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Joseph Holmes captured this great picture of a 5 train recently that makes Gothamist think of the 80's. Broken windows be dammed, when was the last time anyone saw a burner like this on a subway? Joe's got two additional shots up on Flickr as well.
In his comment section, Joe adds a note from Matt Weber:
"A friend of mine who's a graffiti expert passed along this info:
In case you didn't know that was a VIM(OA) car. The Vandals In Motion and Monsters Of Art crews are brother/sister crews from the Copenhagen, Sweden, Holland area and I guess one of them was visiting NYC on vacation."
Additionally, if you like street art, this Sunday, May 8, Jake and Mike Epstein will lead a bike tour of New York street art, as part of the NYC bike month festivities. Meet at 11 a.m. on the north side of Union Square Park with bike or blades- the tour will be about three hours, and hit major graffiti sites in Manhattan, Brooklyn, and Queens.
Photo by Joseph Holmes
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Dope!
Impressive. I wouldnt mind a few subway cars in the system spraypainted like that. Its when many different artists put their own tags up at once. It turns ugly.
Totally beautiful!!
Graffiti is really popular over there. When I used the public transportation in Frankfurt & Hamburg a few months ago, I thought I travelled back in time to 1980s New York. I'm sure the clean trains in what was once the graffiti capital of the world pissed them off.
That's pretty sweet.
I was under the impression that paint doesn't stay on aluminum/stainless, which was one of the reasons MTA switched to the shiny stuff. Guess I was wrong.
Amazingly, the paint didn't touch the American flag or the NYC2012 stickers.
This is the work of selfish ego maniacs. No matter how stylish or beautiful, this is still vandalism.
Vandalism is OK as long as it looks appealing and improves on the finished product.
Whats NYC without graffiti anyway?
is that ride considered a procession?
I know this is going to start the "eternal argument" for the Gothamist comment boards, but I'll go for it anyway.
Basically, I just feel like saying that crime is an essential part of NYC's identity is ridiculous.
New York is about so much more--a diverse cultural mix that can't be found any where else in the world, architecture that shows a multitude of influences and periods, some of the greatest colleges and cultural institutions in the world, home of one of the most beautiful exercises in landscape architecture: Central Park, the home of Broadway...the list goes on and on.
Of course, the criminality of graffiti will always be disputed, but I would argue that NYC would still be distinct and even great, even without the vandalism.
Whatever which side of the art vs vandalism debate you fall in, it's simulaneously sad and beautiful that it took an outsider to do a great throw up like that.
I like it, but I would like it more if my money didnt have to be used to clean it up.
Also, I find the fact that most self styled "graffitti artists" still cannot develop beyond logos/tags/names as telling of their creativity- howsabout trying something new?
Sweetness. I remember as a kid, I thought graff was SUPPOSED to be on the subway. Nowadays it has been capitalized upon and exists mainly on clothing and such. Oh sweet nostalgia.
Ick:
exactly.
Whenever I'm in that silly argument with my artist-type friends, I'll always counter with "so, you wouldn't mind if I came over you house and tagged it? Maybe, make a nice mural on your car?"
[Napoleon] Idiot!! [\Napoleon]
That train will be cleaned in a day or so. It happens all the time. Crews from overseas come to NYC, paint a car, snap shots, it gets 'scrubbed' and it's all clean.
It's not the aluminum/stainless that makes the difference. It's the coating on top of that. Something to do with the porous nature of the old untreated metal versus the new metal. But cleaning that off is a lot easier on the new cars than it was on the older more cars.
People who complain about it are dumb. Look at how what they did in this case barely touches the window or anything else. I'd much rather see that every day than tons of overflowing garbage cans on every corner.
That's New York. People complain about graffiti like it's poison, yet garbage and junk overflows into the streets and most people don't get half as mad at that.
Maybe I'd be of a different mindset if I hadn't just read The Tipping Point which highlighted how the crackdown on minor/small/nonviolent crimes (like grafitti/vandalism) in the subways eventually led to the subways being much safer.
If people need their graffiti fix during their commute, maybe there should be an effort to work with the MTA to get a novelty train in there...or allowing graffiti artists to do an original work. But I think permission is key for me to be cool with this.
VIM(OA) should get their vandalism jollies out at home...and leave NY to the local artists.
It's also about ownership.
