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Early Addition
I have a really puzzling situation that seems to arise often when I ride the subway. You know how the conductors tell us to "step aside and let 'em off"?
Here is what happened yesterday, which is pretty typical: I was trying to change to the express train from the local, and as we pulled into the station I saw my train across the platform. I was not the only one. There were a whole bunch of us at the door eagerly waiting to leave the train and jump on the express across the tracks. I just happened to be in front, at the door. So anyway, by the time the doors opened, there was a fair-sized guy standing right in the middle in front of the door, with two other people standing at the sides but just blocking enough of the door so that no one could get out.
So I said "excuse me," and he did nothing. Not a move by anyone. So, having no choice really (I certainly couldn't back up, there being all those people behind me, and besides, we want the express!) I had to push between the big guy and the others, at which point he LAUGHED AT ME.
This is what I don't get, Gothamist. What exactly was I supposed to have done in that situation? Why was he laughing?
I only ask because this sort of thing seems to happen a lot, and the reaction of the person or people blocking the door to my requests that they allow me to leave the train is usally something like laughter.
So what is the right thing to do here?
And why are they laughing?
Oh boy. We can only imagine that this is going to incite a lot of comments so lets get started. We don't know how many times we have encountered the same type of lazy behavior from our fellow commuters. People like to lean against the door instead of holding the pole. We even do it ourselves, it's more comfortable. However, in saying that, the proper thing to do would be to either exit the train and stand to the side while others exit and then re-enter the train, or move out of the door before people are trying to exit. But some people are just plain lazy and can't be bothered. Our method of exiting the train in that situation is to say excuse me once, giving them the opportunity to move. If they dont, we shove our way out, while saying excuse me again. We feel that if someone is too lazy to move they probably don't mind all that much being nailed in the gut by our bag or elbow. (Of course, this does not apply to small children or the elderly, or tourists who seem unfamiliar with the trains.) Or you can try another set of doors, but then you risk getting caught in the flood of people entering the trains and missing your stop just because you don't want to be a little pushy. A fun option, if you are feeling a little punchy, would be to start exclaiming loudly how you feel like your going to projectile vomit everywhere. Maybe that'd clear a path for you? We don't know if that counts as "subway etiquette" however.
Now, why were they laughing? Who knows. Maybe they were shocked that people have manners and say "excuse me", when it seems that more often the norm on the subway is every man for themselves. We would just be happy and leave a trail of laughter behind you, while you catch that express train and get to your destination quicker.
We're sure other people have some thoughts?
Photo of R68 door by Triborough on flickr
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I think you read it wrong. Sounds to me like the offending party was not IN the train but was standing on the platform waiting to board and blocking those who were trying to exit the train.
The answer in either case, of course, is a shoulder shove.
All I gotta say is, get the F outta of my way! Cause whatever else is going on, I am the most important!
After the initial "excuse me" or two, definitely a shoulder or elbow shove accompanied by a loud-enough-for-others-to-hear "get the fuck out of the way" or "you fucking idiot." My hope is that the offending moron is embarrassed enough about getting this kind of business from a five foot nothing woman that he/she thinks twice the next time. I'm probably wrong, but whatever; still feels good to say it.
"What exactly was I supposed to have done in that situation?"
Tell him "GET THE FUCK OUT OF MY WAY ASSHOLE!"
That usually works.
It's simple. If you are bigger than the person in your way, then push them out of the way. If you are smaller, then say excuse me and then push them out of your way.
Seriuosly though, I think it's a different situation each time those doors open. Sometimes the person is blocking the doors because the platform is too crowded and they can't move out of the way. Sometimes, they just aren't paying attention. Sometimes they are just a-holes who feel entitled to get on the train before you get off or anyone else gets on.
An "accidental" spearing of the foot by my shoe always works for me. Whatever works - elbows, handbags...you need to assert your personal space. I once even spat my gum at a woman who refused to move out of my way. I don't recommend that unless you're armed or fast, but I was pissed and I did it and it stuck to her skirt, which was the best part. Plus, I think she got my point. ;-)
The answer is simple. Carry a gun. When the guy on the platform (why is it always a big guy?) won't stand aside to let you off, or insists of getting in before you get out, shoot him dead.
Most of the people who do this are from outside the city, so what's it matter?
(kidding, people, kidding)
This is a true pet peeve since I have to get on and off the train at Penn Station and I'm ususally fighting the flow. There should be a training course for people riding the subways.
Training course, get it?
There was a time when the public schools and settlement houses taught immigrant children and their parents how one would get on and off a bus or a train.
But politeness seems to have little place in the city today.
I HATE the people who stand in front of subway doors, either on the platform or inside of the train, and prevent people from getting in or out. HATE THEM. Anyone who does this should be banished from living here or in any city. I have adopted a method that makes me feel a little guilty, but it serves: if there's a crowd outside of the doors who look like they're going to push into the train without letting riders off first, I just stick both of my elbows out as far as they'll go and who ever accidentally gets their fat rude gut jabbed, that's their problem. Then I inevitably feel bad about it, because underneath the hate I'm a nice girl. Then I do it again on the next train, because people really need to get their cab ass out of the way. Bad urban manners make me very, very angry. What are these idiots thinking, anyway? Why shove into the train when people are very obviously trying to get out of it? What will you possibly gain, other than my elbow in your impossibly ugly belly?
