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One would think that some New Yorkers were fresh off the boat, or at least had never seen the Seinfeld episode in which Kramer is refused his calzones after attempting to pay in pennies. Everyone knows that merchants frequently won't accept bills over $20 or other denominations; don't they?
Apparently not! The New York Times has an article today over a man so incensed his local Chinese restaurant wouldn't accept pennies as payment––not for the full sum, just as change (his bill was $2.75, and he paid with two dollar bills and some change, including ten pennies)––that he e-mailed a number of elected officials. The media circus ensued:
Reporters descended upon the cramped, seatless lobby of Great Wall as customers elbowed their way inside to order food. A Bronx lawmaker stood outside alongside Mr. Jones, vowing to take up the issue in Albany. And the worker Mr. Jones said had refused his pennies, Juan Lin, denied the allegations, saying that she did indeed accept them and displaying, as proof, a clear plastic container filled with pennies — customers’ pennies, she said.State Senator Ruben Diaz, Sr. called a press conference outside the restaurant to play the race card, exclaiming “And we are in America. This is America. If you want to do business in America, you have to accept all American currency.” That's a great sound bite, except completely untrue. If state senator Diaz, Jr. saw the Seinfeld episode where Kramer was kicked out the pizzeria for trying to pay in change, he would be familiar with the U.S. Treasury's policy regarding payment and pennies. It states that while pennies are legal tender as payment for a contractual debt or payment to a government organization, private merchants are free to determine whatever legal tender they do and do not want to accept.As reporters pestered her with questions and a crowd, including a number of ministers, gathered on the sidewalk, Ms. Lin came out from behind the counter, breaking down in tears as she stood beneath menu pictures of beef and broccoli and fish sticks. She shook the small cup of pennies, went back behind the counter and took more lunchtime orders. The day’s special was a chicken sandwich, for $2.50.
Still, the Post reports that Diaz is "drafting legislation to slap business owners who refuse pennies with a fine of $500, 30 days' jail or both" - let's hope other State Senators are familiar with Treasury policy. And the Daily News' article implies that a misunderstanding started the penny debacle.
There's also an amusing story about a man whose brother dared him to collect a million pennies and what happened when the brother succeeded, but found it hard to find anyone to cash them in or even dispose of them. There's a happy ending.
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A few thoughts: It seems ridiculous that a restaurant would refuse only ten pennies. So, if the restaurant did do that, I can understand a diner's outrage.
But Diaz's remarks do seem somewhat outrageous to me. I don't think the restaurant wants to refuse money, and given that he emphasized how it's a poor community, he should be thankful there are restaurants that offer good deals (a sandwich for $2.50?).
Only wonder if they'd have caused so much stink if it was owned by one of their kind, just smacks of the usual anti-Asian bias in the black community.
"familiar with Treasury policy"
Overreacting, anyone? Jones and Diaz are idiots.
If, as the article implies, a large number of people pay using a large number of coins, I can totally understand the restaurant wanting to discourage that. Especially given that most customers (including Jones and Diaz) would probably be self-righteously upset about receiving change with "ten pennies." I bet that the restaurant is not the only establishment in the neighborhood that's reluctant to accept vast amounts of change.
I completely empathize with some people's complaint about the relative wealth of a community and a business's willingness to serve it, but this is fairly ridiculous and shame on the media for piling on and making this woman burst into tears. Who hasn't reacted with a "you've gotta be kidding me" expression when a merchant paid out $1.50 in change with 14 dimes and two nickels as they shrug, "that's all I have"? Multiply that by a hundred customers a day doing the reverse. Yes, pennies are money, but takeout places aren't banks. I hope state senator Diaz follows through with his quixotic threat so he can be more thoroughly ridiculed in public. Jerk.
yes, but the difference between merchants and customers is that merchants regularly go to banks to deposit money, whereas regular people are more or less stuck with the change in their purses. At least when they go to the bank they aren't given attitude about unloading valid forms of currency, and they aren't being ripped off by a coinstar machine. true, we could all just go to the bank and trade our coins in when it becomes too much, or we could just give to the merchants who regularly go there, anyway.
More grandstanding by a penny-ante politician eager to make the news. Certainly the Bronx has more serious issues to contend with than outrage over a few pennies. Love the "This is America.." quote. If the store were a bodega, I don't see this becoming an issue. What a jacka$$.
"penny-ante politician"
*groan*
For some reason, I don't think you can pay tolls on the NJ turnpike with pennies. However, a quick search reveals nothing.
I was really pissed when I read that article on the times. it's easy for a customer to dish out change once a day but think about the recieving end! it happens way too often. I've seen businesses that don't even use pennies because it's so inefficient to count when dealing with long lines.
