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Broken engagements are tough to deal with, and one of the tougher questions is what to do with the ring. An Upper East Side man is suing his ex to return a 4.06 carat cushion-cat diamond ring worth $48,000. The Sun reported that the man's lawyer "declined to say which partner ended the engagement," because the ex should return it. Says who, the judge of etiquette?
Emily Post that the woman should return the ring, even if the guy breaks it off. Her website says, "Why keep a painful reminder of the end of an engagement just to be spiteful? It’s better to take the high road and move on." And according to experts (a married couple) on About.com, New York is a "conditional gift state," where the ring is considered a "conditional gift that is given in contemplation of marriage." In other words, she gives it up if there's no "I do."
We saw someone on WNBC say that engagement rings given on holidays (say a birthday or Valentine's Day) could be considered gifts, and therefore the woman would not need to return it, but a commenter says that's incorrect, though some lawsuits have given women ring custody if the guy breaks it off.
What do you say? In the court of public opinion, should the guy expect his ring back? Should the lady return it? Or do you want more details? (We do, that's for sure.) Speaking of broken engagements, Kerry Washington and David Moscow (the kid from Big) broke theirs off. Not only does she have a rock, they have homes in LA and Harlem!
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It really does all depend on who broke it off. Both giving and accepting the ring are a promise to marry; if he broke off the engagement, and thus essentially broke his promise to marry her, he has no claim to the ring (unless, perhaps, it is a family heirloom).
What would DeBeers say?
They call the shots, and decide who does what in the industry.
I pity the fool who spends $48,000 on an engagement ring. Keep the ring honey. Sell it and take a nice vacation.
Hopefully we've moved beyond such medieval ideas as dowries and "women are property" when it comes to marriage, so a woman keeping the ring is basically saying "you completely ruined my life by not marrying me, now I have to figure out how to pay the rent off these diamonds." How pathetic. Come on girls, this is not a credit to our gender...
Whoever broke it off gives up rights to the ring, unless the person broke it off because of something inexcusable that the other party did, of course.
The ring is a physical bond between man and woman, no matter who broke it off. Even if the man broke the engagement off, she should give the ring back. Its call an engagement ring for a reason. It serves a purpose and if the purpose of the ring is no longer valid, the ring should be returned. Goes to show you how spiteful people can be.
I think it depends on the circumstances of the situation. If the fiance called off the wedding close to the date, shouldn't the bride be able to keep the ring...if only to help recoup expenses.
No matter who gets the ring, it should be sold [unless it's a family heirloom]. God forbid if the fiance wants to give to his next fiancee.
50K for a ring, 100K for the wedding, then 60K for a divorce. This is beyond stupid. Can't guys just say no or do we have to stay cowed by what BRIDE magazine programs into the soft skulls of our females...?
a gift is a gift!
My ex-fiance broke up with me but he spent less on the ring than I did on wedding-related things (a dress, a deposit, etc) which came out of my pocket; he owed me money; I moved out of the apartment and gave up all my furniture and my half of the security deposit on the apartment plus had to shell out the cash for getting a new place on my own. Did I suffer financially? Absolutely. Did I keep the ring? You betcha - and then I sold it to pay off some of the debt I had incurred as a result of the breakup. We bought thought that was fair.
correction - we both thought that was fair, not bought.
Where can I find a girl who'd accept and cherish a Cracker Jack ring and a Vegas wedding in jeans and T shirts?
Whoever broke it off means nothing. The bottom line is that our society dictates the requirement that a man present his would be wife with a gift, that being a ring, as a sign of his appreciation for her.
Are you kidding me? She should keep the thing? How do we know her family paid for wedding plans? It was an ENGAGEMENT ring, not her MARRIAGE ring. It was a symbol of their desire to wed, not a symbol of their wedding. This was all PRE marriage (which unfortunatly doesn't constitute having the safety of a prenumptual agreement), which means if he spent 48,000 dollars in appreciation, and they split up, he gets his 48,000 dollars back.