Forget rude people in the subway, how about rude subway train conductors. I'm shocked to read in this story that the local actually was waiting for the express train riders. I mean, how many times does THAT happen?
Yes, exactly. I've lost count of the amount of times I've pulled into Jay Street on an A or a C train, try to switch to the F, only to have it pull away before anyone from the A or C train has a chance to get on it. What is the point of that?
You can stand behind me. I'll get you through. I'm taller than most of the people on the island of Manhattan, so if a polite 'excuse me' doesn't work they get my shoulders. Over the years I have decided that if someone wants to be a dick and just stand there, I will have no compunction about plowing straight through them. Hopefully the people behind me will benefit as well and the idiots on the platform will actually move the next time someone asks politely.
The preferred comeback to the a-hole's laughter is "Go back to Jersey."
I agree with everyone else - this is a wonderful opportunity for some bodily contact.
But here's my thing - I suspect that saying "excuse me" just doesn't cut it in NYC. It's not even particularly polite if it just means "get out of my way." Thus, select from "hey could you move it" (if the other party is clearly in the wrong) or "can I squeeze by you?" if you are imposing on them.
At the subway stop there is no time to talk, just shove.
My husband actually has a technique that works in most cases, even if he sounds like an idiot when he does it (and he's not afraid of sounding like an idiot). He simply states, very loudly and clearly, "EXCUSE ME, GETTING OFF" from wherever he happens to be standing on the train. People are so shocked to hear someone say that, that they usually move out of the way.
And I'm with everyone else on the people-trying-to-get-on-before-you-get-off issue: They get a sharp elbow or shoulder if they're still in my way after I say "excuse me". Morons.
I go for the passive-aggressive "excuse me" combined with the overt shove-past, elbow-optional. Hooking someone's purse/bag with your own purse-bag is also fun-making. This also applies to those who only partially block egress.
Yes, part of manners is to avoid things like shoving and bag-hooking, but also part of the way is getting out of it.
Best was the other day, uptown on an F train, some young guy, tuning out the city with his iPod.... was carrying a notebook with a sticker on it that read "Mean People Suck". He then proceeded to not only cut everyone waiting for the subway doors to open, but pushed the people back that were trying to get off. Awesome. Courtesy is contagious man. So is rudeness. I loved our city right after 9/11. At least we had about 4 months of helping our neighbors before we turned into shitheads again.
if you step on someone's feet, they'll move instinctively.
it's great being big. i push, people move.
I like that everyone is in agreement to this. I do much of the same: say "excuse me" or "let us off first" and push my way through.
Knee that fucker in the balls. It will be the last time he positions himself there.
My main stop is the B/D at Grand Street. If there's one group of people who really doesn't understand the concept of stepping aside to let others get off the train before they get on, it's the Chinese at that stop. I know, I know -- sounds really bad -- but it's absolutely true! The second the doors open, they shove their way onto the train as if the train's not going to be there for another 10 seconds after everyone gets off.
If I'm standing right at the doors, I have to bodycheck 5-6 Chinese people just to get out. I say loudly "Let us off first!" but obviously no one listens (or understands). It's simply unbelieveable. Now granted, I'm not getting off in order to catch another train -- but it still sucks to have to go through this every day.
Also, it's impossible to catch a train arriving in the station at that same stop because NO ONE will let you down the staircase to get to the train.
I still think the worst is when big-ass fuck heads block the doors when you are trying to get out. If the train is crowded, then it is even more offensive. I would like to say "get the fuck out of my way asshole" but these people are usually male, large, and menacing...or maybe if its a female she is very tough-looking. But whatever, realistically, shouting at a door-blocker is not an option for me. Call me a pussy, but I rage on the inside. I do like the fake throw-up idea...but does anyone have any other non-violent ways to get ugly fuck-heads to move?
#14: The whole excuse me thing is very iffy.
This morning, as I was exiting the 7 at Grand Central, I walked up the left side of the escalator right behind a massive man (I see a trend). He had his back pack and bumped a few of the non-walkers on the right side. Yet, it seemed that people were angry at me too. I got the ever popular "Why don't you say excuse me" line. Next time I will in fact say "Go back to Jersey!" or maybe even a simple "Why don't YOU say excuse me!?!"
was the dude black?
I totally hear you Gwin! The chinese immigrants are the WORST. Those old ladies can shove, and push, and scramble. They storm onto the train and start running in all directions - and fighting amongst themselves. My boyfriend used to mess with them at that stop. He would wait for the train and then start jumping around like a boxer, getting "pumped". Then he would rush onto the train and make a big show of rushing for a seat. It was HILARIOUS! But the ultimate worst is riders who choose to not give up their seat for the elderly and pregnant. That is my pet peeve.
Another situation I can't stand is trying to get down the stairs when a train has just arrived. In particular, trying to get down to the downtown 4/5 at Union Sq. when the flood of people are coming up the stairs. I usually would just stay to the right and keep walking. I would also often hold my forearm out in front of me with my fist acting as a sort of battering ram. Not that I would try to hit people but it was just enough for people to see and get out of the way. I think having the downward momentum helps too. People coming upstairs are a little more off balance and more apt to get out of the way. I also think that by just plowing through people do realize, "Oh wait, I'm in the way." and move, if they can.
It's the same as getting on or off a train. It's my right to get on or off the train or up or down the stairs so get the eff outta the way.
