you, but that still makes you a hypocrite.
and second, considering that there are something like 100 carriage horses compared to the tens of millions of food animals that are treated infinitely worse than the carriage horses, i have to wonder if the vegan peta types have misguided priorities. yes, i know that people have to pick and choose their battles. but to me, it seems akin to picketing a small, independently owned bodega for selling a couple products made in a sweat shop, while ignoring the walmart next door to it.
It is more than 100 horses, over 200 horses and they live short life span in NYC and are replaced with other horses to abuse. Thousands and Thousand of horses are abused in NYC carriage industry
Folks: If your are befuddled by Amanda's logic and syntax, it is not your fault.
This is someone whose Gothamist description of herself is: genious. (sic)
The facts, you are Genious!
" Neeson (who didn't seem at all like an animal cruelty supporter ...")
Sigh, I keep forgetting the Gothamist articles are opinion, not news...
PS _ Any PETA wizards here against abortion on demand? How about "late-term" abortions?
BONUS!
http://www.petakillsanimals.com/
Stop scapegoating the horses, the horses are not the cause of late term abortion. jeez.
Also there are no PETA videos on NYC carriage horses. the video blinders was from a NYC resident. Do note that the NYC carriage drivers never permit videos of the jail cells stall these poor horses are kept.
No 71, not only you are bitching about nothing, when you say that gothamist is "liberal biased", but also then present as evidence of a supposed argument, the shadiest website ever trying to defame Peta by presenting the reasoning of polarization?
You surely are a republican! Only your side has the reason, and the rest is "biased".
"No 71, not only you are bitching about nothing, when you say that gothamist is "liberal biased","
Learn how to read - the lead line I quoted was as "news factual" as "when did you stop beating your wife?"
" but also then present as evidence of a supposed argument, the shadiest website ever trying to defame Peta..."
Have any facts to contradict that website?
"by presenting the reasoning of polarization? "
It's "polarization" when a conservative points out the hypocrisy of the left but it's "reasoned discourse" when written by incomprehensible libs (hint, take a basic writing class).
(HERES ANOTHER HINT _ YOU WHINNY ABOUT ALLEGED ABUSE OF HORSES, but have no compunction about sticking a scissors into the brain of a baby and ripping him live out his mothers womb so he can die on surgical tray because it was too inconvenient to carry him to term - Wear your "I survived Roe-v Wade T-shirt lately?).
"You surely are a republican! Only your side has the reason, and the rest is "biased"."
You surely are a libtard, According to you, only YOUR side has the reason, and the rest is "biased".
One of my good friends has known Liam since they were both in their 20s. Liam has always been passionate about horses, both riding them and caring for them. Obviously this doesn't make him an expert, but he is not a complete idiot either. I would venture to say at least he knows something about what he is talking about, versus the "concerned" people who get all their knowledge from PETA videos.
A NYC horse-carriage ride: $34 for the first half-hour or fraction,
Horse Carriage Industry 653-A Bill: Over $6,500 in campaign contributions
Humanity: Priceless
Council Member James F. Gennaro of Queens proposed 2 bills in 2007 and now has merged them into one bill 653-A to ensure the rate increase to $54 from $34 for the first half hour or fraction is enacted. Bill 653-A (A local law to amend the administrative code of the city of New York, in relation to the regulation of horse drawn cabs) is scheduled for a hearing and most likely a vote on Friday, January 30th, 10:00 AM at Council Chambers-City Hall. On May 11, 2007, CM Gennaro received from over 45 carriage drivers and owners ,including the industry's lobbyist James McMahon, over $6,500 in campaign contributions which amounts over $28,500 with contributions matched.
Bill 653-A has no provision for mandatory retirement homes for the horses and doesn't restrict the horses to the park only. Comptroller William C. Thompson Jr.'s Office Audit Report of the Carriage-Horse Industry, dated June 27, 2007, found "When we asked DOHMH officials why there was so little oversight of the industry by their agency, they stated that the ASPCA had over time increased its monitoring." Yet Gennaro's proposed Bill 653-A will remove ASPCA from the inspections. There will be no third-party monitoring of these horses since Linda I. Gibbs, Deputy Mayor for DOHMH (Department of Health and Mental Hygiene) is the wife of Tom McMahon, whose lobbyist firm Brown, McMahon & Weinraub LLC represents NYC Horse Carriage industry. The inherent conflict of interest may be an factor in the lack of oversight of the Carriage Industry reported in the Comptroller's Audit.
