Gothamist: Where Xenophobia and Tipping Meet

andrew

Sun, 21 Jan 2007 18:50:48 -0500

Nobody here has mentioned how American tourists are commonly and routinely ripped off in Europe, where various "hidden charges" are added to the check. I've heard of people being charged for tap water and the basket of bread you get before the meal. Tourists go along with it, because they assume it's customary or don't have the linguistic skills necessary to argue with the waiter. My European friends tell me that this never happens to natives. That said, my suggestion would be to raise the minimum wage, and lower the expected tipping value. Tips should still be given, but they shouldn't cost a quarter of the meal. Also, there's something not quite right about the waiter working at the $100/plate resturaunt being tipped twice as much as the waiter at the $50/plate resturaunt. Both are expensive to the point that the service should essentially be the same at both places. Also, if you're charging that much for food, you should be able to afford to include a portion of the gratuity in that insanely expensive check.

Guan Yang

Sun, 21 Jan 2007 15:23:29 -0500

I'm from Denmark. Whenever I'm in the U.S., I always tip at restaurants, but I've never tipped in a Starbucks; should I have?

ozz

Sat, 20 Jan 2007 17:14:25 -0500

Hey #17, how is a MANDATORY tip a meritocracy? The problem with tip fom foreigners is deeper than americans would think. In my culture, tipping is immoral and offensive and makes the person ou tip a scumbag, low life, a begger. You will get refused and people will get very offended in my country if you try to give them tip. Although things are changing now due to american influence that "money are everything". First couple of years in US I could not look in the eyes of the people I tipped, it was something bad, illegal, immoral. I would never get a job which requires me to ask/live from tips.

squidfly

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:13:16 -0500

Im black, and Im a server. Black folks and Europeans do not tip, ask a server, any server. [92] Posted by: blackman | Your just POSTING as a Blackman. Server you may be, Black you are not.

New Yorker

Fri, 19 Jan 2007 02:09:54 -0500

Article about how tipping started in the United States: The New Yorker: "Check, Please"

Proof

Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:29:40 -0500

Have a Look! The Tipping Divide: NPR

blackman

Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:24:16 -0500

Im black, and Im a server. Black folks and Europeans do not tip, ask a server, any server.

Ree-Roo

Thu, 18 Jan 2007 14:29:02 -0500

I'm a leper, and I left my tip with the last hooker I saw.

Penny

Thu, 18 Jan 2007 14:22:08 -0500

Why do we have to tip hairdressers too? I understand tipping the local $12 barber but if I'm paying $75 for a haircut, surely the salon owner is paying the hairdresser a fair hourly rate from this? The issue of tipping waiters aside, why do we have to tip hairdressers? Aren't they skilled professionals who have trained for several years? Next we'll have to tip doctors, therapists, our dog's vet. ENOUGH!

jake

Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:51:49 -0500

I tip anywhere between 1 penny and 40% percent. If you want a nice tip, be willing to work for it and know your shit. EG: Bringing soup before cold appitizers (compeletly fucking up the coursing of a meal) is a way to get nothing.

Eat Me NYC

Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:58:39 -0500

Oh teh wank. Seriously, and I do mean this without any like internet thread "go talk to your CONGRESSMAN", but it comes down to, waiters and waitresses are trying to make up for a pay deficit most other industries don't have to face. Meaning they should have better base line pay for a very thankless job, and then tipping will be far, far, far less fraught and political. Follow this stream up to the big fish who never have to worry about their "tips" getting taxed. Otherwise, just order in. I find deliverymen are far more accommodating than waiters.

Teddy N.

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:18:49 -0500

I've had many dining experiences in Europe where I would have liked to give a 20% tip for the great service (and great food of course). I rarely get service here that warrants a 20% tip.

From Japan

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:27:49 -0500

Thanks for the compliments. You chose to keep the nuts in your mouth, but hey, to each his own.

jp

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:00:18 -0500

good comeback, very crever, i definitry got owned

From Japan

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 19:33:52 -0500

Wow jp, you are so funny dude. It's nuts how funny you are. Speaking of nuts, if you took them out of your mouth, you could pronounce "ridiculous" like the rest of us.

jp

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 19:26:30 -0500

you mean ridicurous

From Japan

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 19:08:16 -0500

From #79: "It's not as if we're talking about some obscure custom here." It's not obscure to Americans. It's quite obscure to someone from say, Japan. I agree that it is good to know some customs of a country that you are planning to visit, but I also think that it is indeed ridiculous to EXPECT people to know something like this.

Touché

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:40:06 -0500

Touché # 78!!!

taxman

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:37:58 -0500

#57 and #69, the government caught on to the under-reporting trick a long time ago. They tax tips regardless of whether the server reports it.