Another pet peeve: when I'm standing in the doorway and get out of the way to let people on or off and someone just plants themselves where I had just been standing. No good deed goes unpunished.
Jessie: that's pretty funny - but I guarantee no one understood that your boyfriend was mocking them :)
As far as the elderly and pregnant are concerned, I always give up my seat for them (or keep my eyes open for a free seat for them if I'm standing myself).
I hate it when people block the doors inside the train even when the train is empty. WTF? Grab a pole, dickwads! GET OUT OF THE DOORWAY.
I'm an average sized male and what I hate even more than a really large guy blocking me from exiting the train is when an old lady is doing it. I can at least push the large out of the way in a mano-a-mano sort of way and risk getting the snot beaten out of me. But when an old lady is not letting me off the train, I feel obliged to push the person next to her who if not directly in front of the train doors. The old lady should know better, but then again, she is an old lady.
I'm native as few are. 45 years old. I think things have gotten really bad in recent years with the door blocking rotine. Don't remember it being this way in my youth - the 70s - when the trains were rather colorful.
Grand Street B/D!!!!
i don't think the concept of wait in line, or wait your turn exists in chinatown. i've had those little old ladies try and push their way through me, I'm over 6 feet. i've finally figured it out that if you push back and just treat them like shit back, they back off. inconsiderate fucks.
Wait, why can't we shove the tourists? Isn't that part of their NYC experience?
this makes me want to go to the grand street station just so i can practice my favorite hobby, asian plowing.
but here's a subquestion!!!
[b]when there are people leaving the station, and you're going into the station...should you wait for everyone to leave and the turnstiles to clear up, or should the people exiting the station wait?[/b]
Nick: that's a good question. The problem is, the B and D trains tend to come in pairs, especially during the morning rush. If you were to wait for all the little Chinese grandmothers to clear the turnstiles (or at least a good number of them), chances are you'll not be able to get down in time for the next train.
what about for subway etiquette in general?
and i just figured out the bold function. oh yes.
Dude, what's with the "go back to Jersey" thing? If you say that then you can only be one thing: a transplant. If you get so upset by people from New Jersey, then go back to the rural, hick-filled Midwestern / New England dump you came from, because you obviously can't deal with New York City.
Nick: if there's still a chance the people entering the station will make the train, the people trying to exit should let them in. Otherwise, the exiters get priority. At least that's how it should work.
I don't see many chinese women on the train so I can't comment on their rudeness. I do think that French people are generally in their own worlds "ooh la la" this and that while they stand right in your way.
Nick: I guess it really depends on the stop/circumstances. Are the turnstiles right next to the tracks, or somewhere at a distance? Is the train right there in front of you, or is there no train in sight? Are there lots of turnstiles for people to use, or only a few?
I would therefore say that a combination of courtesy, common sense and timing would result in different answers to your question.
Ahh....my years of playing high school football has paided off when getting on or off subways. Spear 'em.
Nick:
If there is a mob of people coming up from the station, then you should just wait. You've missed the train already. If the grouping is more sparse, then slink on down. At larger stations like 34th and 42nd this rule obviously doesn't apply because the turnstiles are removed from the stairs to the platform.
This is not exactly related, but I encountered a bizarre situation a couple of months ago. I forget which train i was heading for, maybe the F train in Park Slope. It was later evening and I was the only one on the stairs. As I headed towards the turnstile I noticed an old asian woman behind me. She must have been waiting down there for someone. I went through the turnstile (the full body-cage kind, not the ones you can jump). And this asian lady snuck in behind me and we went through together. I have been issued a ticket for doing this once before, and I was pissed. How creepy! She didn't really speak any english, and I told her that it was illegal. Geez! Only in New York folks.
The solution is to be the second person off the train, not the first. Let the guy in front of you do the pushing, and follow him.
Definitely definitely definitely the Grand Street B/D! They little Chinese ladies are the absolute worst! Getting off the train is a huge pain in the ass, and then getting out of the station is an even bigger pain in the ass!
My pet peeve is people (almost always short people) who wrap their bodies around the poles on crowded trains. Everybody else has to fight for position to be able to hold on above them and stumble around just because one little woman wants to hold on for dear life/comfort.
z: how can I be the last off the train if I've already shoved everyone else out of the way?
I definitely do not understand why people wait on the platform in front of the opening doors and block the way. What happens when they try to get off a train the situation happens to them in reverse? I'm sure they don't like it either.
Interestingly, though - on a recent to Toronto, while waiting to get onto a train, I waiting to teh side of an opening door, and an exiting passenger actually rammed into my elbow, which was barely sticking out of the way, but not enough so that he had to. Very rude!
I ride the 4/5/6 trains, so I encounter this kind of behavior all the time during the evening rush hour when Yankee fans are on the way to a game and I'm just trying to get home. At 86th St. I have to fight the people already on the train, who are oblivious to people like me who aren't going to the game, and I have to push past the Yankee fans on the platform and coming down the stairs. Maybe I should just keep a Yankees schedule on my desk at work and stay late enough to avoid this whole mess. When these clowns are in front of me, I love that I have the freedome to go from mild-mannered Manhattan resident to stereotypical rude New Yorker and shove my way through the crowd, sometimes with an "excuse me!" to make me look just a little courteous.
