Gothamist: Gotbaum Family Sues Over Airport Death

edEx

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 14:10:35 -0500

*finding her blood alcohol to be 0.24, three times the legal limit* she killed herself.

GaryK

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 14:08:44 -0500

Does anybody know if criminal charges were filled against the police? It would seem to me that would be the first step - prove that the police acted criminally. If they did not I don't see how you can sue for damages. The world is not a perfect place and bad/sad things happen.

Gwinny

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:14:57 -0500

Politburo: I agree with what you and zodak are saying... unfortunately, as none of this would've happened if someone had just travelled with her. In general, alcohol abuse and a high-stress/oversupervised place like an aiport simply don't mix. It doesn't take a genius to figure that out and anticipate that there might be problems. But that will all be brought up in court, and then dismissed as irrelevant. That being said, it is sad and disturbing that this woman was flipping out so bad that she managed to kill herself (accidentally or not) in a mere 20 minutes. I can't imagine it would've been fun to hang around with her in that state, but ultimately that's the job of the police and they totally failed on that point. And yes, that is what is going to matter in court.

Mike D

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:04:55 -0500

She essentially committed suicide. End of story.

Polite New Yorker

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 12:00:56 -0500

If a person in custody is too out-of-control to be taken out of handcuffs, then they are too out-of-control to be left unsupervised for the amount of time it took for Gotbaum to somehow choke herself.

Politburo

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:56:54 -0500

I think a lot of the issues being discussed will not be raised in court. The letter is irrelevant to the case.. the husband not going along is irrelevant to the case. What is relevant, as zodak highlighted, is that the deceased was in police custody at the time of her death.

Art Stewel

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:48:46 -0500

The Gotbaum's are 100% at fault. Should they actual file suit, I wish sanctions on the plaintiff attorneys and a long drawn out expensive trial with a verdict for all the defendants, including the police, and the city of Phoenix. Only an evil bastard would let a sick person travel by themself to rehab.

Ph

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:48:01 -0500

The only one to blame here is Noah Gotbaum. You do not allow a mentally disturbed person who is prone to self-medicating to travel alone. You do not honor their demand that they 'do this alone'. If they could make that decision for themselves, they would not be mentally disturbed or self-medicating. It really is that simple. If that had been a guy that pulled shit like that, he'd be hog tied and carted away too. The ugliest part of this is....speaking from the perspective of someone who's known people who have offed themselves...I bet this woman really did want to die and, at the end of the day, she found a way to do it. I'm pretty anti-cop, especially lately..but this is BS. That woman should have never even been humored with flying alone. It should not have even been an option. Period. I predict that court will throw this out, because I have a feeling the city is not going to settle with these people and the juries out there are not going to be kind to the Gotbaum family considering all the facts that I mentioned above. Also, loved the letter from the city attorney. I thought it was worded very well and said what honestly had to be said.

Rolltide23

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:39:46 -0500

This will be dismissed. She was drunk, got arrested, was put in a cell, and strangled herself to death. Now she is dead, by her own hands.

Jerk Store

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:36:12 -0500

This is a sad story, all the way around. Even if it was completely her and/or the husband's fault, even if one or the both of them were shamefully negligent themselves, and even if it is wrong for them to be pointing fingers at the city of Phoenix, the fact still remains that a wife and a mother is dead. No need to release a public statement rubbing salt in the wound, especially when that ham-fisted statement is likely to turn public sentiment against you even if you are in the right. "the victim died under police custody" I don't think the police are obligated to monitor somebody every single minute that they are in custody. Even if they knew she was intoxicated and/or disturbed, I don't think it's necessary to watch her every single minute to make sure she doesn't try to wrangle her way out of the handcuffs and wind up in a bad spot. Of course other facts could come out that implicate the PD, but the mere fact she was under police custody doesn't make this open and shut.

zodak

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 11:17:03 -0500

a lot of mistakes were made by everyone but the only thing that matters is what S.D. pointed out: the victim died under police custody that stupid letter only addresses why she was arrested. which isn't in dispute. it sounds like an adult's way of saying "but she started it!"

