Gothamist: Forget UnPC, This is Just Stupid: Lotus' New Cafe

Jason

Thu, 06 Nov 2003 00:26:03 -0500

I was just doing a search on this phrase and found this web site. Please follow this link if you wish to be informed http://www.m-w.com/wftw/02aug/082002.htm

Jen

Fri, 12 Sep 2003 17:03:09 -0500

I accept Suzie Wong the film as a part of Asian-American history, but to resurrect it a dumb way like this, well, it's lazy in my mind. If it were truly trying to subvert things, then maybe I'd have a different opinion.

fusskins

Fri, 12 Sep 2003 15:02:12 -0500

I am torn on this one because I can remember watching "The World of Suzie Wong" several times as a young girl and loving it. And thinking Nancy Kwan was so beautiful. That being said, I can certainly understand how some people might be upset about it, in which case I believe the owners can come up with a different name to attempt to obscure their obvious Asian fetishism. But I am of the "call a spade a spade" school (Don't worry. I'm black so I can say that!) so for them to change the name at this point would seem disingenous to me. For the record, I also love "Gone With the Wind" and all those movie from the 50s with white actresses (Ava Gardner, the Weitz bros. mom) playing Black women who were passing. I guess I am too jaded (pun not intended) to care.

RIO

Fri, 12 Sep 2003 11:33:08 -0500

Shock and Awe: Jake has nothing to say on "this" one (see Tupac impersonator post). Figures.

Justin Case Etymological Correspondent

Fri, 12 Sep 2003 11:28:40 -0500

onwisc92, according to Merriam-Webster, the phrase "call a spade a spade" dates back to the ancient Greeks. This would significantly predate the use of "spade" as a derogatory. That use is of modern origin and of course refers to the black suit of spades in a deck of cards, as in "black as the ace of spades". However, since some people assume it to have a racist origin, caution is urged when using the phrase. Fortunately for us, Gothamist readers are more intelligent and sensitive than the burbling masses (not to mention better looking) and so will have no problem discerning the intent of our usage here.

Brian

Fri, 12 Sep 2003 10:37:07 -0500

But I guess all the white-trash/trailer park themed restaurants out there are okay.

Jen

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 19:09:05 -0500

Okay, onwisc92, how is "If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck...it's a duck."

zod

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 18:40:30 -0500

Funny, there's a Suzie Wong's in Beijing, too, decorated with Chinoiserie, rose petals in water-filled bathtubs, and posters from that film.

andrew

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 18:33:01 -0500

it's usually "campy" and you are too "sensitive" and, the biggest crime, "P.C." to a lot of people if it doesn't involve something about their country, ethnicity, gender, haircut, choice of hat... if it is, THEN it's gone to far!

onwisc92

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 17:51:14 -0500

btw... the phrase calling a spade a spade is actually a racist phrase... it apparently means call a black person a black person... i once used it in the company of some friends who happen to be black and they informed me that spade is an old deragatory name for black people... who knew... though all in all i agree with gothamist on this one...

RIO

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 17:36:31 -0500

Okay Jake, step up to bat, please tell us why this is okay because it's entertainment.

gerrard

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 17:21:35 -0500

Not to veer off topic, but it really seems like asians are the only minority that it's still OK to make fun of in pop culture. I've seen tons of black comedians doing buck teeth asian characters and getting huge laughs, while a similar characterization of black people would have the same audiences up in arms. Ugh, people suck.

melissa

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 16:24:15 -0500

Oh, yeah...Sporting egative stereotypes as "hip" pop culture. Yuck. It drives me really crazy that there are certain ethnicities/backgrounds/personal characteristics that people are trained never to make fund of, and others that the mainstream seems to have deemed okay, even "charming" to demean. I'm sorry, but even a cute, "harmless" little logo on a piece of clothing can teach your kid it's okay to objectify a culture they know nothing about. My husband's parents are from the Philippines, and before my oh-so-white self became part of this wonderfully ethnic family, I was blissfully ignorant to such things. My own family was crazy, I guess: they taught me that everyone should be looked at as an individual. Oh wait - except people that act stupid. It's okay to mock and discriminate against intentional stupidity...

Ruidh

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 16:11:46 -0500

But, eli, there are "good" stereotypes and "bad" stereotypes. Re the kid: Don't get me started.

another Jen

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 15:19:21 -0500

Sing it Sister! I'm sure they'll say they mean it in an *ironic* way . . . and we just don't get it. but i agree, they are just stupid. how about "arrogant white fakes" as the name for the bar, at least you'd know what you'll find there.

eli

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 14:53:59 -0500

Haha and people got pissed at me for pointing out the Mystical Asian Man stereotype in the Murakami thread. Ruidh, Cute kid.

Ruidh

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 14:44:49 -0500

Wasn't there a Suzy Wong line of clothing at some Mid-town store earlier this year. Or, perhaps I'm misremembering and it was a Vietnamese character. As the father of a Chinese-American girl, I'm also concerned at how these "fun" images are going to effect how people will view my daughter.

Jen

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 14:05:29 -0500

I think I might have less of a problem with a them if they called it "Asian Hooker-with-a-heart-of-gold Cafe" - call a spade a spade, and don't hide behind pop culture. Justin pointed out that maybe there should be a "Pretty Woman" Cafe. How about "Mammy's"? Or "Shylock's"? God, I really hate people sometimes.

Felix

Thu, 11 Sep 2003 14:02:04 -0500

Good for you, Jen, I couldn't agree more. A cafe named after Suzie Wong in a club called Lotus? No, I don't see a lot of irony there. I see a direct appeal to the traders on expense accounts who account for substantially all of Lotus's profits -- the kind of people who might well otherwise take their business to a topless bar. Guarantee you there won't be any sassy waitresses with attitude here. When I see you next, remind me to tell you my Suzie Wong story...