Eric C

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:03:07 -0500

"Expecting tourists to be informed of the customs of foreign countries is totally ridiculous." Really? I thought it was just good manners. It's not as if we're talking about some obscure custom here. It's a custom that, coincidentally, involves shelling out a few extra dollars. I'd like to add that I, too, think the restaurant's behavior here was appalling and entirely unwarranted.

squidfly

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:00:40 -0500

To all the upset and agrieved WHITE WAITERS out there. Black people don't tip, because your people never tipped us for the first THREE HUNDRED YEARS of FREE LABOR, we'll take our reparations where and when we can get them. A refill please Garcon! GARCON!!...

C.H.U.D.

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:34:25 -0500

You waiters are stoopid! Stop complaining about tips and get a real job. Your no better than hookers!

ML

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:09:40 -0500

All of those who think that paying waitstaff a living wage instead of making them subsist on tips would reduce the service they provide, let's think through the implications: --Paying a percentage of all your retail purchases (grocery stores, hardware stores, clothes, booze) to pay the retail staff --Paying your college professors an additional percentage of tuition for their salary --Tipping the bus driver 50 cents every time you get on a bus And etc. etc. etc. I mean, why should waitstaff have to work like that when other workers do not?

anonymass

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:11:40 -0500

Funny thing is, since it's so ingrained in me that I might have my food spit in or be accosted on my way out of the restaurant, whenever I travel I do tip. Inevitably, the locals I'm with give me that look of "Hey, don't be screwing up our local customs with your American horseshit scheme." It's not just foreigners who don't know (or who don't accept) these ridiculous unwritten tipping codes. Another poster pointed out that most of the American populace doesn't tip 20+%.

Sarah

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:01:27 -0500

Rolling-- I believe the plaque actually states both (that tipping is customary and that you can refuse a tip). Plus, how is the right to refuse a tip not a pretty direct indication that tipping is usual? I think it's fairly clear, even if it just says you have the right to refuse. I think those plaques have been in yellow cabs at least as long as I've lived here (since 1999), and they were how I learned that tipping was usual for cabbies.

Abologna sandwich

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:50:58 -0500

I agree with the Australian gentleman, I am a lifelong New Yorker, and am getting fed up with tipping. It manages to creep up a percent every year, some places have the audacity to charge an automatic 22% or even 26% for parties of six or more, that is absurd. In a related note, my girlfriend was a waitress at a sushi restaurant often visited by tourists, and they indeed often do not tip. However, there must be a more civil way to bring up the matter that just to charge them automatically. We, as a society, need to reconsider what tipping really is, a GRATUITY! However, it has been an act of pure automation, one must tip no mater the just circumstance...well, Ok..short of extreme rudeness, one must tip. My hate for tipping and my inability to seem like a cheap bastard overwhelm me at times, shall we examine a case study? I was out with my family at a dinner for five at Peter Luger, some appetizers, a family style steak, desserts and coffee, wine...the usual. Service was simple, not impressive, not overly attentive...the bill....$400. Ok fine, its Peter Luger, we had a great meal. Yet, what is the tip, 20% comes out to be $80, and you can't tip 15% at this place. I walked out of there annoyed that a waiter got $80 for barely doing a damn thing. When service is immensely good, I can see why tipping is right, but thats truly very rare, and I am fed up with it. I concede, we must find a new system and stop the madness

Rolling my eyes again

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:46:22 -0500

Sarah, Actually, the passenger's bill of rights states that you have the right to not tip if you dont feel like you were provided with adequate service. Nowhere does it state that tipping is customary. It just assumes that you know that, and this is the inherent problem.

dug

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:32:53 -0500

the 'we rely on it' argument is baseless. you take a gamble being a server. you know going into it that you may not get a tip. why do you do it? because the other side of the risk coin says you can make absurd amounts of cash every night. if you get stiffed, it's your loss to deal with. don't like the game, find a job with a steady paycheck.

Sarah

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:06:54 -0500

Rolling My Eyes-- Did you try looking? On the info sheets bolted on to the back of every yellow cab's driver's seat in NYC is the "Rider's Bill of Rights" which states, among other things, that tipping for good service is customary.

null

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:55:07 -0500

Can a member of the service industry please elucidate for me exactly why snotty, arrogant, careless waiters deserve ANY tip? I'm really really really curious as to hear THIS justification.

rolling my eyes

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:01:30 -0500

"If somebody's affluent and sophisticated enough to travel to the United States, they certainly have the wherewithall to figure out a very basic difference between the United States and France/England/Brazil." That's total horseshit. That's YOUR perception as (I'm assuming) someone who was born and raised in the US. I was born here, but I grew up in a country where you don't tip. Yeah, I tip in restaurants. It took me a good 3 years to figure out that I was supposed to tip, no matter what, every single time. I've been living in the states for the past 15 years, but I didn't know you were supposed to tip cab drivers until my friend clued me in last week. How in the hell was I supposed to know that? Think about it, where or when would I have gotten this information? If people expect tips, there should be a disclaimer similar to what's on delivery menus and such. ("please remember to tip your driver"...etc) Expecting tourists to be informed of the customs of foreign countries is totally ridiculous. The assertion that an affluent person has an even greater obligation to be informed of such things is equally dumb. Rich or poor, tipping is an UNWRITTEN RULE. Most people just don't know about it. It's good to see Mr. Pink finally joined in. I knew someone was going to do it sooner or later.