Graffiti takes a piece of communal property and makes it exclusive, which is IMHO selfish. It's much like how that idiot on the N train keeps yapping on his cellphone. It was once everybody's, and now it's not (and yet, our tax dollars and fares still are paying for it). The fact this was the work of out-of-towners makes that just all the more frustrating. And while I do enjoy the nostalga rush of seeing the train (my camera was buried in my bag, sadly), I don't think I would enjoy the other parts of said times that taggedTrain represent: poor service, dirty stations, rampant crime, etc.
That being said, paint does wash off. The scratchitti is much more annoying to me.
aw, you know what's so weird -- i'm an artsy fartsy type gal so ordinarily i would appreciate this --
but c'mon, this is one of those shiny new trains!! throw nyc a bone, graffers -- there are like one billion other soiled surfaces up in this joint!!
I'd rather see that than all the fucking advertising all over everything. how is that any better? if it costs so much to clean it off, then heres an idea: dont bother cleaning it at all!
i miss the days when i was a little kid, and the trains were covered in tags and pieces. the trains are visually so sterile, when not plastered in marketing horseshit.
and yes, if you want to come over and paint my living room, you are welcome to.
"Maybe I'd be of a different mindset if I hadn't just read The Tipping Point..."
Malcolm Gladwell really barely knows what he's talking about but spins it all in a nice way that makes you think that he knows more than he claims.
The claim he makes that the elimination of graffiti made the subway safer is laughable at best. Graffiti was the end result of a city falling apart. By the time trains were tagged away, the city was neck deep in crime and junk.
As someone who lived and grew up in this city I can tell you that crime in the subway went down when cops were put back in the system AND the transit police and the regular NYPD was merged. Oh, and in the middle of that new train cars were made/ordered that were--and still are--graffiti proof.
I'd do some research before regugitating Gladwell's mantras. Recent/well-documented history proves much of his work to be more effete theory rather than anything else.
Hey Jack,
I think you guys might be on the same page -- Gladwells's point...actually James Q. Wilson and George Kelling's point in their Broken Windows article, is that increased policing and cracking down on minor offenses such as graffiti will lead to a reduction in overall crime -- or to put it back in Gladwell's terms, cracking down on the minor offenses will lead to a Tipping Point which can quell the wave of crime...the crack-down on graffiti was just one part of an overall policing strategy put into place in the early 90s...
come ON, gothamist. please don't use lingo you don't understand - it just makes you sound like an idiot. a throw-up is a quick tag, one usually done in a single, long spray. this is a panel piece.
if you'd like to learn to talk about graffiti without embarrasing yourself, check out all the great resources on the web, like http://www.at149st.com/index.html - or read the incomparable Subway Art by Henry Chalfant and Martha Cooper, which is comprised of mind-blowing photographs of early-80s trains in blazing glory.
Gladwell's view would be wonderful if it weren't countered by the dozens of examples of that not working.
The largest tipping point of 'The Tipping Point' was the fact that Gladwell was able to create pseudo-arguments towards this/that/other and people who really don't question his sourcing (which is mostly none at all) and subsequently create a cult around him and his concepts.
And regarding crime in general, the fact is that while crime levels overall are down, the majority of such crimes have been pushed away from the 'tourist center' and out to the fringes in the out boroughs.
Gladwell never focuses on the idea that some crimes are underreported and some crimes are not as 'news worthy' as they once were, thus the aura of things being magically better; thanks to Gladwell's ovservations.
Wonder what he would say about the rash of iPod thefts or the over-reporting of such thefts?
i'm still amazed at when graf became so accepted by those who aren't involved in the culture, those who don't even use the right terminology to describe graf. i think ick is the only one who is intellectually honest when he says that graf, no matter how stylistic, is still vandalism. for those who think this window-down piece is "dope", to what degree would you accept graf? do you think the writer who did this should be punished? what should be the punishment? graf gets this kind of press and celebrity and then you (those of you who think graf is cool but then turn around and say writers are worse than dirt) blame an impressible 13-14 year old kid who tries to get his fame. i reference this other gothamist link as an example: http://www.gothamist.com/archives/2005/04/16/metro_area_graffiti_arrest.php
some of you may be thinking, "oh, ken, there's a difference," to which i respond, yes, there may be, but that difference is probably only a difference in degree, not in kind. if you, an intelligent adult, had difficulty rationalizing the difference, think how a 13-14 year old kid would feel.
to the writer who caught VS and the mta sleeping, kudos. i'm amazed that it ran.
