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Early Addition
Staten Island may be south of Manhattan, but it’s still not so far south that you can get away with wearing a Confederate flag T-shirt without some people getting offended. According to the Staten Island Advance, 12-year-old Shaun Hines has had to endure a lot of name-calling because of his decision to repeatedly wear his Confederate flag T-shirt around school. The school's administrators don’t have a problem with the shirt, but apparently some of his classmates have interpreted it as kind of racist.
So Hines has appealed to school officials to discipline his tormentors, who have taken to calling him ‘KKK’ and scrawling the letters on his personal items. The seventh-grader insists he isn’t racist, he’s just a history buff:
I just wear it because it's my favorite era in the war, and I always go to Gettysburg, and I love it. I just think it's a flag. I know what it stands for, but it's just a flag that the Southerners use. The South and what they did is wrong, but you can't take it out on a kid because they wear it.Furthermore, Hines says that the kids calling him KKK don’t get that he’s Jewish, so how could he be involved with that anti-Semitic group? “If I was KKK, I'd have to kill myself,” he tells the Advance. And if other students come in wearing T-shirts with swastikas, he says he wouldn't mind.
The city’s Department of Education says that administrators are allowed to ban “disruptive” clothing with gang colors, but it seems the Confederate flag doesn’t quite rise to the level of disruptive. And Hines’s mother is outraged the school hasn’t taken action against her son’s critics – whom he describes as his black classmates – because all the abuse has “severely affected his grades.”
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Free speech cuts both ways.
i can hear the usual suspects cracking their knuckles.
I think it is enlightened that the school allows him to continue to wear this (racist) t-shirt, since it is a free speech issue and it provokes thought on both sides.
Some simple math:
Jewish kid with confederate (racist) t-shirt +
"severely" affected grades =
possible learning disability or socialization disorder
perplexed mom should have him tested by a qualified neuropsychologist
Maybe this could be a good opportunity for the kid to learn that symbols have meanings.
Do we really need a history lesson from a 12-year old? Plenty of other Confederate flags to fly if you want to be a fan of history, but the stars and bars is still political now.
It is part of their culture to contradict the values of their host people.
50 years ago, they too enormous glee in offending the racist white Christians who ran this country.
After they took over our universities and media enterprises and indoctrinated us with "diversity", such views are now commonplace.
What else can they do besides bring back the old ideas they fought against originally?
Anyway, school is not a place for self expression. It is a place to learn. These kids should be uniforms, and leave the history lessons to the teachers.
I appreciate this boy's intentions however he's being immature.
question: whats the difference between a stars and bars T-shirt,a swastika arm band, and an american flag lapel pin?
answer: nothihg
The kid is just an idiot. He's probably just trying to be popular in the news and "edgy" or whatever. He should learn that his actions may have repercussions and he needs to deal with them.
“severely affected his grades.”
The mother is just as much of an idiot for passing off the fact that she has a lazy son and it would be someone else’s fault for her precious not getting high marks in class.
where is babyhitler now that we need him?
would like to see where he weighs in on this issue.
"Anyway, school is not a place for self expression. It is a place to learn. These kids should be uniforms, and leave the history lessons to the teachers."
Agreed. Uniforms for all.
look at me! look at me! this kid is of the trenchcoat mafia brand of outsider. hopefully this nips it in the bud...
Someone should give the little knucklehead a history lesson and explain to him he is on the wrong side of the Mason-Dixon line...and thats the way it is
The kid's going to get beat up...
it doesn't matter what it means, he's an idiot because the fact is that it bothers people, so what's the point
this kid's favorite war isn't gettysburg. that war was wack. The best war hands down is WWII. He's just a dick trying to stir up trouble like the jew who dressed as hitler at his school. Just little wiseasses who want to spite people. Still, more power to them.
give this kid a good old fashioned tar and feathering to shed light on his little history lesson.
I wonder if black kids' grades were affected by having some precocious little a-hole wearing a shirt emblazoned with the symbol of a separatist government that considered blacks property and worthy of enslavement. Distracting? Just a bit.
A 12-year-old is allowed to have his stupid little moments; he'll probably be incredibly mortified when he grows up. His mom is entitled to speak up for her son, but she should have done him a favor by forbidding him to be such a complete jackass. That's what parents are there for--mostly.
It's interesting that there is no mention of what the flag means in the places that were part of the Confederacy. For the more traditionally minded Southerner (like the young Jewish boy) , it is merely a heritage symbol that should be celebrated. Unfortunately, those who feel this way also feel schools should be segregated and generally fear and hate non-whites. I would not say that this group represents the majority of Southerners. But those Southerners would never make the evening news because it is counter to what the media wants to portray about the South.
Some how I don't think this is merely a freedom of speech issue because you'd never see a kid being welcomed by any public school wearing a swastika or a Klan hood. Kids need safe places for learning that don't emphasize the differences between them because the general culture around them will do that without any problem.