Joe

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 13:01:28 -0500

Shut up. What do you mean you don't believe in it? Come on, you, cough up a buck, you cheap bastard. I paid for your goddamn breakfast.

pb

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:48:27 -0500

Affluence has little to do with cultural knowledge, Samantha T. And indeed, little to do with travel these days. With the dollar plunging in value and cheap international airfares (Europe can be cheaper to fly to than the midwest), many tourists are far from rich--some are bargain hunters buying cheap ipods etc. and rationalizing their vacation in that way. More tourist lit covers that side of things rather than tipping--it's about selling an experience not giving the downside. What may sound like a sophisticated European accent to American ears, in turn could reveal very different class and social status to a native. Wealth doesn't factor into sophistication or knowledge either--or even good tipping (and I speak from experience with rich diners). I didn't mention illegal immigrants (!) and that's frankly irrelevant to the discussion. Having lived in Europe and the US, I can assure you that the issue of tipping in the US is little known overseas and that's the reason many foreign tourists give tips we'd consider frugal. It's not something that many tourists are told about and thus not something they can learn, unless they know people here, have lived here or have time to waste on blogs. Same for my Texan and Midwestern friends who leave the 15% they are used to leaving at home, not the 20% expected here. Believe it or not, most vacationers *aren't* told about tipping customs here--and it isn't easy to find that out from guides . That puts the onus on the waitstaff to let them know politely and gently. Not ideal, but there it is.

Mr. Pink

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:22:04 -0500

I'm very sorry the government taxes their tips, that's fucked up. That ain't my fault. It would seem to me that waitresses are one of the many groups the government fucks in the ass on a regular basis. Look, if you ask me to sign something that says the government shouldn't do that, I'll sign it, put it to a vote, I'll vote for it, but what I won't do is play ball. And as for this non-college bullshit I got two words for that: learn to fuckin' type, 'cause if you're expecting me to help out with the rent you're in for a big fuckin' surprise.

diner

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:18:31 -0500

I believe in dipping but I have a hard time correlating the price of my meal with how much I tip. For example, in the same restaurant, if my meal cost $28 ($8 appetizer and $20 entree) I can leave a $5 tip but if I decide to eat a steak and my meal costs $45, I'd be expected to tip $8-$10. The waiter did not do anything different. It does not take more work to serve a steak than pasta.

Samantha T

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:17:32 -0500

"But my point is, you can't attack people for not tipping if they don't know about it. Instead, be gently proactive and tell them somehow, as some servers have suggested here. Contrary to what we might sometimes think, it isn't at all obvious and most tourists don't know about it." If somebody's affluent and sophisticated enough to travel to the United States, they certainly have the wherewithall to figure out a very basic difference between the United States and France/England/Brazil. My sense is that we're not talking about illegal immigrants from impoverished countries who, generally, don't have the money to hit restaurants in the first place.

pb

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:56:10 -0500

Whoops--I meant that in the UK you drive on the left. But my point is, you can't attack people for not tipping if they don't know about it. Instead, be gently proactive and tell them somehow, as some servers have suggested here. Contrary to what we might sometimes think, it isn't at all obvious and most tourists don't know about it. And for that matter, out of town friends of mine complain when I correct them for just leaving 15%...

pb

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:41:50 -0500

It's hardly the same--everyone knows that in the UK, for instance, you drive on the right. Outside the US is limited knowledge that you have to tip at least 20% in NYC (or 15% in most other US cities). In addition, the pricing system in the US is not like that in Europe where you pay the sticker price and taxes are included (if much higher). Here it's accepted that the price posted for many goods (save untaxed supermarket food) is not the price you pay--but this isn't common knowledge or the practice elsewhere and, when you think of it, it's not logical--it's just that we residents know and accept this is customary. Tourists don't and it doesn't mean they are stupid or arrogant, just uninformed.

NYServiceProfessional

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:02:52 -0500

In response to all the objections to tipping here in the US by our foreign friends I say "OK!" I can't wait to go to England and drive on the right side of the road, go to China and address people by their given names, insist on a steak dinner in India or even go to France and be polite and see how they like it.

the pauper

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:00:38 -0500

man, people get their panties all tied up in a knot. first off, those racist statements? just because they may lean towards the truth doesn't make it any less racist or insensitive. objections otherwise are just stupid. restaurants probably get servers with the lofty bait of, "you can make more with tips," and they know there will always be a segment of the population willing to work for $2.15/hr before tips. tourists who know to tip, but don't tip are just doing what they can get away with. morons who write xenophobic statements do that in online comment boards b/c they can't say it to their employees. let's review. everyone does what they can get away with, it happens all the time. relax everyone, go have a slice of cake. enjoy the first freezing day of winter. Aquagrill is the only entity that's going to get bad press in all of this, sadly i wish all those racists behind those racist comments would get bad press in real life too.