ihateallbrokers

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:52:23 -0500

good riddance i say... hope she is burning in hell for eternity

Novanglus

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:40:44 -0500

If she was int hat bad of shape, ehr husband should have been with her and shouldn't have let her fly alone. I think that will be HUGE in court, showing how un-serious he thought it was beforehand. Also, it's not up to the police to be a kind soul to this person. If you want a counselor, then take her to rehab yourself....instead of dumping her at the airport. Bon voyage! The lady was acting like a psychotic drunk, threatening police and losing her mind. It is VERY sad that she died, and although one can say she is the "victim" of alcohol abuse, she did ALL of this, including her death, to herself. Sad, but fucking deal with is Gotbaums. If I was married to a greedy, selfish, dickhead husband, I'd get drunk and kill myself, too.

smitty

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:35:28 -0500

You never let someone to go rehab alone. It does not work. That is just idiotic.

drewo

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:18:38 -0500

Also agree with #5, #7 and #9 on this one. Horrible PR by the city of Phoenix to release that letter. They seem to say that because the sickly victim was hurling verbal abuse at the cops, the police are justified in their "homicide by negligence"? I think the Gotbaum's will emerge the winners in this case. And there's a lot of ex-Nor'easterners living in the Phoenix area these days.

eyekantspel

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:15:28 -0500

IMO, City attorney Stephen Craig will go down as the Idiot who does not know how to handle this sort of thing. Don't discount the fact that this is going to be an Arizona matter. People in Arizona probably have a slightly different perspective on this than a bunch of New Yorkers. And even among the New Yorkers, based on the comments, it looks like many don't sympathize with the family.

chuzzlewit

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 10:13:04 -0500

My guess is that she was traveling alone because she said to her husband something along the lines of: "I'd really prefer to do this by myself". Just a hunch. That letter is sarcastic and condescending, and was an extremely unwise idea.I can imagine the crafty smiles that came over the Gotbaum attorneys' faces as they read it. Proper police procedure should make custody one of the places where a citizen is LEAST likely to die.

Rocknrope

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:56:23 -0500

I also love how people make it sound like the AZ cops pulled a Rodney King on her ass. If she just sat and calmed down after she was thrown into the cell instead of writhing around like an anaconda, maybe she wouldn't have gotten her own arms around her neck and choked herself out.

bklynd

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:50:28 -0500

I'm with S.D. on this one. The Phoenix PD has consistently injected irrelevant personal elements into the discussion, rather than focusing on the technical. Remember how they brought up the fact that one of the officers had saved a life the day before? In the end, the case will focus on whether how she was handled is the norm, and specifically whether she was restrained correctly and monitored adequately. Absolutely nothing else is relevant.

Tim N.

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:47:48 -0500

After embarrassing myself by coming out on the "redneck Arizona cops beat up the high-strung Jewish New Yorker and caused her death" side, I have to say that the letter above has its valid points. Primary among them... why on Earth would you let someone going to rehab travel alone? I mean, jees, there are bars in airports, no? There's no bigger reason to get ripping drunk than going to rehab. And flying is stressful enough. The lawsuit's claim that she was a "sick, intoxicated, and vulnerable person" is, however, correct. And makes one wonder, if you've it within yourself to figure that out, why did you stay home while she travelled?

S.D.

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:42:06 -0500

... IMO, City attorney Stephen Craig will go down as the Idiot who does not know how to handle this sort of thing. Blaming the Family when the victim died under police Custody will go over great with a Jury after her family attorneys get thru with it. You'd think he'd have a clue and NOT give the plaintiff ammunition.

twakum

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:35:46 -0500

Put me on that Jury, I'm finding him to be significantly responsible, and would reduce or eliminate the award. Calling the airport? Clown, be on the plane.

Rocknrope

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:22:23 -0500

Only 8 million? I'm surprised. And that is some zinger of a letter from the City Attorney. Really lays into Noah, appropriately so.

mattcarman

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:21:33 -0500

It's refreshing to read an official statement that spells out the honest truth instead of stringing together safe, legalspeak nonsentences. I'd say the Gotbaums gotpwned, but maybe that would be insensitive? Maybe.

petebfd

Thu, 27 Mar 2008 09:13:58 -0500

tough call. no need for anyone to be treated that way. but also no need for anyone to act like that in the first place. just a shame all around i guess.