Scientology Underground

those damned religion cults are everywhere! damn you, religion cults!

Warning; if you take the "personality test" on an official Scn, Inc. website, you'll recieve Scn, Inc. propaganda for the rest of your life and the next one.

Scientologists are actually crazy. They should all be locked up.

Anyone know how it comes about that the Scientologists get permits to set up tables in the subway? They are often down in the 42nd St. and Union Sq. subway stops.

Why are they allowed to do that? I also see Jews for Jesus and other Christian groups down there.

Anyone know the answer?

they are in the 125th st 4,5,6 about 50% of the days. their table is in the middle of the concourse too...it's annoying

They sell the books - thats commercial activity, ain't it? Plus you have to "audit" credits to be a scientologist, which costs like 8 grand a credit or somethign ridic.

CULT!! STAY AWAY!!

The Scientologists are definitely require payment for participation in their "church". And the flow of payments never stops. So I am sure they are in violation. So why doesn't the city recognize that?...

I'm guessing Scientology spins the payments as no different from passing the basket at any regular church. Mormons are pretty dedicated to tithing although I doubt they would kick you out for failure to pay.

I agree.

Anyone having anything to do with any type of religion should not be allowed to solicit the public in any government owed or affiliated space.

Freedom of speech? Freedom of religion? If the message isn't commercial there would be about 10,000 liberal ACLU lawyers lining up.

Scientology is the fastest growing religion on Earth for one reason, and one reason only. It works. Despite the non-sensical genralities used to attack Scientology from people that have either never read Dianetics or any other books about how to better one's life, Scientology continued to flourish and provide people with a way to better their lives and become happier and more productive.

#19 Is that you Tom Cruise? Gothamist should censor his ass.

# 19, I'm usually pretty open-minded, but YOU ARE SO BRAINWASHED AND DELUDED!

From wikipedia:

Xenu (sometimes Xemu) is introduced as an alien ruler of the "Galactic Confederacy" who, 75 million years ago, brought billions of people to Earth in spacecraft resembling Douglas DC-8 airliners, stacked them around volcanoes and blew them up with hydrogen bombs. Their souls then clustered together and stuck to the bodies of the living. Scientologists believe the alien souls continue to do this today, causing a variety of physical ill-effects in modern-day humans. Hubbard called these clustered spirits "Body Thetans", and the advanced levels place considerable emphasis on isolating them and neutralizing their ill effects.

Jen. I read your blog fairly often and generally like it, so I was surprised to find this posting. I'm a Scientologist and I don't take offense at what you say here. I don't know if it's true, as I hadn't heard that the stress test tables were no longer in the subway (I'm a New Yorker living far from away to pursuing my career on the West Coast). But I was taken aback by the kind of comments this posting engendered. It's actually pretty shocking -- the level of intolerance. I think of the Internet as my home. As a Jew I remember my parents telling me about antisemitism, when I was a kid. I thought they were exaggerating. It was hard for me to believe that this could happen in America. Of course, I've learned a lot about America since, and living through and participating in the Civil Rights movement taught me bigotry is alive and well (and I believe we did a lot to change that). Now I find that kindred souls, people who seem to believe in the same ideals as me, feel justified in attacking my chosen religion (Scientology) and denigrating Scientologists. This is something I would expect from the far right. But not from the liberal and radical community that I consider soul mates. I believe that many otherwise rational and compassionate people have bought false ideas about Scientology, and have continued to pass these along without checking them out themselves. My appeal -- don't be part of the intolerance, but rather talk to a Scientologist and read a book by L. Ron Hubbard. Hey. I hear you can even pick up a copy in the subway! :)

Sorry, I don't respond to guests.

No, most Scientologists don't believe in Xenu, for the simple reason that 99% of Scientologists have never even HEARD of Xenu. It's a secret! Part of the "advanced spiritual technology" at the far end of the cult's so-called "bridge to total freedom". Yuo have to pay upwards of $200,000 before you get to hear about Xenu, and by that time you are so brainwashed that you'll swallow anything Hubbard says.

When Scientologists run into a Xenu reference in Wikipedia or South Park, or on blogs like this, they dismiss it as "anti-religious propaganda". The cult tells them that the claims about Xenu are false. But Scientology sued Karin Spaink for copyright infringement for publishing the Xenu story, and they threatened to sue Dave Touretzky at Carnegie Mellon University for the same thing.

Lying is a Scientology sacrament. They lie to the public, but they're much worse to their own members. Which is why Scientology is now suffering massive defections, as people get on the Internet and discover the truth. Hail Xenu!