D

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:58:20 -0500

Penny, thanks for your rational assessment of the abysmal tipping situation here. I think that an expectation of leaving 20% for average service is an outrage. You know, in 3 years, we will be expected to leave a full 1/4 of the price of our meals on the table for the servers. There is absolutely no way to justify paying servers less than minimum wage and expect tips to make up the difference. This is an antiquated, bullschitt policy that needs to be reformed. When the customer is being charged $8 for a side dish and the staff is being paid that much for 3 hours' work, something's gotta give.

anonymass

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:58:07 -0500

Hmm, you're exactly right. Whatever provincial moron wrote that obviously hasn't been outside of Manhattan (or more likely Brooklyn). And for taxman, I'm sure those tips are being reported. About as sure as I am that strippers are reporting their tips. Giant fucking eyeroll on this whole subject. I do exactly what someone else suggested: double the tax and add a bit if the service is exceptional. I have tipped less on one or two occasions and even not at all (e.g. when having food spilled on me or having been made to wait inordinate lengths of time for my food while others at my table are served - making everyone uncomfortable).

jean

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:51:17 -0500

I rarely have bad service from a waiter. Almost all are professional and courteous and that is before they know whether I'm a good tipper or not. That said, I wish the tip was always included on the bill - either as a gratuity or as a higher price for the food. My mind does not work like a calculator. Tipping is virtually mandatory anyway so why play games?

hmm

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:25:32 -0500

[46]I like tipping, they system ensures better service unlike europe ------------------------------------------------ are you kidding me? i've never had anything but excellent service in european restuarants. i attribute this to the fact that waiters are there often as a career - not as a student job - and are paid decent wages and take pride in their work. of course, if you are basing your experience as going to some touristy place in france as an obnoxious american tourist, maybe that is why you got bad service. hands down the crappiest service i have ever received is in nyc where the servers turn over daily and treat you like s-it.

Sarah

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:03:57 -0500

When I waited tables I made $3/hr (before taxes...). The rational for low wages at low and mid-scale restaurants is that the staff are not there as a career-- they are often students or writers or actors, etc., and are looking at waiting tables as a temporary gig. Wait staff at the high-end restaurants-- the ones who can make $700+ in tips each night-- are there as a career (and a pretty good one, I might add). As a side note, the restaurant where I worked was a mid-scale place near the UN, so many of our patrons were international. In general, they did not tip well, if at all. And keep in mind that these were largely international residents who worked at the UN, lived in New York City, and were in all likelihood briefed by their governments on US and NYC culture. They simply didn't want to spend the extra money on tips, and they were always sure to give you their tax-exempt card to save the extra $3 in taxes on the meal. Some did tip-- it's not a universal-- but I'd say about 75% didn't. I'm sure at least half of those knew better.

taxman

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:03:53 -0500

The Federal government as well as the State of New York collect taxes from servers' tips. The department of taxation bases the tax on an average tip amount. This literally means that if a customer doesn't tip, the server is not only making no money, but actually losing money. The server still has to pay tax on that tip, whether the customer provides it or not. This is why servers get snippy when customers feel that tips are a "gift." If tips were truly a gift, the funds wouldn't be subject to taxation. And they are, just look up the tax code. Face it, tips are a wacky, mangled custom that was once purely a gift, but now is a de-facto method of compensation, reinforced by our tax codes. Like it or not, a good chunk of the tip (probably the first 12% or so) is literally a wage payment, deferred from the restaurant to the customer, as reflected in food prices. If you disagree, write to your representatives and tell them otherwise. Remember, when you dine, you aren't just paying for food. That plate of spaghetti definitely costs more than what you can make at home, and it's because you're paying for 1. the pasta 2. someone to cook it 3. the plates 4. the dishwasher who cleaned it for you 5. the interior design of the restaurant 6. the cost of the seats and table 7. advertising for the restaurant 8. the electricity for the lightbulb over your head 9. the toilet paper you used in the bathroom 10. the paper for the menu and 11. last but not least, the server to speak to you, take your order and bring it to you.

taxman

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:03:29 -0500

bob

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:59:53 -0500

I generally tip about 4,000% for good service. Last time I ate out, the waiter yelled at me for only tipping 10x the bill, so I was embarrased.

b

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:43:48 -0500

if the service is so bad you feel the waiter does NOT deserve a tip, you should probably inform the manager and the waiter so they understand why you didn't tip them...it's good that they understand why you feel they don't deserve a tip so they don't make the same mistakes again or feel that they did do an adequeate job and you're just being cheap

b

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:43:08 -0500

Double the tax and do the math

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:42:56 -0500

All you have to do is double the tax and then round up to the nearest dollar. Above average, add another buck or two (relative to the bill of course). Below average, take away a buck or two. There, problem solved. The only time I've ever went below that was when the service was so repulsive (rude, had to request menus and water after witting around for 15 minutes, zero refills on drinks, wrong food was served multiple times, extrememly slow service, etc) that we left a dollar on the table as a statement saying,"Yes we tip, but your service was so f-ing bad you only get a dollar". The guy actually chased us down the sidewalk and demanded to know why and we just laughed in his face. Bad karma? Maybe, but that was probably the worst service I've EVER had the displeasure of receiving.