Regarding the original poster/question-asker, why do these "blockers" laugh when you try to get past them? Are they having fun seeing you try to get by, knowing they are agitating you? How completely dickless. Aren't people too busy to bother picking on others all day long as they go about their business? It's terribly stressful to try make your way around anyway, why add to it? Power trip?
Solution: Get a new job that has your start and end time during off-peak hours, ideally overnight hours. Then you'll never face the crowds and never have a problem. Well, the only problem you'll have is finding a car on the train not occupied by a homeless man who has deficated in his pants a few dozen times.
One thing folks can do be a positive example when you are waiting to load a train. People are surprisingly polite when they see others doing it. Don't give in quickly to your worst impulses, it only encourages others to do the same.
i have never been pushed so many times as i have by the asian ladies in chinatown. i don't know if it is a cultural thing or what but it is truly shocking. how hard is it to realize you are in america now, and what worked in the motherland DOES NOT WORK HERE!
Glenn: you are totally right, and under normal circumstances I'd agree with you 100%.
Unfortunately, polite behavior goes unnoticed and unimitated in a part of town where blowing snot-rockets and hocking up loogies and spitting them out in public (including in the stairwells of my apartment building) qualifies as acceptable behavior.
I think that's how the trains are in China, that's why they act like that. In China if you don't tackle people to get into a train you won't get on. PERIOD. Cause they got like a billion people trying to get into a train car. I see a lot of black people beating people up in trains.
I was once asked by an acupuncturist, orginally from somewhere near Shanghai, what causes me stress in a minor way. I said that trying to get through unmoving crowds of people really pissed me off. He expressed surprise at that, saying that in China, no one would be bothered by crowds or by people shoving and getting in eachothers' way, because it's just so crowded there. So I just assume that in Chinatown, people will shove me on the train. But outside of there, forget it.
And as for shoving tourists, I say go right ahead. It might make their day by confirming their stereotypes about New York.
I'm a native, too, though a bit younger. It definitely seems worse these days. Almost as bad as Boston, where people are more rude in general than anyplace else I have ever been in my life.
When you see the express, just GO FOR IT. Everyone knows that when two trains are parallel to watch the fuck out, because there's always a stampede. While he was definitely rude, I just have to say he was laughing because you bothered to even say "excuse me" in the first place in that parallel train situation, which --I repeat-- everyone knows is a rush-to-the-death. From the looks of your whiny complaint, "excuse me" was likely said with a snooty, shrill, upper-class-entitled honk along with a heavy dose of perky valley-girl. You were just standing there flailing your cappuccino, spilling it, saying "Excuse me, excuse me, excuse me, excuse me," instead of just getting the fuck off the train from the start. That was why he was laughing. Sorry, but that's the truth. Hell, I'm laughing now. How do you even make it to express trains before they pull away if you stand there like a primadonna demanding "Excuse me, excuse me"? I'm surprised you even show up to work on time at all!
Why do you care why he was laughing? Just knock his ass out of the way. I push everyone to the side, men, women, children, old people. I knock them all down! They deserve it.
Leela: that's interesting to know, but there's something to be said about adapting to the customs of the country in which one chooses to live.
REALITY CHECK: wow, make random assumptions much? How do you even know the original poster was female?
REALITY CHECK - if this person was at risk of losing their cappucino, I bet they'd step it up. You don't mess with one's cappucino. EVER.
it's just a askgoth post, relax.
Gwin: Yeah, I'm of two minds about that one myself. I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt, but at the same time, in this country, it reads as complete lack of consideration. Then again, even at 5'4, I tower over some of the offending parties, and they look frail even if they aren't, so I never want to push or elbow-jab them.
PATTIECAKE:
let's try not to be so racist, shall we? what year do you think this is, really? what you are doing by mentioning (out of context) that you've seen "black people beating people up in trains" is not helpful nor appropriate, especially in this kind of forum. what do you want, others to agree with you and also share their stories similar to yours?
if you're totally joking, i'm sorry that i've misread your two references to "black people" on this thread. if you're not joking, then please think more about how racism is perpetuated and kept alive by comments like yours.
I recall being in front of the train doors when it pulled into the station. It wasn't my intention to be there, but there I was - 2 people in from the platform edge. The doors opened pretty fast, and while it wasn't completely crowded people were standing next to each other. I lost my balance for a moment, and in that moment this asshole (must like the protagonist in everyone's postings) burns through. The other two people get out of his way. There was fire in his eyes. His fury was righteous. His motive was retribution. His cause was just. He barreled into me, almost knocking me to the ground. I could have been repeatedly stepped on, as it was a trans-platform stampede opportunity and there were enough people. Someone helped me up.
I yelled at this asshole, calling him what he was. He turned around. Educated, clipped accents, powered by adrenaline, he started cursing at me and all the people who have presumably wronged him in the past.
He wanted to know if I wanted to fight. I laughed in his face. I just laughed.
His cultural training finally reasserted itself, and he (barely) caught his express.
Think about that, next time someone laughs in your face as you get out of a train.
I agree with most of these comments, but something that has perplexed me from the beginning is the chicken wings. I must get on at a stop near a chicken establishment because I have smelled them, I have seen people eat them, and I have seen the discarded aftermath.
I'm seriously considering making stickers with plain illustrations and explanations of proper subway riding etiquette. It's getting ridiculous. Spread legs, bags on the seats, back to the pole, standing in the doors without moving, standing on the platform without moving aside...what happened to manners and common sense? Look for my sticker series on an L or J train near you soon.