I agree with the lot of you guys that Scientology is a cult. Scientologists say similar things to defend thier beliefs that I ex-members of the People's Temple said to defend Jim Jones and thier beliefs. Next thing you know John Travolta is going to be flying them all to some remote 3rd World country and the smell of almonds will be in the air. (Cyanide smells like Almonds)

I would love for them and every religion pushing person to be out of the subways, no matter what thier belief system is. My reasoning, is that they are just annoying, and they do get in the way. That's why I have an ipod, to block them out. But, the truth is, we can't. As soon as the MTA tries to do something the they will be all up in arms, there will be huge lawsuits, the ACLU will get in on it, and our fare will go up even more from MTA paying lawyers and other legal bills.

I do have this theory though, I see WAY more people than I would ever expect at those stress test tables. I have never need one person seriously take a post card and read it, but there are always atleast 2 people at those tables. I think they set up Scientology decoys to come and "take the test" so other people think others really do this and get into it too.

Also in Oslo, Norway: http://tinyurl.com/2lgxo7

Being neutral in all this I decided to get off my ass and go have a look for myself. I have wondered into their church and I had all my questions answered with their displays which were simple to understand and very positive in their teachings. I saw there "say no to drugs" campaigns, Volunteers Ministers activities on helping people in need was very impressive. They also have an effective system of study ( not going past words that you don't understand but to look them up in the dictionary ) I thought that was very sane. If I'd known that when I was young it would of made life at school easier for me I'm sure.

They also have other very interesting practical and useful information.

My concern is how some people can write all this BULLSHIT!! about something they no nothing about.

Anyway long live those people that have enough GUTS to go in and -LOOK FOR THEM SELVES- rather than listen to lots of garbage.

Cheers Jack

#32, this is #30. Thanks for your thoughtful reply, I truly appreciate that you haven't automatically dismissed me as an "antisocial personality". Let's start from the fact that you and I are both well-meaning, decent people. Hi! How are you? I am fine. Fair enough about finding information on the net, so let's stick with the disconnection policy for right now, since that is a direct quote from Hubbard's own work. Am I misquoting or mistaken here? Does Scientology Policy Directive 28, 13 August 1982, "Suppressive Act – Dealing with a Declared Suppressive Person" not say that there is no disconnection policy, and then almost immediately turn around and say that if a Scientologist maintains a line (i.e., remains in communication with, if I am interpreting correctly) with a Suppressive Person, then they are to do so OUTSIDE of church membership? And worse, that dealing with a Suppressive Person is itself a Suppressive Act?

That sounds like an entirely contradictory way to enforce a policy of disconnection to me. There is "no disconnection policy", but meanwhile if you don't disconnect from an SP (which is determined by the church and not the individual, correct?), then you are no longer welcome in the club, and are now an SP (thus an enemy of the church) yourself.

To me, it sounds like enforcing such a policy (a) could definitely force a Scientologist to break away from his or her family (and indeed, if you look for stories from families that have suffered the dreaded "disconnect letter", you will find them), (b) that it suppresses an individual Scientologist by removing the ability to make that decision for himself, and (c) further pushes a Scientologist into being more dependent on the group, since they must abandon anyone that vocalizes criticism of the church. I'm not sure I understand how a religion that claims that communication is so important (part of the ARC triangle) can then go ahead and tell you to cut off all communications with ANYONE, enemy or not.

I also want to add, in response to other comments, that if Scientology does in fact employ thought reform tactics, then "letting people find out for themselves" is not exactly a viable option. That's like trying to find out if milk spoiled by drinking it first.

That's great, thousands testify the value of Scientology. Meanwhile, if Scientology employs a thought-reforming techniques, then it is entirely possible that Scientology "works" by _convincing_ its members that it works. That leaves us at a bit of a logical impasse, so let's move in another direction: Where are the scientific studies that demonstrate the benefits of Dianetics?

The entire thing was concocted by Hubbard and has never been confirmed by an independent scientific study. The theory has been neither revised nor subjected to the scientific method. Any scientific study that is considered at all legitimate must be held to professional standards in its formulation, testing, and conclusions of theories. Dianetics has been held to none of these standards. The only evidence that it works are the non-scientific testimonials of other Scientologists, and those are particularly suspect because that's what Scientology sells in the first place.

Scientology literature seems to be littered with unfounded "scientific" claims. For instance, "25% of psychiatric patients are abused by their doctors" is another completely unsubstantiated claim. I'm not at all saying patient abuse doesn't happen, I know for a fact that it does. And y'know what? Maybe it IS as high as 25%. But there has been NO evidence or studies showing it to be true, so it is simply another lie started by Hubbard, propagated by Scientologists. If you, Scientologists, claim that Dianetics is really a science (and by extension that psychiatry is not), then please go find some _scientific_ studies to show it.