ella

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:32:40 -0500

seriously, what about the arrogant, asshole, disrespectful waiter deserves a tip? If someone actually makes my eating experience LESS pleasant (i.e. makes me feel like a burden, etc etc) then I don't feel bad about tipping less. Especially if their poor treatment is due to an assumption that I won't tip (because I'm black, female, whatever). If waiters are going to complain about lack of tips, they should really provide decent service...

b

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:29:39 -0500

I like tipping, they system ensures better service unlike europe - this is not some made up prejudice, but a fact

Will

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 09:05:08 -0500

Asians don't tip. Plus, they pick their noses at the table. Sadly, there are billions of them!

Arthur

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:17:25 -0500

Tipping should either be mandatory or not mandatory. It's ridiculous to say that the staff rely on it from a livelihood point of view and make it optional. The restaurant/hotel/whatever should not expect tips to make up for low wages which is what is implied by this! If I don't want to tip, I don't tip. I shouldn't feel obliged to do it regardless, or to have to try and make an excuse as to why I don't think someone serving me did a good enough job!

Angry Asian

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:10:51 -0500

I hate tipping. Restaurants need to pay their staff higher wages.

hells yes

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:54:18 -0500

"The "tipping point" for me was the advent of cash jars next to registers in Starbucks." Hells yes. I hate the f-ing tip jar at Starbucks, Dunkin Donuts, wherever. What's next? A tip jar at D'Agostinos? I stopped going to by local Starbucks when the barista started to roll her eyes because I never gave her an extra dollar to pour my coffee into a cup. Give be a break. I really hate when servers get abusive over tips. If I want to leave less than 20% for not great service, it's my right to do so and it's f-ed up that I have actually been followed out on the street and threatened because of this. I can understand the mentaility of tourists not tipping: 1) they are never gonna come back and 2) it's a stupid system. One thing that really sucks in America is you never know what the actual cost is due to tax and tip. In Europe, you know to the penny what you will be paying even before you sit down and it makes life a lot easier and more pleasant. They also offer separate checks in Europe so if you go out with 8 of your friends, you pay for your food and not your cheap friends 8 cocktails. I wish that system was in America too. But all you get is eye rolls when asking for separate checks. So many restuarants add illegal tips. I hope they crack down on this. I see it as parties of 6 or more on menus all the time. I'm glad I know it's illegal now. I got so sick of tipping snotty useless waiters in NY that I got takeout most of the time. And no, I didn't tip the lady ringing up my food even though she had a giant tip jar. According to Emily Post: "Traditionally, tipping has never been obligatory in any circumstance. The purpose of a tip is to reward a server for good or exemplary service. The gesture should come from the giver, not the server. There should be no sense of obligation on the part of the customer." So there. And for those servers on here who feel they "deserve" a tip. You do if you actually work for it and don't spend your entire time chatting with your friend. If you are unhappy with your tips, go out an get a real job like the rest of us. If you are good a being a waiter you will make good money. If you don't make good money you suck. And yes, I have been a bartender myself.

Rupert

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:44:06 -0500

I'm from England and I come to New York regularly. I have friends who work in the service industry and know what tips mean to them. Aside from having to repeat my name again and again when reserving tables because the person on the other end of the phone can't understand my accent, the second most annoying thing about eating in New York is a service charge being added to my bill. It happens every now and then because people assume that I won't tip because of the way I speak. English friends of mine have the same experience.

will.xls

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:16:23 -0500

The tip is separate because in the American system the wait staff is effectively an independent contractor. You buy the food and rent the table from the restaurant and pay that amount in the check. You pay the service personnel in tip. Think of it as an Ebay sale where you buy the good (food/table) from the vendor and pay the shipping (service) from a carrier like UPS (the server). This should not be a flat rate because sometimes you get a damaged package without insurance 2 days late(crappy service/overbearing server), and Other times you get next day air with package tracking and a friendly delivery person (a server that makes you feel relaxed). The tip should reflect the difference between the two. 8%-15% - crappy service, never coming back, but at least you were fed. 15-20% - ok, but there was some small problem 20% - good time 20% + - in some way rose above an ordinary experience If you can't afford to tip that well you can't afford to eat where you are eating. The restaurant only pays an hourly wage because sometimes the restaurant needs the waiter more than the server needs the restaurant such as side work and those crappy hours between 2pm-5pm.

daniel

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:12:25 -0500

Restaraunt owners should pay their employees a good wage and include it in the cost of the food and drinks. Then we as consumers would receive better and more consistent service and servers wouldn't be treated like freelancers. imagine if instead of getting paid a salary you got tipped each day from your boss on your performance, except every other day you boss doesn't care or notice that you're doing a great job so you get, or just wants to be cheap and keep his or her money so you get 5-10% less. is that fair?