Gee, REALITY CHECK, you must be a special breed of douche to insult someone so vehemently just for being polite. We are all "entitled" to be treated like human beings. Lose the anger and have a chai tea, or do tai chi.
I am short. I hold onto the pole because I can't reach the overhead bars. Literally. I would have to stand right underneath them to be able to reach them: i.e., stand right on a sitting person's feet. So chill, tall people. Reach over our heads with your stinky armpits like you always do.
Also, I'm of asian descent (4th generation Japanese-American). While I used to take the B/D train to Park Slope (past the Grand Street stop), I did not find the "asian grandmas" or the "Chinese ladies" to be that huge of a problem. They are 4 feet tall and tip the scales at about 90 lbs. Just step around them.
Writing things like "how hard is it to realize you are in america now, and what worked in the motherland DOES NOT WORK HERE!", as one commenter did, displays his/her ingnorance and small-mindedness. If you perpetuate these negative stereotypes and have that kind of anti-immigrant mentality, you should go back to your motherland -- I'm guessing an all-white town on Long Island full of dumb rich people. Oops, there I go again assuming all dumb people are white. Oh, snap.
I was taught to be polite. But New Yorkers are rude and I've been forced to change my ways. Slim women like myself get mowed down all the time. Hardly anyone says excuse me and everyone pushes and shoves. Men spread their legs wide when they sit squishing me in my seat while helping themselves to some of mine. Women-- especially overweight ones-- will take you down to get a seat before you do because God forbid they have to stand for 2 stops...
Killing them with kindness does not work. I really only have two choices: reciprocate with rudeness or move out of NY. So I've become rude too.
I imagine this is why there are so many rude people living here.
And to "Ditto on the Ladies" comment about Asian women:
They are NOTORIOUSLY rude and extremely pushy in the subways, not just by Chinatown. I would like to know why that is; is it cultural?
what about all the fat people that block the stairs or have to push their way through the crowd ont he subway car to get off - even when it's not that crowded. that drives me crazy. i think they designed the subway stairs back when not so many people were obese.
There is nothing that will change the Chinese immigrant way so quit wasting your time about it. thankfully their offspring will not continue that rudeness. I think they're alot of people out there who amplify their inner anger onto the subway.
My only pet peeve is the fucking class trips on the subway. 25 screaming kids in the morning is not fun, not to mention the subway is dangerous for a group of kids that large, why not get a van or a bus?
And for the record you don't say excuse me, you move with purpose.
Syntax99:
All your years of playing high school football has definitely "paided off". You're a meathead who never passed his grammar class on irregular verbs. Why don't you learn proper English grammar before threatening bodily harm?
Thanks for tell me about Grand street.
I can't wait to try out my Godson OTF, I'll do my shanking then blend in with the crowd.
If you don't like Grand Street, don't live on Ludlow.
don't forget those famous last words,
"what are you going to do, shoot us?"
I've lived and traveled in many cities throughout the world. New York has one of the filthiest/decrepit subways with many rude and clueless riders. So what does that say about our culture? Beijing subways have a crowded chaos where people are comfortable with lots of pushing and very close bodily contact. Hong Kong and Tokyo have hands-down the nicest newest most relaxing to ride efficient subway systems. In Tokyo, there is even tinkling ambient music that announces the arrival of a train. London's tubes have clean, new uphostered seats and super-orderly polite behavior of riders. Trains are always on time and have a digital display system that monitors this for riders to see. In Paris, the trains are no-frills, but always on time, clean, and not over-crowded. I could go on, but I'd like to say that the NYC subway sucks compared to most others in major cities throughout the world. And don't get me started on the generally low IQ of the MTA workers...
I do prefer to stand by the door, it's roomier. But the thing to do when the train is entering a station where the platform is on your side is to cross the aisle and stand in the door on the other side.
In a crowded situation that's not always possible. So you simply straighten up and let people squeeze in as best you can.
I never like to give up my place by the door simply because if you do, someone entering the car will take _your_ place.
I fully realize the MTA discourages this. Sometimes the handrest falls far short of the door and you have to lean in to grab it. Also, on the newer LIRR cars, there's an ear-piercing whistle whenever the doors open; that's the MTA's not-so-subtle way of reminding you that you're not supposed to be there.
Still, I prefer to stand in the door. Let people by, give them way, and there's usually no probs.
www.forgotten-ny.com
ma: sorry, but I'm going to have to call bullshit on your post. Just because you belong to the Asian community doesn't mean you can validate the behavior of everyone belonging to that racial identity. There are plenty of folks in here that have personally witnessed the subway rudeness of the Chinese folks in Chinatown - sorry, but that's just the way it is. It's not racism - it's a cultural difference that happens to be extremely annoying to those who don't adhere to it. I'm half French (not any of this 4th generation stuff either) and I don't defend all French people for their various cultural weaknesses (as long as they actually exist, which sometimes they certainly do).
And next stop: love the way you assume that those getting off at Grand Street live on Ludlow. Have you ever been to the neighborhood surrounding that stop? If you had, you'd know there's a lot more to it than your traditional Lower East Side misconceptions.
One of the things that I can do without thinking is stand right by the door on the platform when the train comes into the station (for some reason this only works in NYC), but I make it a point before the doors open to step out of the way of the straphangers departing the train.