Keep it and buy a vacation? Yeah right. I love how the blame is automatically shifted to HIM and that she should be rewarded because they split up. Grow up. We live in the real world, not some Cinderella fantasy. Ladies... you better learn there are much less of these hopeless romantic guys left out there. That means there are going to be less and less circumstances to which you get awarded some kind of pity reward for having split up with your would-be husband. Oh, and chivalry IS dead... women killed it with malarky like this.
Hmmmmm, Personally I think the bride to be should have to give the ring back to the poor guy that spent two, three years salary buying it . It's only fair, The engagement fell apart, The love is gone their's no reason to keep the ring aside from greed, and sticking it to the guy !
I belive DeBeers's commandment in this situation is for the guy to buy another ring exactly the same as the first. Then keep it for himself. That way everyone wins.
Dammit!!!! I gotta agree with "Phil" on his point . Chivalry is a dead artform (AS it stands in society). You women all want to be treated as equals, Well this is part of the "Equality" . I love how you all want to be treat as equals when it benefits you and handicapped when it doesn't . NO MORE FREE LUNCHES FOR YOU ! GET THAT CHECKBOOK OUT LADIES . : ' ()
Engagement rings are one of the most retarded traditions in the world. "Here honey, you know I love you because I want to spend the rest of my life with you, but let's blow thousands of our future dollars that we could use to buy a house so you can have a shiny rock that people got paid 40 cents an hour to mine."
You are right Phil, we live in the real world. In the real world people take risks and they don't always work out. Giving somebody an engagement ring is a risk. Deal with it.
The engagement ring apparently belongs to the man even AFTER the wedding has taken place. I got divorced in New York and was concerned about the fate of the ring I'd given my (ex) wife, since it had belonged to my grandmother. But according to the divorce mediator the ring was always technically my property.
I have to admit, I'm not really sure if that's the law. I think the mediator might have just liked me better. Probably because, unlike my charming ex wife, I didn't insist on taking business calls during the middle of the mediation process.
Broom, why the assumption all females buy into this shit? Give me my great grandma's gold band, City Hall (or a small family ceremony), and a big-ass loft party potluck where all my friends get super drunk.
I'm a woman and I completely agree with Phil and Tom--engagement rings are really stupid from both a gender equality and economic perspective. Sometimes I feel like we're going backwards as a society, in part thanks to the childish materialism of some women and the marketplace that caters to them...
yeah and no one has even mentioned the screwed up diamond trade....the recent movie is just the tip of the iceburg. there are more creative, less exploitative, and far less expensive (if not totally inexpensive..ie a pen and paper) ways to legitimately show one's feelings...
Engagement ring law is pretty interesting and it differs depending on the state you're in. NY's the majority though - no wedding, woman's got to return the ring. What does seem unbalanced, though, is that, generally a woman can't recover what she expended in preparing for the wedding (dress, deposits, etc.).
Debeers says: buy a **stock** of rings in case people break up with you.1 ring won't do? Perhaps you need 2!
Manufactured-fake-hope selling shitbags.
What do you get for a USED engagement ring.
Bet those dealers offer you 50%, which is still 50% more than they paid.
Blue Nile actually is the 3nd largest seller of diamonds in the US. There was a huge article in the NYT a few weeks back. They went from zero to #3 in last 5 yrs.
You get the same Tiffany/47th quality ring for like 30% of the retail cost. For the $50,000+ stuff it delivered by armed guards, rest is fed ex.
I for one would just keep it, till Miss (not Ms.) Right shows up.
Re: keeping the ring to cover wedding costs, if you've already wasted a fortune on your dress, hairdressing, matching shoes, etc., then you're exactly the kind of high-maintenance princess who needs to be dumped...
I helped a lawyer friend pick a ring that was almost $16k. For a great gal too, but nonetheless, we decided that the inscription should read "In consideration of marriage, Love Always [groomsname]"
Things can and do turn sour. Protect your investment fellas...