anonymass

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:29:53 -0500

Why stop at 20%? Everything else in this city is so fucking out of whack with reality, financially-speaking: waitstaff will be expecting 50% by 2010. And they'll probably be getting it. The whole compensation model is deeply flawed and is only getting moreso. The "tipping point" for me was the advent of cash jars next to registers in Starbucks.

meredith

Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:14:20 -0500

Everyone should know that most waiters in this city don't actually make anything but tips. That is to say that their managers fudge the credit card tips to look like hourly wages are included, but if you really pay attention and keep track of your tips, there is no extra money coming in. This is true of most small restaurants in the city- the big guys are on the IRS radar and can't pull that off. I don't know where Aquagrill falls on that scale, but let me tell you that as a bartender in a small struggling restaurant I had many nights where I actually made less than a dollar an hour. I don't think I ever actually imposed a tip on people with accents, but I certainly have considered it and saw it happen around me, because though many tourists know our tipping custums, some still have no respect for them. Twenty percent for good service is the way to go. Anything less and I would wonder what I did wrong.

bklynd

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 23:21:58 -0500

Sure, IMNS, write a letter to Chuck Schumer recommending a bill to end the lower minimum wage for people in the service industry. Me, I'm saving my energy to get the left lane reserved for robot cars.

it makes no sense

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:53:22 -0500

Can someone explain to me why paying a server a sub-standard wage and expecting them to make up the difference in tips makes any sense? I understand the theoretical underpinnings, whereby the server is motivated to provide better service to receive a better tip. However, that's not reality. The reality is that servers feel a bizarre sense of entitlement. Even if the service they provide is substandard, if no tip is left, the customer is at fault. Why? Because the server expects the customer to tip. They expect you to know that servers are paid less, need tips to survive, etc. And getting angry at people who aren't aware of the "understanding" that tipping is required? It's fine to assume that this is common knowledge if you're dealing with an American, but why in the world would you expect a tourist from Europe, Japan, etc to know this? Do you know their customs? It seems to me that if we just paid servers a decent wage, everyone would be happy. Claiming that a happy, well paid server would provide inferior server compared to a discontent, underpaid server sounds bogus to me.

it makes no sense

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:48:56 -0500

Can someone explain to me why paying someone a sub-standard wage and expecting them to make up the difference in tips makes any sense? I understand the theoretical underpinnings, whereby a server is motivated to provide better service to receive a better tip. However, that's not reality. The reality is that servers feel a bizarre sense of entitlement. Even if the service they provide is substandard, if no tip is left, the customer is at fault. Why? Because the server expects the customer to tip. They expect you to know that servers are paid less, need tips to survive, etc. And getting angry at people who aren't aware of the "understanding" that tipping is required? It's fine to assume that this is common knowledge if you're dealing with an American, but why in the world would you expect a tourist from Europe, Japan, etc to know this? Do you know their customs? It seems to me that if we just paid servers a decent wage, everyone would be happy. Claiming that a happy, well paid server would provide inferior service compared to a discontent, underpaid server sounds bogus to me.

Kojak

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:48:32 -0500

Its nice to visit other countries and not have to worry about tipping, especially in Asia. In this country people are so dependent on tips since the minimum wage for a tipped employee is $2.13 an hour.

notipforyou

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:10:32 -0500

Tipping is getting out of hand in this city. 15-20% is adequate. Anything over that is excessive and should be the exception rather than the rule.

billionthserver

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 22:01:38 -0500

Oh, and to not even invoke the race card, women dining together are the WORST of all. And i'm a woman, so there ya go. An actual real female person, just like [27] is an actual real black person.

billionthserver

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:58:13 -0500

Blacks, austrailians, europeans AND indians, i'll add, don't tip well. No insult, people-no character judgement-- but it's what happens. Maybe only 97.5% of the time, but a pretty accurate statement, nonetheless. And when I say "tip well," ya gotta understand that nyc servers are wanting at least a 20% tip. I'll be the 1st to say that most don't deserve it, but less than 20% is what servers consider to not be a good tip. At my restaurant, we are permitted to ask the customer at the end of the meal if he/she would like gratuity included or separate from the check. Only if they say yes may we then add it. I almost always ask europeans. They always say yes. I assume they're more comfortable having it done this way.

michael

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 21:00:29 -0500

relax dude, I'm not a racist, and I would never spit in someone's food. That is disgusting and wrong. I was a great server, 1st class, stellar, for everyone always. Which is why it hurt, when I got stiffed. The job was my life, and I treated as such. Everyone from all races stiffed me and my compatriots occasionally, it was just how the game went. But certain groups really stood out in their non participation in the tipping custom.