I always thought a throwup was a quick gag, one usually done in a single, long spray. [groan]
Cool postings.
It is interesting to think about the kind of crime the city tolerates as "part of the scene" and the kind that it doesn't. Graf for decades was put up with and celebrated until it wasn't. Other crimes/criminals are in the same boat. Look at the mob. (No, I'm not comparing graffiti artists to mafiosi, stand away from the keyboard.) People hate it when someone gets killed on their block, but they loved someone like John Gotti. People (myself included) hate dragging their asses into work on a Monday morning in a scrawled-up subway car, but yet we get a kick out of seeing a car like this in all its "blazing glory."
Crime is crime, of course, but its interesting to see which crimes people are willing to put up with and even celebrate. There will always be a few.
Bring back the 70s and crime and graf. Maybe then we'd drive the hoardes back out of the city and I could afford my rent.
Huzzah!
What we really need is a rising of zombies to eat half the city's population, and scare away all the fat-assed out-of-towners. Then we would kill the zombies and the city will be nice and empty.
all i can say is "holy crap".
MTA, we have a problem. This was apparently two trainsets that were tagged in one night.
www.forgotten-ny.com
VIM? That's where I get my BVDs (reppin Manhattan as best that I can).
i don't think a brilliant dose of color in my commute can be a bad thing, now can it?
I'd bet that some of the same people who regularly berate the MTA for raising fares are now praising the graffiti as cool and a real throwback to better NYC days. We can argue all day about the artistic merit of graffiti, but somewhere right now an MTA employee is washing this car and getting paid largely with money that comes from our fares and [admittedly poorly-managed] government funding.
So which is it? Do we want cool underground culture or low fares?
As for Gladwell argument, he wasn't saying that nice looking subways make for less crime, but he was saying that when cops make arrests for such things as vandalism, turnstyle jumping and petty theft, they tend to catch criminals before they can go on to perpetrate a more serious crime. If you bust a guy for jumping a turnstyle when he was on his way to rob someone at gunpoint on the subway, then you've just prevented an armed robbery by focusing on a smaller crime. Quality of Life related arrests go up, armed robbery arrests go down, the subway is safer and eventually nicer looking to boot.
Well...Jake Dobkin is probably over the moon about this, but I agree that tagging the outside of a train is the same as farting inside of the train. it's selfish, it's unpleasant, and it is not in the interest of the common good.
I love graf, and I'm hugely interested by it, but at the same time seeing a car like this run on the MTA is a bad, bad sign. It used to be that trains that had ANY paint on them would not run -- the fact that this one did (and the proliferation of marker/drip tags on the insides of cars) is extremely alarming.
It's clear that the MTA is having problems, but allowing painted cars to run is symptomatic of poor maintenance in general. It's the deferred maintenance of the 70s that led to the hell-hole subways of the 80s. Hopefully it won't happen again.
WHAT THE FUK.
Kojak wrote...
"Impressive. I wouldnt mind a few subway cars in the system spraypainted like that. Its when many different artists put their own tags up at once. It turns ugly."
this is the worst comment ever. Dood is on some, "graffiti should always conform to my pigeonholed tastes of what i deem appropriate and lovely" type $hit. That is the opposite of what graff is about. Everything graff is based around is "artists put their own tags up". Go back to school ass neck.
What does the Homeland Security Department have to say about this?
-Keith
long live graf! this and every city needs more public art, more color and vibrancy, more proof of the free creativity of ordinary people!
Hey D:
"If you bust a guy for jumping a turnstyle (sic) when he was on his way to rob someone at gunpoint on the subway, then you've just prevented an armed robbery by focusing on a smaller crime."
Give us all a break. Not everyone who jumps a turnstile is a criminal or a 'meance to society'. I jumped my fair share of turnstiles back in the day and otherwise. When I was a teen and lost a token. Or it was late at night and the rare train was coming into the station.
The concept that arresting someone for 'petty' crimes results in a lowering of 'serious' crimes is an asinine conservative mindset. Kind of in line with the concept of 'trickle down economics'. It massages the ego of people who intellectualize ad infinitum, but it ultimately falls flat when used in the real world.
If Gladwell's conceit is correct, then please explain the high levels of jay walking and tons of crap on the street. Not to mention the overflowing garbage cans on virtually every corner. And the fact that while stuff like this exists, this city is safer. By Gladwell's argument crime should be through the roof in the midst of all of these petty 'quality of life' issues.