On Friday, January 30th, 10 AM at Council Chambers-City Hall, I hope Humanity prevails over political dealings that have compromised New York City for too long and borne needless suffering on those carriage horses.
I agree with Liam. So what if horses are being enslaved? We are the master race.
Whoops, that sounded way different than I anticipated.
Mostly @ Marcyd:
Because Liam Neeson is a member of a certain type of NY elite society, it is perfectly acceptable in circles like his to exploit animals without a thought. He is a not a "neutral party weighing in." In HIS circle: they regularly eat things lke veal and foie gras, the women all wear fur, men go "shooting" animals for "sport" and on and on. Please. Btw, t's called hunting. This is not the English countryside. It's done during the weekend @ Neeson's actual country house in Millbrook, NY, located in the "correct" area code, etc., etc.
These are facts and whether his opinon is ok or not is only about all our individual perceptions here.
"Many people who support animal rights causes are likely to also work for human rights. One does not cancel out the other."
While this is very obvious to me, remember that a lot of people just go about their daily lives and don't really know any activists. And not interacting with any means they don't know this.
I also applaud any person who takes a positive step towards reducing suffering. They don't have to be vegetarian or vegan or flat out "all or nothing type," which some people here seem to need as a pre-requisite to taking an anti-horse carriage stance. It is very, very hard to lead a 100 % cruelty free existance as imperfect, fallible humans. However, it's easy to educate oneself and then forge ahead to do what one individually can.
"Reducing suffering is the goal, and change happens one step at a time."
Yes! Right on.
***
I commend felixthecat for not engaging the comment baiters. He is obviousy passionate about this particular issue and posting lots of references rather than empty insults. I think that telling people "to get a life" or that they are "morons" ALWAYS backfires! Everyone reading those statements recognizes that the person who wrote them simply substitutes empty, judgemental insults for actual useful information.
And I'll never understand why people can't just simply think to themselves: "Dang that guy posted a lot," for a moment, and then move on, that's it.
#33
I'm for you in the cage match
Liam would dominate
as for feline domestcus
I was saved from the Yonkers Animal shelter at 3 months old, you ever been to the Yonkers Animal shelter? Because i'll tell you its no place for a kitten with the nonstop noise of hundreds of pit bull mixes that people abandoned in the cages barking incessantly.
Not to mention the fact that if i wasn't adopted by my owner I would have been put to sleep.
So i prefer love and a cozy apartment any day of the week
Watch out or i'll claw your eyes out.
As you really care, i do recall you stated to squat Squirrels, rat hybrids. those nyc carriage horses are slaughtered anyhow after years of abuse.
For the people who know nothing about our horses, how they live or how many regulations we have: We have NEVER been cited for cruelty in over 150 yrs. We have 5 stables, 2 of which are state of the art. We make approx 60,000 trips to and from the park (68 carriages with 2 shifts per carriage per day) per year with an overal safety record that the horse racing industry or jumping horses, or any other equine sport can not touch! All of our horses in nyc have box stalls. (which the mounted police horses dont even have)They get ferrier care, worming, and dental and vet care on a schedualed basis...which is all recorded for the city. We are overseen by 5 agencies (we have more regulations and oversight than at-risk children). We have temp restrictions(low 18-high 89), and hr work restrictions (9hrs)which are overseen by the aspca. We send our horses to vacations on farms 3-4 months out of each yr. When our horses are retired they are adopted out through one of 3 adoption programs we use-one is on the homepage of the new york humane society. We are licensed 4 times over (carriage, driver, horse,and stable) We are fully insured. Our horses were trained specifically for this job... PETA is really good at lying to people. their intentions are evil. They want to do away with all human to animal relationships. ALL of them including pets. Its disgusting. If you want the TRUTH you can see my videos on youtube of my horses on my farm and in their stable in nyc and at work. This is the TRUTH. I can prove everything I say....they cant! Please take a look before you believe everything they say.