jammer

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:46:20 -0500

michael, you asshole. you probably never deserve to be tipped. black folks have racist esp. you probably tipped it off the charts. cut out this entitlement bull. yes, your tips are the saving grace to any waiting job, but unless the service is stellar, you don't deserve ANYTHING. with me (an actual real black person), if service is good, 20-30%, if not, you get nothing. period. you're probably the spiteful sort that would spit in somebody's food. obviously, if you were even the slightest bit intelligent, you a) wouldn't be waiting tables, and b) wouldn't make such dismal generalizations about other cultures (or make them publicly). you asshole. love, an actual real black person

jammer

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:46:15 -0500

michael, you probably never deserve to be tipped. black folks have racist esp. you probably tipped it off the charts. cut out this entitlement bull. yes, your tips are the saving grace to any waiting job, but unless the service is stellar, you don't deserve ANYTHING. with me (an actual real black person), if service is good, 20-30%, if not, you get nothing. period. you're probably the spiteful sort that would spit in somebody's food. obviously, if you were even the slightest bit intelligent, you a) wouldn't be waiting tables, and b) wouldn't make such dismal generalizations about other cultures (or make them publicly). you asshole. love, an actual real black person

jammer

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:42:25 -0500

michael, you asshole, you probably don't deserve to be tipped. you know black folks have racist esp, and could probably smell you a mile away. if the service is good, 20+% tip; if not, forget it. i bet you're the spiteful type that would spit in someone's food. you asshole. love, a real black person

Penny

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:35:26 -0500

The US takes tipping to an extreme, which is not experienced in other nations. Will, as I said in my post, I DO tip according to US custom (20%) because you are EXPECTED to (even if the service is average). I just believe that it's a faulty system. In Australia servers get paid between $15-20 per hour, and will serve you with a smile no matter what because they're not being paid peanuts. A Bellboy will happily take your bags up to your hotel room because he's getting a fair hourly rate and doesn't rely on tips. It's considered slightly crude, in a way, to slip people money on the job. People in Australia do still tip but only to reward exceptional service, which, lets be honest, rarely happens in New York. US-style, 'Automatic' tipping negates the true meaning of a tip. But I'll repeat: I DO tip 20% here because I know that servers aren't getting paid fairly by their bosses. I am simply explaining what's wrong with the US system.

Quentin T.

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:29:04 -0500

I think Aquagrill needs a visit from Mr. Pink!!

michael

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:15:47 -0500

"Euros, Australians, and Black Folks DO NOT TIP." "That has to be the dumbest thing I've read all day." Okay, that is not a 100% accurate statement, but ask a server, and they will agree 99% of the time....

hashashin

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:55:37 -0500

I don't particularly mind when a waiter adds a gratuity to the check (as long as they tell me or it's obviously noted on the check.. hidden gratuities aren't cool). However, when a waiter adds a default of 15% or 18% I tip their default--less than my usual 20%. I guess losing 5% on me is better than losing 15% on a big table who stiffs them, though.

edEx

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:23:55 -0500

i have noticed that when gratuity is included, the waiter does less of this job. hey he's gaurenteed a tip now, why work? Here's a great op/ed from the NYTimes back in '05: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/10/opinion/10shaw.html?ex=1281326400&en=fce94190f5ff2faa&ei=5090&partner=rssuserland&emc=rss

its so simple

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:18:58 -0500

"Euros, Australians, and Black Folks DO NOT TIP." That has to be the dumbest thing I've read all day.

Chaka_Kahn

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:12:59 -0500

I ate a Mobay on 125th (near Lenox) and it was just me and another chick. They tacked on a 20% tip! No warning.

ex-server

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:11:45 -0500

Yes, Penny, that was my point.

will.xls

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:11:33 -0500

Penny...you are kidding me right? I tended bar for a while and know that your little tirade on minimum wage and flip 'that's your job dude' attitude are the exacty rationalizations that occur in your mind right before you leave an 5% tip. Tipping is priced in to the overall experience and is a symptom of a meritocracy. I made more tending bar per year than most wage slaves in the EU with their 4 day weekends and cradle to grave entitlements. Why? Because I was good at what I did and people paid me well for it. I am going to have to quote Gawker explains it all: "We firmly believe that the world is made up of three types of people: people who used to work in restaurants, people who used to work in retail, and born-rich a**holes. And when it comes time to go out to eat, the latter two types are at a huge disadvantage in the not acting tw*tty department, because they don't know what it's like to be on the receiving end of their own bulls**t." Go to Burger King and have it your way. Stay out of respectable bars and restaurants.

null

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:08:30 -0500

Where is ACLU, David Duke & Al Sharpton??

timThompson

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:03:25 -0500

I had a french couple sitting next to me somewhere in midtown (forget where) come over and ask me what to do, because their waiter had added the tip. I can see the waiters' logic, though. If people aren't used to tipping, it'd be easy for them to forget. And Penny, I think it's much better if a portion of waiters' income is based on their performance, rather than part of a guaranteed salary. Keeps them polite and on their toes.

Bah

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:55:06 -0500

No, it's not fair to randomly sneak gratuities on checks, but European tourists, as a group, don't tip. It sucks. At one place that I worked I made $3 an hour and served almost exculsively tourists. Though there was no gratuity policy, on all groups of 5 or more I added gratuity and made sure to let them know it was included when I handed them the check.

