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It is getting impossible to root for the Knicks anymore. The franchise is completely lost, stuck over the salary cap for the rest of the decade and playing uninspired basketball. Now we learn that the head coach is running the team like a mob boss, ordering his players to take out opponents.
These are the facts we know at this point. George Karl and Isiah Thomas do not get along at all. Karl is a good friend of Larry Brown and he was clearly trying to humiliate the Knicks Saturday by keeping his starters in the game with a huge lead. We know that Isiah didn’t appreciate this and warned Nuggets star, Carmelo Anthony, to stay out of the paint.
The rest is a process of connecting the dots. Isiah was yelling for his players to take out San Antonio’s Bruce Bowen, earlier in the year, screaming, “Break his foot”. (Don’t forget that Bowen plays for Gregg Popovich, Larry Brown’s best friend in the NBA.) Mardy Collins, who played college ball for another coach who ordered “a hit”, John Cheney, committed a flagrant foul against Indiana Friday night when the Pacers were humiliating the Knicks.
So, we have the warning and we have the previous behavior. What we don’t have is whether or not there was a conversation between Thomas and Collins and what happened in it. But, just like the movie, you can bet Isiah wants to tell the world what he did. We just need David Stern and Stu Jackson to channel Daniel Kaffee and we can only watch the Knicks sink lower and lower.
And if you haven't seen the fight, here's the MSG footage:
And for some closer, slow motion action, there's this ESPN News clip. Expect suspensions for the fight to come down later today.
UPDATE: The NBA has announced punishments for Saturday's brawl. Carmelo Anthony got 15 games, J.R. Smith and Nate Robinson 10 games, Mardy Collins 6 games, Jared Jeffries 4 games and Jerome James and Nene 1 game each. Isiah Thomas was not disciplined.
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everything Isiah touches dies a slow painful death and yet he gets rewarded even more for it. James Dolan is a goddamn idiot. The thing is the garden is still pretty full. These dumb rich suits will pay for anything so Dolan still makes money on inferior product. As a 12 year knick fan last year was my last and this year I've taken to rooting against the Knicks and it's awesome!!!!!!! They won't fail you to lose. Now it's time for the Brooklyn Nets
This makes me even more excited about Brooklyn getting a basketball team!!!!
I think this is getting blown way out of proportion. The Nuggets were trying to embarrass the Knicks on their home court, a hard foul was to be expected. Isaiah was right to order 'the hit'. This is just like a pitcher throwing some chin music, but nobody gets so bent out of shape when it happens in Baseball and a bench clearing brawl follows.
It's obvious Isiah Thomas is trying to commit Career Suicide and wants to go out with a bang. I mean he could coach then entire season and be booed for a year at the garden and disparaged daily by everyone. This gives him an out where it's like "I'm trying to protect the Knicks Pride" so he'll get some fans going "YO that guys got cred" when he gets retires next month.
"The Nuggets were trying to embarrass the Knicks on their home court"
The Nuggets could have accomplished that by staying in Denver. Isiah should be fired, and the rest of the team should just give up. Stu Jackson should commend Carmelo for connecting on a sweet punch. The knicks are a disgrace...
Post #3 is exactly correct. If you're running up the score with a minute left, you're going to get fouled hard. It was definitely flagrant, but it was no worse than any other hard foul.
JR Smith is lucky it wasn't Charles Barkley or, god forbid, Charles Oakley throwing that foul or he'd have been unconcious after it instead of angry.
Isiah needs to have some dignity and fire himself.
"The Nuggets were trying to embarrass the Knicks on their home court, a hard foul was to be expected. Isaiah was right to order 'the hit'."
If you're team sucks, and you're getting your ass handed to you, the answer is not to attack the other team. Too bad if you're embarrassed. That's what it feels like to suck. Deal with it.
"This is just like a pitcher throwing some chin music ..."
No it isn't. Chin music isn't used to get even with the other team when they're winning. It's generally about manipulating the batter in the box through intimidation (and to intimidate other players) or his placement so that he can't hit future pitches.
A better analogy would be when the pitcher just hits the batter, the old "beanball." And in that case, everyone is rightfully upset about it.
on the plus side, this was the most exciting thing to happen at the garden involving the knicks in years.
>It is getting impossible to root for the Knicks anymore.
Did you just wake up? If I were mayor I would sign an executive order disbanding this team and forbidding them to identify themselves with NY. Jim Dolan should be shot on sight, Thomas should just be laughed out of town, and the thugs on this team should be waived. maybe my grandchildren will see a team that has a shot and isn't an embarrassment to this great city.
I agree with #3, this is getting blown out of proportion. It was a scrum that spilled into the stands and then blew up when Carmelo Anthony slapped whats-his-face. Notice how Anthony runs away from Jeffries? Yeesh, thats more disgusting than Nate wrestling with J R smith in the stands.
I don't blame the Knicks for being angry or committing that hard foul. Why is it that the NHL, MLB, NFL, Soccer can all have reasonable brawls yet the NBA can't? Are they image conscious because of the color of their players or something?
Five years ago this wouldn't have been such sensational news. Let 'em play - and let 'em uphold the unspoken codes of bball - like they do in EVERY OTHER SPORT.
"on the plus side, this was the most exciting thing to happen at the garden involving the knicks in years."
I agree. Hell I'll even pay to go to some games if I knew it would be this entertaining.
i'm with you, kojak.
they should make fighting at knicks games mandatory! maybe knicks fans get to take a shot at isiah thomas!
Just to put the comments saying that this is "no big deal" in perspective.
Now that the NBA has issued their punishment, Sports Illustrated is running a poll asking its readers whether they thought the punishment was too harsh, too lenient, or just right.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/basketball/nba/12/18/brawl.suspensions.ap/index.html
Out of 18,000 votes from what we probably can assume are sports fans, since they're at SI in the first place, only 10% think the punishment was too severe.
52% thing it was too lenient.
Just to put the comments saying that this is "no big deal" in perspective.
Now that the NBA has issued their punishment, Sports Illustrated is running a poll asking its readers whether they thought the punishment was too harsh, too lenient, or just right.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/basketball/nba/12/18/brawl.suspensions.ap/index.html
Out of 18,000 votes from what we probably can assume are sports fans, since they're at SI in the first place, only 10% think the punishment was too severe.
52% think it was too lenient.
Anyone who thinks the knicks were wrong in this situation (besides the initial foul) is crazy. Carmelo Anthony and J.R. Smith are young punks who deserve bigger suspensions. Isiah Thomas is doing better then Larry Brown did and I know for a fact that he will get this team to be great. if anyone disagrees lets hear what you have to say and then move to denver
I agree with ^^^^. knicksfan should be hit by carmelo anthony. Excluding a few people, you are all fake knicks fans. Go to some nets games because we dont need you!
great headline.
if the NBA really wanted to punish the knicks, they should have just mandated a contract extension for Isiah
How come they only punished black players and not David Lee?
they didnt punish channing frye. Did david lee do anything? i didnt think so.