Oh and if anyone thinks that a Jew can't be an anti-Semite, you only need to look at any paper and see what Israel is doing to the Palestinians. Arabs are Semites too, despite anything that those in AIPAC and the like would want you to believe!
"question: whats the difference between a stars and bars T-shirt,a swastika arm band, and an american flag lapel pin?
answer: nothihg"
Sure in a cold, unemotional and totally intellectual and epistemological way.
Everything has context. Are he and his parents that socially naive to think there wouldn't be repurcussions to wearing a Confederate flag t-shirt to a school that's 25% black?
Likewise, I wouldn't wear a swastika armband in Israel or an American flag lapel pin if I were visiting Pakistan. You're asking for trouble.
shame on polemicist and others for generalizing about jews based on a 12 year old's t-shirt. some commenters on here are really screwed up in the head.
free speech gives people rights to wear what they want. what gives other kids the right to scrawl kkk on his belongings?
Kids need safe places for learning that don't emphasize the differences between them because the general culture around them will do that without any problem.
Everything has context. Are he and his parents that socially naive to think there wouldn't be repurcussions to wearing a Confederate flag t-shirt to a school that's 25% black?
Well said, both of you. It's not just about the symbol itself; it's about interpreting the symbol in the context of the environment. If you go to India, the swastika is still a sacred symbol in Hinduism. Most Hindus won't walk around wearing them in New York because they know the context and significance is very different here.
If the student is such a student of history, he should be very well aware that his chosen symbol has a negative history and is going to be offensive and upsetting to those around him. There are other Civil War-era symbols which are much less offensive, or he can get a nice Gettysburg College shirt to wear to school or something. There's no reason to wear stars & bars.
Wow, That has to be the Dumbest logo for a t-shirt yet. Is that the actual shirt?
As for this child, I think his parents (Assuming they care) and teachers should have a chat about symbolism.
Just because he doesn't get it doesn't mean he should have a complete disregard for other peoples feelings. Also, the civil war was the bloodiest conflict in terms of American lives. How is that time period "Fun"?
"Hines has [b]had[/b] to endure a lot of name-calling"
You misspelled "chosen."
I'm sure there are a lot of Southerners who are not racist and see the Confederate flag as a symbol for rebellion; I know I did and so did my black best friend. To dismiss this kid as a racist just because he's wearing a shirt like that is (a) dumb, (b) presumptive, and (c) prejudicial. If you go with that line of reasoning, all Hindus and Buddhists are anti-Semitic since swastikas figure prominently in their religions.
<southpark>"I think it is history. I think it is racist. "</southpark>
Wait, if his mom wants him not to be disrupted, why doesn't she just tell him to stop wearing the shirt. Also, he clearly was wearing the shirt to incite some sort of a reaction. Dumbass kid. Dumbass mom.
If he can wear that tshirt, then the kids in brooklyn should just get Jump White People tshirts..
[almost speechless at the stupidity of all involved]
south park (fine citation of it) got it right.
the kid deserves whatever's coming to him as long as he's dumb enough to wear it.
and what, exactly, is the shirt supposed to fucking mean? the flag, obviously, means something (indeed, great time for him to learn that symbols have meanings), but i'm totally unable to follow what the logic of the shirt is supposed to be.
I think this kid doesn't have a clue what war really means.
Like my friend on Fire Island in the 80s who flew a Soviet flag. All sorts of complaints.
Like from the neighbor who flew the British Union Jack.
My friend informed the Brit that unlike Britain, with whom we had two wars and which supported the Confederacy, the USA had never had a war with the Soviet Union. No Russian soldiers slaughtered Americans.
Don't you just hate Political Correctoids?
During the Civil War, New Yorkers by and large supported the rights of the Southern states to seceed, so historically speaking, a t-shirt of the Confederate battle emblem is not entirely out-of-place in the five boroughs. Union troops were rushed to New York City from Gettysburg to help quell the Draft Riots of 1863. Jews who lived in the South supported the C.S.A. like anyone else. (Confederate Treasurer and Attorney General Judah Benjamin was Jewish). Indeed, many people who use the Confederate battle flag today do so in a context that denotes beliefs that are racist or xenophobic. But that clearly is not always the case. Is 'The Dukes of Hazzard' a racist TV show/movie? Is Lynyrd Skynyrd a racist band? No. We know they are not because we see those uses of the Confederate flag in their proper context. So it should be with this student on Staten Island. It seems like he's the victim of "hate crimes" here. And even in its most offensive context, the Confederate flag should not be considered a symbol on par with the Swastika.
The shirt is definitely offensive. But he still has the right to wear it. At the same time, he'll have to deal with the consequences.
Personally, I'm fine with him wearing it to school if its not disruptive, even though its disgusting.