Penny

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:47:13 -0500

I take offence at this - I'm Australian, I live here now and of course I tip. Every Aussie I know who comes here on vacation knows to tip, it's written in every US travel guide ever published. Maybe the US should catch up with the rest of the world and raise the minimum wage, and pay its restaurant workers a proper hourly rate, so that this bizarre custom of tipping can be made extinct. ooh, so you brought us bottles of wine and carried over our espressos....that's your job dude! Your BOSS should be paying you from profits made from the meal we just paid for! But as much as I hate the tipping system, I follow it because, well when in Rome... I'll be watching out for dodgy gratuities added to my bill now.

add another to THE list

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:27:41 -0500

I'm adding this place to THE LIST. No more Aquagrill. OK, I'll be nice to them, here's a tip, Don't play the ponies.

felicia

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:16:48 -0500

I'm black, and I tip. Very generously. And so does every black person I know

Jen

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:16:40 -0500

This happened to my friend at a place at 55th and 6th. They must've classified her Bronx accent as "foreign."

Gwin

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:09:36 -0500

If the waiter was worried about not getting a tip, he could've made some casual small talk with the table... as in "So, you all visiting from out of town?" or something like that - that way when given the response "No, we all actually live here" he would've known they would remember to tip. I've waited tons of tables in tourist destinations and there's absolutely nothing wrong or suspicious about talking to your customers as if you are actually interested in them (even if you real alternative motive is to determine whether you might get stiffed or not - unfortunately a legitimate concern).

bob

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 18:08:39 -0500

In my experience, nowhere in the united states, europe, or south america tips the way new yorkers tip.

edEx

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:59:27 -0500

Europeans, typically, do not tip because wait-staff do not work for tips overseas. They get paid a daily rate from the bar or restaurant they work in. As for what this waiter said, "because you're foreign" well, he's a f*cking idiot. Regardless of the customers original origin the waiter should have enough sense not to say anything or speak with the manager about it. Sushi Samba on 7th avenue is notorious for being douche bags about tips. Their wait-staff, while incredibly good at their job(s) have no couth. I once tipped very generously on a $250 lounge tab—$65. The waitress followed me outside and with no manners yelped at me at the poor tip. I embarrassed her in front of the people outside (potential customers) and the owner (who she did not see) and said "$65 on a $250 tab is more than enough, perhaps I should cancel my credit card payment all together for aggravated harassment reasons." With that, I got a $500 credit (gift certificate) from Sushi Samba, which I used at their first restaurant on Park Avenue, a much better managed establishment. I used to wait tables and bartend and know the ills of it all. Being a dick will get you nowhere and may get you fired. It's best to keep your cool and get on with your life.

Michael

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:45:29 -0500

dude, I can tell you as an ex-server, Euros, Australians, and Black Folks DO NOT TIP. I used to hit em with the added gratuity every time if they came in a group of 8 or more. Even in third world countries, in a situation where, for example, an Australian back packer who paid thousands of dollars for the trip and flight and for hotels etc, will refuse to tip an indigenous porter who just lugged their shit up and down a mountain for a multi day hike. We are talking about a $10 tip, for 3 days work. I have seen it many times!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Cheap cheap cheap

ex-server

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:37:52 -0500

I get that automatically adding a tip on a bill for those who are assumed to be bad tippers is racial profiling, crude, insulting, dangerous, and sometimes unnecessary. But there is a reason "foreigners" have a reputation for not tipping-- many times, they don't tip. When an entire industry chooses not to pay their workforce wages and instead relies on an "understanding" between customers and the house for the money that servers make, it's just a casualty of war that these things happen. There is nothing worse than giving good service to a table, being asked for many bottles of wine, getting espressos all around, and generally running your butt off, and then being completely stiffed simply because the person paying the tab doesn't (or chooses not to) understand the local customs. That's money out of a server's pocket, and when I was a server, I couldn't afford that $20 that I lost.

Beth

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:37:51 -0500

Ginny, If you read the article (and the post) you'd know that Audesson, while French-born, lives in NYC. Further, there was nothing to suggest Audesson was never planning to tip. In all likelihood he was; he lives here and knows the custom. But he never got the chance, because the restaurant assumed he was a foreigner and did it for him. That's the point of his very just complaint.

jg

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:37:35 -0500

ginny: because in many places the gratuity is included in the bill.

b

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:30:35 -0500

the thing is that the restaurant ASSUMED that these patrons would NOT tip...like the customer mentioned in the article, he was a regular and has lived in New York for quite some time the Restaurant is definately at fault

Ginny

Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:27:59 -0500

Well, generally speaking, Europeans DON'T tip because they are used to NOT tipping where they come from. I know people who work in the service industry who survive on tips and I have been told that Europeans just don't tip or pretend they don't have the money. And if they're staying at a trendy expensive hotel or going to an expensive restaurant, we can safely say they're RICH and cheap. Go Aquagrill! Charge 'em 20% next time. You're in America, unless the service was terrible, you tip!