September 13, 2007
Firefighters' Union Thinks FDNY Should Use Choppers
Anger and frustration about the Deutsche Bank fire that claimed two firefighters' lives simply continues to mount as the Uniformed Firefighters Association says helicopters could have prevented the tragedy. Union president Stephen Cassidy said, "I think it’s very possible that the outcome would have been entirely different."
While responding to the Deutsche Bank fire, firefighters found that the standpipe was broken, which meant water could not be delivered to the higher floors immediately (firefighters ended up improvising with a 200-foot hose made of many hoses). The UFA says that Fire Commissioner Nicholas Scoppetta declined to buy two or three choppers, even though other top FDNY commanders recommended the purchase (Homeland Security funds would have cover the $30 million cost). Cassidy said, "How else can we fight a fire in a major building in New York City if we don't have water? The Deutsche Bank tragedy highlights that we can't."
Scoppetta doesn't think that using helicopters to fight fires is safe and told WCBS 2, "You can't use the helicopter to actually fight the fire. You've got to do it in other ways. We have a 61-page protocol for fighting high-rise fires. That's what we use and it works very well, and that's what we use." The UFA also thinks that choppers can be used for visual inspection, but the FDNY says that the NYPD lets them use their choppers for that.
A firefighting helicopter would be able to carry 1,000 gallons of water whereas a regular hose carries 250 gallons/minute. Cassidy says that a fire chopper could refill in the Hudson or East Rivers.
Photograph of the fire by Marianne O'Leary on Flickr
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Didn't those two firefighters succumb in the middle of the building? How would dropping water from above had made a difference?
Cassidy isn't an idiot, but he IS one to put forth such an idiotic suggestion.
Besides the fact that the rotation of the rotors alone could end up fanning the flames, how does Cassidy propose shooting a powerful stream of water from a stationary, lightweight aircraft into the innards of a building, where fire is more likely to start? (When was the last time you heard about the glass walls of a building catching fire? Or exterior walls, for that matter?)
And how does he propose to make practical having to fly to either the East or Hudson Rivers to refill the tank? Give me a break. Cassidy might as well tell firefighters to battle high-rise fires with water balloons.
assuming all fires are on the roofs of buildings, then yes, helicopters are practical. however, if dumping several thousand gallons on a roof if the fire is mid building seems like a huge waste. also, helicopters are not allowed within a certain distance of buildings, and i'm pretty sure there are NO exceptions.
Given the city does have things like brush fires, helicopters would be practical for fighting them. Other cities, Los Angeles comes to mind, have fire department helicopters, but basically for brush fire duties.
Now the technology exists to have helicopters with a capability to shoot water, sort of like a fire boat and that is what was most likely studied.
Now who much do you want to bet there was some good old FDNY vs NYPD infighting over who should have helicopters?
that's what I was thinking, TVM
I bet if the NYPD asked for them, they'll get them pronto.
PC kelly never turned a blind eye to new toys for his dept.
Come on, they have problems and won't use some of the technology they currently have available.