The Confederate flag should not be a symbol for racism but sadly it is. I'm from North Carolina and see these on shirts, trucks, cars, and houses frequently. People there don't exactly interpret it as racist. Black or white. Its not exactly a peace symbol but its accepted.
It only became a symbol for hate when the KKK and all of their idiotic and racist followers adopted it.
The kid isn't helping anything though.
Polite New Yorker is right in saying that the Confederate flag should not be on par wit the Swastika.
Plus the Civil War wasn't originally fought for slavery.
Polite New Yorker is right in saying that the Confederate flag should not be on par wit the Swastika.
Why not? After all, the swastika had a history going back thousands of years, and was used as a good symbol by different groups ranging from Romans to Hindus and Buddhists before it was appropriated by the Nazis. It has more of a positive record than a negative one, if we look at the history. If you walk into a synagogue wearing a swastika, which context will people take?
The kid isn't showing any sensitivity or understanding how the symbol he has chosen will be taken. Whether or not he sees it as a racist symbol, unfortunately, he's not in the south and that isn't how it is taken here. Technically he has a right to wear the shirt wherever he wants, but by the same token, everyone else has a right to their own opinions and the right to be offended and question his lack of judgment and cultural sensitivity.
Smartass has the right to ask for a beating if he wants. But, since it seems thats NOT what he wants, he should stop being a little jackass and learn that school policies and the law arent going to protect him. You can't force people to be rational, ESPECIALLY CHILDREN. What is he after? Clearly he knows he already has the RIGHT to wear it, but why would he want to in light of the bullshit it has caused him? Wear it on the weekends dude, you've got enough trouble making friends.
Why is it when I wear my "Arbeit Mach Frei" shirt - I'm called an Anti-Semite. I'm just expressing the importance of hard work.
In japan, the swastika is a Shinto symbol of life. You can see it on many Shinto temples.
We've all had to use that rest stop in South Carolina and we've all walked past that shirt in the gift shop. In that context, we shook our heads and moved on, but here, it becomes a huge stink. Some jews wear cowboy hats and some jews dig NASCAR. I've always wondered about THEM.
If the south won the war, it would have been an epic and righteous struggle over state's rights.
Since they lost, it was fought of what the North says it was: slavery.
While t-shirts with images of mass murderers like Mao or Che are considered chic & are worn with pride.
#8 - great name. You're a head of cabbage indeed.
can't we get rid of this flag already?
there, I said. Get rid of it.
I've been to NASCAR races and they don't like the flag flown and I'm FROM N.C.
I think it's interesting that a little yankee boy want's to wear the shirt, and if he has an interest in Confederate history that's great.
He also might like to know that the Confederate Secretary of State, Judah P Benjamin was Jewish, and that he was the first Jew to be a cabinit member in all of North America, AND he was called "the brains of the Confederacy." He also might like to know that thousands of free blacks fought honorably for the south along with Hispanics from Texas, and the Cherokee from Oklahoma. Cherokee Indian, Stand Waite was a General in the Confederate Army.
I am a little concerned about what he's being taught in history though. The South was simply fighting for our independence, for limited government, low taxes, the constitution and liberty as was set up by their fathers, and grandfathers in 1776. Jefferson Davis said he would rather leave the country with the constitution than stay in it without it.
Back to the issue. The Battle Flag (not the "stars and bars") is simply a flag in which thousands of Southern men and women fought, bled, and died under for the protection of their homeland and rights. Today it is viewed as a proud symbol of our Soutrhern Heritage and our brave ancestors. Although, it has been mistreated and misused, but those same groups who abuse our flag also use and abuse the U.S. flag which has flown on every slave ship that ever came here, has flown over legalized slavery, flown over the removal of the Indians from their native land to Oklahoma, has flown over the invasion, pillaging, murdering, and raping of the South(including all southerners black-white), has flown over the slaughter of the plains indians and many other terrible things. Tell me which is more offensive?
I've been trying to find a Union shirt that could be considered racist in proper context, as the Confederate one rightly is by the black students this little shit's in class with, and I still can't find it. Part of it may be that I can't really find a Union shirt, because the North decided to move on with its culture, instead of continuing to promote a racist agenda.
"Celebrating heritage" is the biggest line of shit I've ever heard--what heritage, you obese, uneducated, poor (the stats back all of these "generalizations"--yes, they do) people who cling to your guns and bibles and claim Christian values while continuing to promote a racist past? Public lynchings? Ownership of humans? Beautiful fields of cotton? Pigs? Give me a fucking break.
Maybe I'm being a bit slow but I don't understand what point the T Shirt is trying to make. 'If this T Shirt offends you.. you need a history lesson'. What history lesson? Could anyone enlighten me? I was always under the impression that the ecomonic system the Confederacy was defending was based on the slavery and subjugation of its black population.