Sometimes your are forced to stand in the door way of the train because it is too crowded. and you should try to move into the train when people get off.
When you have a bike and need to stand in the door area, it helps to stand on the side that will not platform, alternating sides if need be. However sometimes this cannot be done due to the amount of people in the car.
Excuse me should only be used with irony or sarcastically on the subway.
>>>Excuse me should only be used with irony or sarcastically on the subway.
In NYC,
"excuse me" = "out of the way, a$$hole."
"can I help you" = "get out of here, a$$hole."
"sir" = "a$$hole."
www.forgotten-ny.com
I can't believe how racist many of the commenters on this blog are. And why is the one person who mentions "black people" only called out for it?
There's no mention of racism when commenters generalize all of the "Chinese women" - f'ing ironic considering this is right after the post about the hate crime against 3 Asian men in Queens.
I live in New Jersey - born here & will stay here so that I don't have to deal with rude ass New Yorkers who complain, complain, complain all the time about everything.
You all block the subway doors, you all push each other, you are the rude ones & you deserve each other.
NYC sucks!
Ma:
I don't care if you have to hold on to the pole. The problem is with the women (and yes its almost always a woman) who wrap their entire body around the pole. They can't hold on with a hand because they have coffee in one and a book they just can't put down in the other. That pole is then useless until she gets off the train because if anyone else put their hand on it, they'd be sexually assaulting her (literally, there's no place left for your hand).
God, folks, generalizing much? I can't believe people are actually willing to ask whether the villain in the original post was black, or say all Chinese ladies are rude. Really, anyone who believes something like that deserves cancer or worse.
Hey Wow: last I checked, no one is using any racial slurs or beating up Chinese people -- so, way to bring one horrible incident into a completely unrelated conversation.
As a longtime resident of Chinatown, I certainly can't help but notice things (both good and bad) about the Chinese who live in this neighborhood - things that hold true ONLY of them. I make absolutely NO apologies for that and despite what you may think, there is a huge difference between pointing out certain cultural actions of a particular group of people (especially when those actions are totally rude) and actually attacking them verbally via slurs and/or physically in real life because of those differences -- something NO ONE here is doing.
I find a baseball bat clears the way very nicely.
oh pardon, gwin
sorry, Ludlow street is not hip anymore.
how bout stanton or Allen, wait they have the F train.
I know your type well, and we don't want you in NYC.
thank you very much.
Hey third base: I'm a Brooklyn native, so bite me, m'kay?
Hey my friend is chinese and she's not rude. What the fuck you trying to say Gwin. ARE YOU SAYING ALL CHINESE PEOPLE ARE RUDE? cause it's not true and you are generalizing and full of shit.
I like to shoot people who won't get off the train. That gets 'em everytime. Then you can just step ove them! hahahahahahahahaha! (vote for me!)
When did this all turn into a Race war?
I for one despise anyone who stands in my way as the doors open. Yesterday some pregnant woman was standing right in the path for people about to step out. Just because you got knocked up doesn’t mean you have the god given right to walk about and ignore the rules. I did not hesitate to push her out of the way, and said in a slight tone of voice “Out of my way Preggers”.
I'm with bernie on this. Only I like to roam around NYC and night and watch the vermin come out targetting helpless commuters.
Then, I hit them with my sockful of Quarters.
I'm reading these comments and totally relating to all of this. It's like, OMG. These people who use the trains, y'know? You all know what the absloute worst is about riding these trains?! Having to share them with people like you. Nevermind "Go back to Jersey." Maybe you should try your mothers womb.
SHOULDER or ELBOW CHECK. works everytime.
Why you crazy people in such a rush to push yourselves off the train? Can't you let people on first? I wait for the train for too long and if I miss it I'll be late for whatever. It's messed up people like you all that always got to demand that everyone get out of your way. Why don't you be courteous and let the people on first like they do it everywhere else in the civilized world.
a simple shank to the ribs with my GodFather works well. then blend in with the other commuters while the guy wonders why he's bleeding.
for the ghetto crowd, a box cutter/utility knife but won't get in as deep as my GodFather.
Don't like the riff raff on the subway, Take a cab.
Real nyc'ers have been taking the subway for decades and no one bitched.
Lukie, it's definitely more important to let someone off first...If the doors were to close too early to let everyone off, the people who are stuck on the train are MUCH more screwed than the people who might have missed it.
I ride the 1 from 191st to midtown every day, and every day I observe those assholes who decide to stand in the doorway even when the subway is empty. If the subway is empty; why are you standing in the doorway????? There's always plenty of room in the middle. Ideally, when the two doors open, people should be able to exit and enter at the same time, but noooooo, assholes have to stand in the way and make it a one way street. It's ridiculous. I agree w/ everyone else, if they're standing there blocking the door, I just plow right through; especially when they don't even turn in to let people by. I mean, how oblivious are you? The train stops, the doors open, people get off, more people get on, if you're in the doorway, you're in the way. Period.
other peeves:
1. people who sneak up from behind or the side as you wait patiently for the train (well out of the way to let others off first) and they just rush in front of you cuz the rules of polite society don't apply to them apparently.
2. the person who stands in the door next to you when you're sitting down on the next seat. sometimes their butt or arm or bag is sticking through the gap between the side of the car and the pole, dangerously close to your face.