Also in general the comments here are shockingly conservative. It's amazing what's happened to this city in the past 10 years.
I'm not saying that everyone who jumps a turnstile is a major criminal, Jack, nor is Gladwell, nor is the NYPD, nor is anyone who has studied and proven the "Broken Windows" effect and the efficacy of focusing on QOL issues. It's sort of an "all puppies are dogs, but not all dogs are puppies" argument. Not all turnstile jumpers are criminals, but many criminals who jump turnstiles go on to committ other crimes. If you're intent on robbing someone for the $50 they might have in their wallet, you're probably not carrying around a monthly MetroCard.
If you cut off criminal access to the subway at the entry point - turnstiles - then they are less likely to committ crimes on the subway. Only when the cops put more people at the entryways to the stations did crime go down, even though there had been cops riding the subways for years.
"If you cut off criminal access to the subway at the entry point - turnstiles - then they are less likely to committ crimes on the subway."
You're right. Criminals have no capability to purchase a Metrocard or even use the famous bent-card hack.
Criminals = fare-beaters
Good citizen = always pays fares
Good tip!
Jack, as I said, not all turnstile jumpers are criminals, but those who would commit crimes on the subway are probably more likely to do things such as jump a turnstile, even though many crimes do start after all parties involved get on the subway lawfully.
FYI, The NYPD also tries to stop people from using bent MetroCards, and I would imagine they probably nab a few people that way, too.
Obviously you're not going to stop every major subway crime just by stopping guys from beating fares, just as you don't solve drunk driving by enforcing the speed limit. But focusing on QOL crimes is a good start and, along with other tactics, seems to have worked for the NYPD in the 90s.
I didn't say that criminals have no ability to purchase MetroCards, but doesn't it seem reasonable to think that someone who would take the chance and rob someone who might only have say, $50 in cash, credit cards that can be cancelled immediately, and a library card in his wallet would be less concerned than your average Joe Commuter about making sure his MetroCard has a full balance?
But if you want to sum up my position by using equal signs to make it a simple either/or, binary sort of thing, then there's no point in discussing, is there?
"...as I said, not all turnstile jumpers are criminals..."
Oh, but you basically imply that. I'd love to see the profile of jaywalkers in this city.
"...but those who would commit crimes on the subway are probably more likely to do things such as jump a turnstile..."
And.
"I didn't say that criminals have no ability to purchase MetroCards, but doesn't it seem reasonable to think that someone who would take the chance and rob someone who might only have say, $50 in cash, credit cards that can be cancelled immediately, and a library card in his wallet would be less concerned than your average Joe Commuter about making sure his MetroCard has a full balance?"
One again, you're existing in the world of the intellectual prejudice of behavior based on petty incidents. The black and white conceit comes from your own writing and unending desire to push Gladwell's conceit as dogma.
Laughable conceit based in a highly conservative mindset. It's as simple as that.
By that logic, the graffiti artists who went up on the train in this post are potential gang-bangers and murderers.
I hope Malcolm Gladwell has a blog with a comment feature or will set one up. Because the posts would be as hillarious as this.
Jack and D: if cops arrest fare jumpers they typically run your ID to see if there are any outstanding warrants. so isn't it a good way for cops to pick up people who might be jumping bail or wanted on a gun charge? if they run your background and there's nothing on it they fine you fifty bucks or whatever the fine is and send you on your way. but if they run your background and find that you're wanted for robbery, they just found a really easy way to stop you from doing something else and haul you off to jail. the people who are otherwise law abiding citizens pay the fine and probably will think twice about jumping and the people who actually are dangerous don't ride the subway if they get caught.
jaywalking seems like it doesn't compare. if i cross the street when there are no cars no one is really hurt and everyone is free to do it and it hardly hurts the city if most people jaywalk safely like regular new yorkers. but not paying to get on the subway would kill the system if EVERYONE tried to do it. then there would be no money for the system. guess the analogy only works if you had to pay to cross the street.
Tien,
that's not a "throw-up," it's a "burner"
Jules, your argument makes sense in bizarro police state world. If you think the concept of invading one's privacy has meaning if you evade a $2 fare. If you're okay with that, you might be into getting people tattooed with UPC codes or RFID tags. And if you're intention is to rob someone or commit a crime, use the Metrocard and just walk on by and give a polite wink and nod to the transit cops.