“We are a poor community,” Mr. Díaz said. “And we are in America. This is America. If you want to do business in America, you have to accept all American currency.”
What the hell does being in America have anything to do with taking pennies? Is it about freedom? Is it the American thing to do? The quote, "If you want to do business in America" is outlandish. Should cabbies be told to go back to pakistan for not accepting bills over $20? What about dominos? I hate how idiots from idiotic communities can get elected so easily. There should be a test that determines whether or not you're qualified for office. ie. bush.
Jones, stupid bastard, made the poor woman cry in front of the media. Doesn't Diaz have anything better to than to push for stupid bills to our legislature? I don't think people actually think about how lucky they are to be able to get a meal for $2.75 in the city nowadays. They should be thanking her. Insensitive as this may sound, in general, I think the "poor" need to really suck it up and stop lashing out at everyone. fuck. this really pisses me off. and people wonder why racism exists.
Ruben Diaz is a fucking idiot. Is this what we are paying politicians to do these days? Draft up lesgislation to put people in jail or pay 500 dollar fines when they clearly can't afford it. Way to go Ruben. Hope you enjoy your precious time in the media, and resign already. Idiot.
This was taken from Diaz's website (it's the highlight on the frontpage of his site)
www.nyssenate32.com
In response to a community outcry, New York State Senator Reverend Ruben Diaz (D-Bronx) will join with Mount Zion CME Church member Mr. Wayne Jones, ministers and community leaders at a press conference to protest the Great Wall Restaurant located at 1533 Watson Avenue in The Bronx on Thursday, May 3, 2007 at 12:00 noon.
"I cannot understand how a local restaurant can refuse pennies – which are US legal currency – as payment for food," said Senator Rev. Diaz. "It is my intention that this protest will result in a change at the Great Wall Restaurant and that people there and throughout the United States will accept legal currency for payment – even if the payment is pennies. People in our community and in all communities, including less fortunate people, deserve to be treated with respect – especially by those who keep them in business."
According to Mr. Wayne Jones, well-respected member of the Mount Zion CME Church and one who has personally had bad experiences and has been humiliated at this restaurant will be present at the press conference. He plans to inform his neighbors and church members in the community to boycott this location if this matter is not resolved.
For further comments, please contact Senator Rev. Diaz at 718/991-3161.
I sent him an email. He went totally overboard.
I guess the NYT doesn't have the Duke Lacrosse team and Don Imus to kick around anymore!
i can't believe the snobbish sentiment of these comments - - they must be written by people who never experienced the humiliation of having to pay with coins. and what about these accusations of racism?
first off - diaz does represent a poor community - and people do often have to pay in pennies and coins to buy meals. lots of times seniors citizens resort to loose coins to pay for food. that's not from seinfeld - just another sad reality, usually served with a strong dose of humiliation.
wayne jones seems to be a well-respected member of the community - and good for him to stand up and push for the rights of less fortunate people to use coins as legal tender. the times showed that he and the woman from the chinese restaurant made up - that is a move in the right direction - and maybe other shop owners who want business of poorer people will reflect and treat their patrons with dignity - even if they pay in pennies.
jones is no jerk - and neither is diaz, who stuck is neck out once again to serve the underprivileged people who live in the bronx. he deserves a round of applause. and before you decide he's playing a race card, see how well-respected he is in the asian communities throughout the city.
i hope his bill passes the senate with flying colors - and that people appreciate diaz patriotism and care for the people he serves.
Many state and local governments will not accept cash for certain payments, period. Nor will they accept personal checks in many cases. They insist on money orders.
I hope that if she does get fined the $500, she pays in pennies...and that the media will be there when she's told the state will not accept them for payment of fines.
Great, drive another small business to leave the Ghetto.
They never look at the big picture. Perhaps a spik restaurant will take it's place.
Nope, no spik food for $2.50.
This is retarded. There are so many more important issues to worry about. Ruben Diaz needts to get a clue.
The patron was not "poor" he's a Lt. in the fire department. he's racist if you ask me, there, I said it.
You can take them out of the ghetto......
Wayne Jones said that the reason he paid with the pennies was because he wanted to get rid of excess change. He didn't pay in pennies because he wanted to raise the issue of the elderly or the homeless having to suffer the humiliation of paying in coins. I'm sure this came as an afterthought, just as surely as Mr. Diaz's sudden sense of patriotism in attacking hard-working restaurateurs who risk their lives to make a living in his poor neighborhood.
I hate how business won't accept Canadian coins but will obviously they don't have a problem dumping the ones they have on unsuspecting patrons. Where else am I acquiring them? I haven't been to Canada in years.
And every now and then there seems to be a shortage of pennies or dollar bills. Payback's a beeeyatch.