Regarding the people standing in an empty car.
Note, they may be undercover cops. they need to have a better view of their surroundings.
So, don't be so quick to judge. Of course, if they were black it's another story. Usually I see white cops standing.
but you never know, undercovers come in all colors nowadays. There's much more diversity now than before.
I remember seeing off duty's flash their badge to get on the bus free, they also stand. I've noticed his off duty piece in a fanny pack.
Ohh baby, this looks like one for the subwayblogger. Have you seen it yet? It is a new blog all about the subway. www.subwayblogger.com. The guy writes it from the subway on his blackberry.
arm yourself with a boiling hot cup of coffee..
wow last time I checked Jersey was full of a-holes..I can't drive one block without some pinhead getting in my way..most Jersey families are FROM new york anyway..
This country has one of the worst, pretentious cultures that few are aware of.
The Chinese seem the easiest and cheapest target for any racial slurs. Check out movies, TV shows, see whether you can find any Asian heroes besides some Kung Fu movies. Anti-China is just a cover for racial discrimination.
Bitchees and A-holes, you'll feel the repercussions very soon. You'll be fuuuuucked up dearly - this is for you, Jessie.
Gwin, the above post is for you, too, A-hole. Why go to Chinatown? Go to Harlem if you dare, or go live in Trump Tower if you can afford. Otherwise, shut your Ahole up, loser!
Gwin: "There are plenty of folks in here that have personally witnessed the subway rudeness of the Chinese folks in Chinatown - sorry, but that's just the way it is."
Here is a shocker. It is not just Chinese people. People of all ethnicities do it! Singling them out and perpetuating myths, ignorant ideas is very much racist.
It is interesting that in your same post you wrote, "If you had, you'd know there's a lot more to it than your traditional Lower East Side misconceptions."
Try applying that to other things, say perhaps your disgusting generalizations and stereotypes about Asian people, and you might be suprised.
Ok. Stereotypes are based on some facts usually. The Chinese thing is not racist at all. It's called an observation. The black people thing is a bit tainted. That dude complaining of pretention is welcome to leave anytime. New Yorkers are some of the friendliest, sincerest nuts in the world.
We have a consensus.
Gwin is racist, end of debate.
Too bad he's stuck in Chinatown because he can't afford to move elsewhere. The ultimate in loserdom.
What a maroon.
AHHHHH, the answer to all our problems.
The "you're welcome to leave anytime" arguement.
When will whitey leave?
Lukie: It makes no sense to let people on the train first. Then the passengers getting out have to navigate around them and the train's held up. Common sense, yo. I'm going to work too; you're no more important than I am. You let people off first. That's the way it is on mass transit everywhere.
Some people have valid reasons for standing in the doorways. I am a small person, and I prefer to stand there for safety's sake. I can't reach the poles above the seats. My head is right at most people's elbow level, and getting clocked in the eyes or mouth by someone sharing a center pole with me isn't fun. Also, if you're in the middle you're constantly shoved aside by those creepy kids selling candy "to stay out of trouble' and people walking through the car. Not complainin', it's part of city life, but you can't blame anyone for trying to protect themselves.
If I'm in a doorway I try to choose the side that won't be opening as often. And I make sure I am well out of the way when the doors do open so I'm not blocking anyone's egress or entrance.
ma:
"If you perpetuate these negative stereotypes and have that kind of anti-immigrant mentality, you should go back to your motherland"
Can you explain to me how it is racist to expect people to assimilate to the culture once they move there? If I moved to a Muslim country, I would surely adopt the practice of wearing a head scarf because that is the tradtion there. If I am not willing to accept the culture of some place, then I should not move there. I should not expect everyone to assimilate to me.
What I don't get is how if you expect people who move to America to assimilate - you are suddenly a racist?
Not only that, but I bet if anyone swapped the word "Asian" with "French" - no one would be playing the race card. For example if someone said: "Those French ladies always push me out of the way..." I can say for sure no one would say anything about that being racist.
And guess what: my parents are first generation immigrants. So it's not like I don't know about the life of an immigrant.
If I can jump back to the beginning of this thread when it was more about subway strategies and less about culture war...
When someone on the platform doesn't get out of my way as I try to leave the train, I also go with one comment before bumping. But my comment is,
"What, are you fucking NEW at this? Step aside and let us off."
Too few people are capable of enough shame for that to register the way I'd like, but it helps me vent, and usually wins me a supportive chuckle or two.
What,
Duh, French is not a race.
"Stereotypes are based on some facts usually...it's not racist at all. It's called an observation."
-- NYTranspalnt
no. wrong. sorry. even if a race of people behave a certain way, ignoring the fact that OTHER races ALSO do it would be racists. if you said, for example, that black people don't speak proper english, that my friend, is RACIST. why? because plenty of non- black people say "y'all", "git 'er done", " gitcha some _____","youse guys" or "like" (in between every other word). you are ignoring the fact that black people aren't the only ones that don't speak with an adherence to proper english.
anyways, my point is that everyone has crap subway ettiquette and everyone sucks, so shut up.
Stop whining. Youbitches. I live in Sunset Park and take the 8th Ave. N into work everyday and it's true - Chinese people have some mad fucked up train ettique. You think the old ladies' shoving is bad? Try the constant, nonstop spitting! And the fresh-off-the-boat motherfuckers who squat down in a circle and eat their damn breakfasts on the damn train platform while the rest of us are trying to get by. Drink your fucking milk tea and eat your fucking pork buns at a table like human beings. The N train isn't a goddamn rice paddy in Fujian! Don't whine to the rest of us if you Chongs can't behave like civilized people now that you're here in New York!