http://www.youtube.com/user/StopLiesSeeTruth
These horses have no mandatory retirement home and the drivers/owners will never permit the law to require them to retire the horses instead of discarding them for slaughter. Peeba76 from Clinton Stables, where a 8 year old horse named Clancy was found dead, is not mentioned that even the ASPCA wants a ban because the conditions are INHUMANE. Also that they are not overseen by 5 agencies and that the one agencies that should oversee them has failed to do so. Look at the comptroller audit report thats states the horses were underwater, overboarding of passengers, no vet exam etc.
http://www.comptroller.nyc.gov/bureaus/audit/PDF_FILES/MH07_092A.pdf
Please attend the City Council Consumer Affairs Committees public hearing on Councilman Avella's two bill concerning carriage horses, and consider providing two minutes worth of testimony in support of this humane legislation. The meeting is scheduled to take place on Friday, January 30, 2009, at 10:00 a.m. on the 2nd floor of City Hal
No animal - domestic or wild can have its' natural instincts and genetics wiped out no matter how hard humans try to do so for their own greed and appetite. Cows and horses and all other animals do not thrive when their basic needs and instincts are denied.
This is why there have been 21 NYC horse carriage accidents that we know of in the last 10 years. The horses were spooked and took flight into traffic. LAIM THERE IS NO EXTREMIST AGENDA, ONLY VERIFIABLE FACTS. Another convenient tactic used by the carriage industry and their supporters is to say that only a fringe group of activists and 1 NY councilman want the industry banned in NYC. LISTEN UP! THE ASPCA, which volunteers to oversee the industry with their admitted inadequate resources, supports a ban. The ASPCA states that THE INDUSTRY IS INHUMANE, and NYC CANNOT BE CHANGED TO MAKE IT HUMANE AND SAFE! In addition to Peta, the Humane Society and ASPCA, numerous other equine welfare groups support a ban.
The industry is always coming up with clever spin that is always devoid of fact. No thinking equine expert would call working in Times Square, walking up and down 9th Avenue from their stalls in warehouses through the severely congested traffic a humane experience for horses (prey flight animals). The horses are slammed between buses and cars with honking horns, exhaust fumes, and total chaos. This is not normal and fair to any animal even if one tries to rationalize that they are used to it. No feeling creature gets used to abuse. To add insult to injury they have NO turnout (area to walk freely, stretch, socialize as herd animals AKA horse play. They suffer joint problems from walking on concrete in the heat and cold (high humidity and chill factors are not factored in for horses despite the real effect it has on them) where the temperature is much hotter and colder than the air temperature. They have inadequate stalls sizes which prevent many of the horses from fully stretching out to sleep well and the horse who are housed above the first floor of the warehouses have no direct escape to the ground should their be a fire. The list goes on and on so LIAM GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE YOU ROMANTIZE THIS INDUSTRY. As far as the industry losing approximately 400 jobs, oh please, this is life. We all must take responsibility for staying skilled and ready to evolve as industries evolve. They are not owed welfare just as other workers must take responsibility to stay talented, skilled and ready for new employment needs/trends. Health care, manufacturing, and IT employees just to mention a few- have all had to retool.
Listening to the industry and their supporters (celebrity or not) is like listening to the tobacco industry explain why smoking is safe while ignoring the American Medical Associations expert opinions.
AS WE EMBARK ON POSITIVE CHANGE AS A COUNTRY, WE HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO CREATE A NEW COMPASSIONATE AND SAFE "TRADITION"!
Get a life people...you probably travel to Maine with Mary Tyler Moore to spread hate and discontent during the Rockland Lobster Festival. PETA thinks it's cruel to take lobsters out of the sea, cook them, and oh, my gosh, eat them!
I don't like animal cruelty either, but can't you regulate the industry (carriage horses) and allow the service to continue? Acadia National Park has horse drawn carriage rides through the carriage roads. PETA screaming about that yet?