Do what I do when I want to get rid of pennies.
I buy stamps at a vending machine. And, I'm the hero when someone needs a stamp, I always have a couple in my wallet.
You can cash in your coins for free at any Commerce Bank. They have a coin machine, usually 2, right in the branch for anyone to use.
I live in Chinatown and once tried to pay for a new key at a locksmith's with a dollar, a quarter and 5 pennies (it was either that or hand the guy a twenty). The old guy waved a disparaging hand at my offering and yelled at me in Chinese.
I was trying to do them the favor of not having to make change and was treated poorly as a result. It was 5 pennies, for Chrissakes!!
just because it's treasury policy doesn't make it the correct policy, legal tender should be excepted by all, if pennies are a silly increment of change that has little reason in the modern world they should be done away with, round up or down to the nearest nickel and it all equals out, in the end the government would probably save cash on minting them , sorry illinois Lincoln's image can find a different piece of change to grace
#18 - wayne jones works as an paramedic. this guy rescues lives all day and can't even buy a cheap meal for dinner without getting hassled. i'm glad he and the owner resolved things - it shows that they are both good people deep down. i don't understand all the hatred on this site, or why you judge him to be a racist. do you know him?
#16 - why are you writing racist comments like spik?
most of the news stories about this event told that the people in the community appreciated the outreach by the senator to stand up for them. some of the comments here seem unjustified and unfounded, and directed at attacking 2 people - sen diaz and wayne jones - who are respected in the community.
let's just feel sorry for anyone who can't appreciate how blessed we all are to have sen diaz working hard for the improvement of the lives of the people who live and work in his district. he's a great american!
the penny story is a good story with a good ending and a good plan for the future - stop trying to make it something hateful and hurtful.
you must be a troll,
Diaz can go eff himself, take Jones with him.
racists. yeah, the South Bronx is a haven of understanding and diversity.
Like many people I have a lot of pennies lying around an I have no idea what to do with them. The good news is, if the price of zinc (pennies are mostly zinc) keeps going up I'll be sitting on a lot of money. Pennies already cost over a penny to make. In typical government fashion, a politician is going to mandate the government loses even more money by making pennies more popular. This unfortunate Chinese lady should look upon this as an opportunity to raise prices and make money for the future 'big penny melt' that many economists are predicting. Start hoarding everyone--your day of payback is coming.
So we'll be able to use pennies to go through the tunnels? That would be awesome :)
This "issue," post, and the ensuing comments, of which mine is a part, illustrate that this is the wealthiest nation in human history.
Anothercomment, while I agree that no. 16 used unnecessary language I also agree that it was Mr. Diaz who unnecessarily turned this non-event into something hateful and hurtful. In addressing the restaurant he said, “[W]e are in America. This is America. If you want to do business in America, you have to accept all American currency.” We do not need yet another reminder as to how the idea of patriotism has been misused by politicians in the past several years as a platform from which to spew their own kind of hatred. Additionally, when people, esp. politicians, start saying things like "this is America and in America we do X" that basically is implying that whoever is being targeted, in this case the restaurant owners, is not as American as the rest of the speaker or the rest of the community. If that's not hateful or hurtful I don't know what is.
The Great Penny melt might happen...but it is now illegal, Congress made it illegal for that exact reason, as the metal to make coinage is now worth more than the face value of the currency.
Ruben Diaz .... the mexican John Liu??
This is the reason why East Harlem and the south bronx has not been gentrified as of yet.
Those of you who work in East Harlem should know. Those who live there will forever sing it's praises.
If you want to see racism, try working in East Harlem. this is not Puerto Rico, this is America.
Speak English, sir.
#25 "the penny story is a good story with a good ending and a good plan for the future - stop trying to make it something hateful and hurtful."
Right. The poor woman was in tears. Can you even imagine what kind of stress she must have been going through with that media circus outside? Jones didn't do it for the underprivileged. He just had some loose change hanging around, got pissed off, and made a complaint. The fact is that he did it for himself and not on behalf of others.
Have you even tried working in that area and some of the people you deal with? I hope to hell that she made enough money and opens another business away from that place. What kind of a profit do you expect to make off $2.75 wings? It's almost giving it away. I don't see this as anything more than some petty excuse to make a ruckus. If it was so "progressive" and "American", how come the majority of people who have read this article find it ridiculous and meanspirited?
#34:
This blog is the only coverage of that story that is negative. Every other article or news story I saw about this yesterday and today seemed to show 2 people resolving a problem with the help of a caring community leader - Senator Diaz.
Again, I don't believe that EMS workers are known to be self-serving. They spend their days saving and helping strangers.