What I'd like to know is why, when i do tell people to get out of the way, people behind me aren't backing me up? It seems like half the city is on this thread and agrees that the other half of the city is in their way. then back up the first person off the train who has to plow through the people on the platform. Even an enthusiastic 'yeah' will do it.
And as far as the 'pole dancers' are concerned, as someonne who is 5'1, and relies on those poles, shoving your hand into the small of someone's back gets the message out there pretty quick. No one has ever told me to 'watch it' when i've grabbed a pole they were hogging.
I don't understand why saying "excuse me" must be met with derision. Just because we live in new york doesn't mean we have to forgo good manners for the rest of our lives. I'll continue to say it, as well as "bless you" to sneezing passengers, "thank you" when it's appropriate, etc. If this forever labels me as a "transplant" I can't say I give a damn.
Is Youbitches a terrorist? Are you threatening me, Youbitches? Cuz I'll sic the Mexican Mafia on your ass, cabron.
Anyway, I just have to chime in that these Chinese haters might be on to something because the Chinese old ladies also always block the bike path between the Manhattan and Brooklyn Bridges in the morning while they do Tai Chi. Even when I come barreling down the bike path on my bike, they act like I'm not even there and they happily pose away as I have to ride around them risking death and potholes. I'm just saying.
The guy laughed because he expected you to stab him. That's how his kind behave. Luckily, most of us are better than that.
If we keep our standards up, one day these shit-eaters will follow. Until then, just don't let it get you down.
Now that we're talking about different types of people on the subway, I have a question: What's the deal with all the white people with all their friggin fancy shopping bags, waving them in the air, spinning around like they don't have a care in the world? Those pointy ends are like knives. Get those damn things out of my face and quit acting like you're on the set for Mary Poppins!
Re: Post 71 by anon.
ahh...i love grammar tips from people like you:
Re:
All your years of playing high school football has definitely "paided off".
Ummm...the quotation mark goes outside of the period, not inside. Way to go jack-ass. You don't even know "proper English grammar."
First and excuse me then push through.
What about the guys (always guys) that have to grab the pole with their butt cheeks? Ever seen that? You walk in, go to get the pole and some guy is shoving that thing up his ass because he does not want to touch it with his hands?? Thanks assholes.
Best Chinese story, old woman clipping her toenails in the train. Ewwwwww.
Me lesent lemalks made by you white peoples. we vely vely polite cultule at least we don't poop on platform yes?
Me push and shove you loooooong time.
Another subway peeve: people who fall asleep on your shoulder and then jerk themselves back into an upright position -- repeatedly. A man did this to me last night until I took the cap off the pen I was using and pointed it toward him so that every time he slumped over, he slumped into the cap, not my shoulder. He got the message. There are time that I wish I could be more of a jerk so that I could use the pen point itself and let someone get ink all over their shirts.
Also, I don't think it's racist to point out that Chinese people are rude, but it's only your limited experience to not realize that there are rude people in every single group that lives in this city, which is why I hate everyone. I saw a woman clipping her daughter's nails on the subway last week. She may have been Asian, Hispanic, or Philipino, but whatever race she was, it was DISGUSTING.
我恨您!!!!!!!
Try getting the underground in Shanghai everyday (like I do): shoving, spitting, toenail clipping, huge parcels in the aisle, people blocking the doors/platforms, people screaming on mobile phones.
It's a Chinese thing. No manners.
Look, I'm not trying to encourage a fight here but sometimes you have to act like a jerk in order to get your point across. I employ a variety of methods . Depending on the severity of the occurrence I [1] Say excuse me before the train comes to a stop, (Of course this works only if your smart enough to position urself at the doors prior to your stop).[2] You can firmly state excuse me and then shove your way through after the doors open . [3] If the person is being a real ass clown about it you say excuse me and as you push your way through leave the guy with a nasty reminder that "You don't play" (IE. Kick in the ankle,elbow to the ribs under the arm, Push comes to shove knee the bitch in the nuts! As long as you get to the connecting train it's all fair !)
Ching Chong Charlie! You's a nut dude! Hahahahahahahahahahaha . It's true they do have some of the worst habits . I'm no hater but "Some of" the Asian people are stuck in there ways. They think there home and shit Picking their noses and either flicking or worest off wiping the boogers off on the pole. I see that shit everytime I take the [7] train out to Flushing! The foot picking thing is also true thankfully I take the "G" train home so that's not a real problem for me .
My very favorite thing is people who start down the stairs to the platform while talking on their phones, then they realize they're going to lose service, so they stop and stand in the middle of the staircase.
I just told a guy in my office what I was reading and he told me that he stands in the door when he rides the train--'so that he doesn't have to touch anything.' I told him that he runs the risk of being elbowed in the gut by me.
I ride the 4/5/6 to and from work everyday during rush hour. To get there I have to pass through Chinatown on the N. So I experience the crazy Chinese old ladies and the insanity that is Union Square in the morning. That 4/5/6 platform is scary as all get out during rush hour. Forget excuse me, I just push and hope. It's crazy down there. Number one rule: Don't take anything personally.