As far as the lady crying goes, we're all probably sorry that she was so overwhelmed so early in the day, but the news stories told that in the end, she seemed happy. She and Wayne Jones have resolved their matter - with the help of the good Senator - and the stores in the area can no longer humiliate their patrons by refusing American currency.
That's a good story. (I especially like the way the NY Times covered it.)
I guess we're in the minority here (no pun intended) but I'm with anothercomment. OK, maybe Diaz & Jones overreacted a little, but money is money, and I've gotten more than a little pissed on more than one occassion when all I have is a $20 bill for an item, say, under five bucks and the cashier, even though there's tens and fives in the drawer, chooses to pay me back in singles. But somehow it's unacceptable to pay someone in pennies? C'mon now. And I haven't done all the research on the US Treasury policy but I'm pretty sure they mean that private merchants don't have to accept large bills b/c of counterfeiting concerns, not b/c they don't want to be bothered with pennies.
Like I said, I'm not sure it had to come to this, but then again cashiers of any ethnic group (particularly @ fast food joints) can be extremely obnoxious, petty and nasty.
I love how some people are actually debating whether it's appropriate to buy something with pennies, which in this story is completely beside the point. Do you really think that if this guy went to his corner bodega and tried this crap, he wouldn't have been run out of there? The difference is that if that happened, you wouldn't get all the media and this grandstanding politician talking about "This is America" crap, as if he were suddenly Pat Buchanan. These Chinese people in the restaurant are just convenient targets, and it's disingenuous to say that all this is about the poor blah blah blah. It's nice to see that those who are easily prone to complain about being targeted because of their race are so ready to do exactly that to others.
Diaz is the worst kind of flag-waving nationalist. Yes, this is America. That means we should let things happen the way they're supposed to happen in America. Isn't this the land of the free market? If a store doesn't want your money, go elsewhere. It's not like like chicken wings are a necessity in life and you'll die without them. Anytime a business pisses me off, I go elsewhere rather than trying to get a new law made. Is that so hard?
Welcome to America, where politicians and the media can overreact more than you ever thought possible. Now go vote for one of them.
Next stop: Bush invades China and bombs them with US pennies.
Six years later: Everyone in the US notices and says it's a bad thing.
I read somewhere today (I think it was the Daily News) that the merchant claims that she was misunderstood by Mr. Jones; Ms. Lin claims that Mr. Jones is a frequent customer--recognizing him, she told him to keep his pennies (she would take the balance of the cost), but he misunderstood and flipped out.
Most toll lanes (not just NJ) refuse to accept pennies because it slows down traffic and creates a greater potential for dropped coins.
I'm amazed at the comments on this site - but it's good that we are free to post our thoughts even if they are in complete disagreement. Some of the facts from newspaper articles seem to be in disagreement ... didn't they resolve things?
As suggested in the original posting above, I checked on the link to the US Treasury site and it clearly says: "Private businesses are free to develop their own policies on whether or not to accept cash unless there is a State law which says otherwise."
Again - good for Senator Diaz to represent his constituents and make a law that will say otherwise and offer people a way to live with a greater sense of dignty.
If that law passes, it will probably make shopping less humiliating to lots of people - young and old - from lots of backgrounds all over NY.
"...unless there is a State law which says otherwise." Bingo.
There is room to change the policy on legal tender.
Business is business, and while we can all understand the $20 max on purchases for security/counterfeit reasons, I think all the "overreacting" banter is losing sight of what actually happened at Great Wall: 10 pennies were refused, and they were refused by a prosperous business in a low-income neighborhood. That is just plain laziness, and is insulting.
Businesses in parts of the City where people scrape coins out of their sofas to buy milk should be the ones to take the change to the coin counter at Commerce Bank.
And for those of you not in the know: bodegas appreciate money. Pennies are money. Ten cents in pennies would be accepted in most bodegas. Apparently the rest of New York is too good for their legal almost-copper tender.
30 days in jail?!?!?!
Minka - I can guarantee you that the ten-penny incident is one of many experienced by Great Wall's staff. I am confident that this dude, and many others, has waltzed in there and paid in change on several occasions. The restaurant decided that they would rather alienate a few customers to avoid the inconvenience of being loaded down with change. That's the restaurant's prerogative under federal and state law.
As for these people being "prosperous" business owners - are you serious? The restaurant sounds depressing as hell. They're charging rock-bottom prices, too. The owners probably live marginally better than their patrons.
Ok, so this JUST happened to me too. A new restaurant down the street from me in Midtown just refused my FIVE pennies as payment. My total was $7.15 and I gave them $7, a dime, and 5 pennies. The girl stated "we don't take pennies, are you sure you have nothing else?" I was enraged. After emptying out my purse, I finally found a nickel. Bitch!